cunninlynguist

Well said. Can we get a breakdown of the estimated loan debt for each program? Ultimately, Fletcher and SIPA are peer schools. Tufts and Medford -- and Boston in general -- won't leave you lacking in terms of the "soft" factors. IMO, a professional degree is an investment and every major component of your decision-making process should be based on curriculum, skills, network, and cost. "Softer" factors come into play for all us to varying degrees, but are best considered secondarily (e.g. location and institutional prestige).

For those of you mulling over the potential TA positions for your second year, the finances still seem (to me, at least) dubious. Best-case scenario, if you didn't get funding in the first year (which seems typical) and land a two-semester TA spot for 40K, the COA is still around 100K. I didn't apply to SIPA so this isn't something I'm personally grappling with, but I'm just curious on how heavy a loan burden is what you guys determine as your threshold.

For global policy (and in general), Sanford is the strongest program. However, you are very reasonable to grapple with the costs compared to the other programs. Do you have any debt from undergrad? The "best" way to make money with a policy degree is the private sector, but you won't be eligible for the federal loan repayment options such as PSLF. Global policy is scattered through many employers, though, so you could end up at a non-profit or the government. Still, no matter what your employment options might be, the least amount of debt is always preferable. I'd probably take Minnesota's offer solely because of the magnitude of the money difference. If not, go for Duke as the best school.

Not that it needs to be said, but those markets are competitive for everyone and especially if you're looking for a paid opportunity. Keep things simple in terms of format (1 page resume, for example) and specific in terms of what you can bring to the table and why you're interested in each position. Mention the programs you've been admitted to and situate your academic goals within your career path. Given that it's April, though, I don't know how many internships are still accepting applications. You may hear back from someone soon on an application you submitted previously, but if not, that sort of wraps it up.

What's your area of interest (e.g. specialization)? Is the Minnesota free ride tuition-only -- would you have to pay living expenses?

Is there a scenario that could typify the gap between an ideal offer and one based mainly on university's name better than this? You did unbelievably well with the Fordham acceptance -- there is no contest here. Enjoy your time at Fordham!

I've spoken with someone who is established in the field (and did a dual degree at a peer institution) about the same thing. He's worked on the west coast, at two of the big name organizations, and said the Nicholas School has a great reputation everywhere; he also had a co-worker who was an alum of the program.

This is the only appropriate response in this thread. Your goals, as stated, are quite broad. Harvard GSE is intended for students who are, or are planning to be, immersed in the education field with absolute certainty. If you want to leave the door open for international development work and a PhD, the degree at LSE is a superior option.

A few months ago, I read in the NYT that approximately 2 million borrowers had applied for IBR, and 1.3 million had qualified. So, while it's never 100% certain the federal government won't pull the rug out from under us, it's been established that many Americans need IBR. To me, IBR + PSLF sounds like a sweet ass deal. 10 years of government and non-profit work? Cool. Plenty of time for the private sector afterward!

Would also be curious about the funding packages you received. Total cost of attendance at SIPA would be $140K, whereas Nicholas is $100K. Equal scholarships will not mean equal costs and loans. In some ways, our interests are close. At Duke, you can also take international development classes at the Sanford School of Public Policy. I've heard nothing but praise for the rigor of the Nicholas curriculum and the choices afforded for course selection through Duke's other schools -- there's an option for everything (e.g. intermediate science, advanced science, engineering, environmental law, environmental policy, public policy, GIS, data analysis, statistics, economics, and so on). What's your background? Any inclination on which curriculum appeals to you best? Appraising the strength of each school's alumni network isn't going to be a precise measure, but I haven't heard anything of concern regarding either.

Not sure it's so simple. One major element of employability will be the marketable skills and experiences you acquire in the program. If the degree ends up as a collection of classes with no substantive, real-world applicability, your employment prospects will suffer. However, if you land a good internship, participate in research, establish a strong network, connect with alumni, are involved in other professional activities, etc. you can sell yourself a lot better. I agree generally, though -- the degree itself won't be a substitute for relevant experience. (Nor will experience always substitute for an advanced degree. If it's required for a position, you will be competing against other people with the necessary education).

That's fantastic -- well done!

