Emotions Regarding Rejection(s)

[sleepycat]

gah guys you are making it sound that I will never get into graduate school, although Berkeley and the top 20 aren't where I am supposed to be so I wonder if it is any different at lower level schools or if it is applicable to Anthropology since I am switching disciplines.

[Soc231160]

I think that fit is VERY important and it is the best thing you can do for your application is make everything fit with the department's strenghts! However, I must say that I do think that GRE scores are one of the most important factors in admissions. I know admissions committees will say they are not that important BUT even if the scores are not important to the department or the committee they are important to the college of arts and sciences and to the stats for the program. The higher administration has the funding and they do not want adcoms admitting students without amazing GRE Scores. They hold the money and they want the rankings to say that all of their grad students have this average and it gives them more prestige.

I was told that having 2 peer reviewed publications and several presentations at conferences will demonstrate that I am a capable researcher and a good candidate for a docatoral program. While this is true, if I do not have the GRE scores to make the higher up admins happy I do not have a shot at most programs.

[splitends]

So231160, I'm sure you're right, given a certain definition of what is a good and what is a bad score. There's a difference between saying you need to have a certain minimum score to pass muster with Grad School admins and saying that it's an important factor for a committee. School administrators may want you to have a relatively competitive GRE score, say in the 70%ile (I don't know what the cutoff actually would be, or how much it would vary from school to school-- I just grabbed a competitive but not super duper competitive number out of the air), before looking at your application. But once it's been sent to a committee of Professors and grad students, and its being compared to all the other applications that also passed muster with the admins, how much does it matter if you got into the 70%ile or the 80%ile or the 90%ile? Totally depends on what else is going on in your application, who you're being compared to, and the personal inclinations of the people comparing you.

Brief GRE anecdote from a grad student in my department: He was an international student who did really well on the verbal section but completely bombed the quantitative one (sound like any SOC majors you know?). He was going to retake the test, but an advisor told him not to. The reasoning was: as an international student (from a country where people aren't typically fluent in English) he was expected to do badly on the verbal section and well in math. The fact that it was so extremely inverted would make it look like a fluke, and the committee would discount the score. I don't know that that's the actual logic that got used, but, hey, he got in....

Anyway, the same could be said about GPA. If you don't have at least a 3.0, virtually nobody will look at your application. But in a pool of people who all meet that basic criteria, how much does it matter if you have a 3.4 or a 3.6? Wil it make a difference if the 3.4 was from a traditionally more challenging major or notoriously non-grade inflating school? Some professors will consider that, others won't.

At the end of the day, I don't think it's great logic to say "the ONE thing that REALLY matters is...." You never know who will be reading your application. The best you can do is to try to be as competitive as possible on as many metrics as you can. Play up the strengths you do have, and if you don't get in and this is really what you want to do, improve where you can (and of course, the one nice thing about the GRE is that it is much easier to improve your numbers there relatively quickly than to improve your GPA, which isn't going to budge much after a certain point) and try again the next cycle.

[splitends]

Also, here's a good discussion (from real live sociology professors!) that sort of speaks to my point about different professors caring about different things: http://orgtheory.wordpress.com/2012/01/30/sociology-and-management-phd-program-admissions-comments-and-open-thread/#comments

[kikiD]

I'm glad I finally mustered the courage to read this thread (for weeks I've been avoiding it, trying not to believe that I was likely going to be rejected from schools where I was sure I would get in). I'm glad I've read it now, because it's made me feel a lot better! I am 3 years out of UG and have had a rocky road employment-wise in that time. As an undergrad I knew I wanted to eventually be a sociologist, but I felt unready to enter a PhD program because I wasn't sure of my interests and felt it would be foolish to take the plunge immediately. I opted to work for a few years to gain some clarity (big mistake - this was 2009 - I really don't know what I was thinking when I decided, "oh, I'll just get a JOB!")

Anyway, about a year ago, after being laid off, I realized that I was ready and it was time to focus on my applications. And because of high grades and GRE scores, experience as an RA and TA and excited support from former professors (and my UG institution is a top-20 soc program) I felt very confident. One of my LOR-writers, who is very distinguished, actually said to me, "I think you'll get in almost everywhere you're applying."

Fast forward to now, after I applied to 9 carefully-selected schools (4 top-10, 3 ranked 10-20, 1 ranked in 30s and 1 "safety" ranked in the 50s), I have been accepted only to the "safety," which I applied to on a whim. I still have not heard from 5 schools, but I know all of them have accepted people and so I'm just waiting for the rejections (and hoping for a waitlist). Needless to say that last few weeks have been an emotional rollercoaster, as I know many of you can understand!

I'm curious what everyone's take is on admissions this year vs. potential future admissions cycles. Granted, this was my first try, but the pure numbers of people applying this year seem astronomical. Do you think this will continue, and graduate school will just get harder and harder to get into? (This is related to my inner question of: should I just take this acceptance and run with it, or try again next year because my supporters -- and I -- think I could do better?)

This post turned out to be much longer than I expected...sorry about that! I'm not a big poster on this forum (or on the internet in general) but I felt such relief after reading through this thread that I felt inclined to respond!

[MakeSetBsy]

Also, here's a good discussion (from real live sociology professors!) that sort of speaks to my point about different professors caring about different things: http://orgtheory.wor...hread/#comments

Thanks for this link

[Karlito]

kikiD I hear you. If you have the financial resources to wait until the next application cycle, I would advise you to wait and work more on your apps for the next cycle, after having deeply reflected with your mentors on what parts of your applications were not good enough. You probably won't be happy in a lower ranked program if you had high expectations. Retake the GRE, accumulate research experience (