Agreed, especially about Boston. (I downvoted your first post due to Drake... sorry). In general, even if the rationale seems strong (e.g. interest rates more favorable), using loans to pay off loans is a backwards proposition. Student loans create a more harrowing situation.

Off you go to Fletcher! Seriously. What's the difference in cost between Fletcher and the other two programs, all of which are virtually equal in rigor and reputation? 50K? You wouldn't drop that much money for a year spent in a geographical location normally, I assume, and Fletcher will be an excellent experience anyway. BTW, I implore those of you considering the 100K+ programs to figure out what loans would comprise the financial aid you receive. If you stay within the 50-75K range, it should be all federal loans (i.e. eligible for IBR, PAYE, PSLF, and much more preferable to private if you go through hard times). If you attend an expensive program with little to no funding, you'll be in private loan territory to finish up the remainder; so, in addition to the actual debt, it'll be more of a hassle to deal with.

Magoosh for verbal, Manhattan for quant. The Magoosh videos are more helpful for verbal because they don't fixate on arcane vocabulary words, but rather the types of questions and the approaches you should identify in solving them. Manhattan's guides, however, were a far better tool for quant; I wish I had used them sooner.

Previous Schools (Name, type, or tier): Public University, Northeast, Regional Tier Previous Degrees and GPAs: B.A. in Political Science, 3.4 w/ strong upward trend GRE Scores (Verbal/Quantitative/Analytical Writing): 166 / 162 / 5.0 Previous Work Experience (Years, Type): ~1 year total in relevant positions and internships Math/Econ Background: Statistics, Microeconomics, Macroeconomics, upper-level quantitative Poli Sci courses Foreign Language Background (if applicable to your program): Intermediate French Intended Field of Study in Grad School: MEM Long Term Professional Goals: Environmental consulting and policy analysis, with the eventual goal to counsel companies and governments of developing nations during energy resource booms. Schools Applied to & Results: Duke Nicholas (Accepted), Yale F&ES (Rejected) Ultimate Decision & Why: The Nicholas School at Duke. I only applied to two schools—the best environmental programs—and F&ES heavily emphasizes work experience. All of the reputable MPP/MPA programs with environmental concentrations don't offer enough specialized knowledge. Got into Duke and Michigan SNRE last year, but decided to decline and improve my credentials. Paid off, literally, in the form of a much higher funding package from Nicholas. Advice for Future Applicants: Don't underestimate the numeric components of your application where funding is concerned. As most of us can attest to, there are two phases of the application process: 1) waiting for decisions and simply hoping for acceptances; 2) grappling with the financial realities of acceptances and wondering what you could've done differently for more money. Get the strongest recommendations in terms of content, not by referee position or title. Supervisors and professors who litter the letter with meaningful anecdotes and actual insight can help mitigate lesser qualities (in my case, a bad GPA). If a program explicitly states work experience is a big factor, don't assume you're special and a strong personal statement will override their preference. Before you apply, give yourself enough time to plan what curriculum and academic opportunities are possible at each school; don't apply without knowing what you'll be getting in the most tangible sense, as it will be a significant investment of money and time.

Of course. It was just emblematic of the prevailing consensus that's been passed around here lately: why are you thinking of a policy degree? JDs are not a qualitatively better investment. Talk to people in the field or actually in law school and you will realize that, even as theoretical advice, it's not a strong argument. Further, policy degrees don't preclude you from making good money. There are plenty of opportunities in the private sector for those with advanced policy degrees. It's not top-tier management consulting or bust.

Thank you. What the hell happened to this place (Govt. Affairs)? Seems that so many misguided people perceive an MBA or JD as the magic bullet. This is even more dangerous when the people dispensing this advice don't know the true conditions of the job markets in those fields. Conversely, policy degrees are useful... for people who actually know where their career is headed. An MBA or JD without the genuine interest or desire to work in a capacity directly applicable to what the degree will confer is a reckless choice. I also don't think federal loans are the end of the world. If you are crawling to Sallie Mae to finance a 100K+ education and only want to work in the public sector, your decision isn't the most prudent. However, if you're selecting a rigorous program and need federal loans to pay for 60-70K, it's been done time and time again by students before you. You shouldn't count on IBR or PSLF, but they're around, and it may alleviate some of the financial pressure. So, basically: this isn't a forum for those with goals of MBB and BigLaw. Take it somewhere else, please.

AdInfinitum: While FES is the more malleable program overall, there is plenty of flexibility through Nicholas. I took some notes during an admissions chat, and the staff mentioned a few things: Even if you are in one concentration, you can take courses in other concentration areas, and much of what you do, in classes, outside of classes, in internships, in your Master's project, and in other experiences, help you to "customize" your study quite a bit. ... It is common for students to take classes that are comprised of students from varying program areas of study. You can also take classes outside of the Nicholas School, as well--e.g., you can take classes in business, or law, or public policy, in the schools on campus as well...so you can use that to customize. Free electives are open and available for students to take graduate level courses in their area of interest. ... You are allowed to take as many elective courses outside the Nicholas School as you like. For my interests, the Sanford School and Law School will likely be where I select the vast majority of my electives. All told, it'll probably be a 60-40 split between Nicholas and the other schools at Duke, so the curriculum is what you make of it. FES has always been known as highly "free" in the sense that you can construct whatever path you want. Nicholas also offers certificates and things like the Environmental Policy and Law Clinic open to only Nicholas and Law School students.

I haven't officially committed yet, but my decision hinges on the strengths and resources of the Nicholas School -- I assume your program is at Sanford? Nonetheless, I've been impressed by everything, ranging from academic offerings to integration with the Law School (Env. Law and Policy Clinic) and Sanford (Intl. Development Policy certificate), and career services. I'm wary of the cost, but it appears to be worth it. Sanford seems to be excellent (I considered applying, but there isn't the same flexibility within the curriculum). What are your main concerns? The one thing I've noticed is that, unlike Nicholas and most other programs, there's no readily available employment data. I'm sure the Sanford students do fine, but it's always good to know what you can expect after graduating.

Healthy discussion so far. In my case, I'm heading to Duke for an MEM (if you're not familiar, it's basically an environmental MPP). In addition to the debt you may accumulate, try simply typing out what you'll get for your money. Is it literally just the degree (e.g. some coursework and not much else)? How many resources does the program have that can enhance your career prospects, marketability, and network? I'm quite pleased with how my money will be spent (roughly 65-70K after a decent funding package), as I'll be able to make it go a long way -- but that isn't the case for every program. Further, your starting salary isn't going to be your permanent salary. If you chose to work in the public sector, PSLF and IBR might be plausible. It's hard to recommend them with absolute certainty given the machinations of the government, but it's in effect now and hopefully will remain so. vincehoward: MPPs and similar degrees are still professional degrees. JDs don't confer an automatic ability to practice law, the bar exam does. And I'm sure you know the state of the legal market and the insane costs of law school. MDs are a much larger investment than our degree choices and a wholly different field. I also wouldn't put the MBA on a pedestal, either: there's been plenty of discussion regarding the utility of it and, frankly, MBAs are running around everywhere.

Interesting read, if a bit slanted. One of the HBS/HKS students interviewed clearly shows her disdain for the Kennedy School, but if you look her up on LinkedIn, all of her work experience is in the private sector. Perhaps HKS is not entirely culplable when students decide to enroll there without a genuine interest in public service. She didn't do her research beforehand and blamed the school; based on a cursory look at her employment history, she wasn't a good fit for HKS. However, the points you've been making all along are also mentioned in the article. Public sector jobs aren't usually "prestigious" and don't usually require a "prestigious degree" to advance and find a fulfilling position. So, in spite of the high cost, low financial support, and legitimate issues regarding the rigor of the program, why is HKS so popular? And that's when the allure of the Harvard name comes into the equation. It's scary to think of dropping six-figure debt on mostly a name and possible networking for a public service career. A lot of these discussions are still anecdotal, as was the prevailing tone of the article. Framing the usefulness of HKS in the view of how often a random HBS student "thinks about" reads like high school journalism.

Sorry to both of you. It's a relief to finally know, especially after a long day of waiting. I only applied to two schools and will be very happily attending the Nicholas School at Duke in the fall.

Didn't get an e-mail, but logged in. Rejected. I assume yours will have been updated as well.

Getting late... but the blog and admissions distinctly said this would be the final day of decisions. Let's hope!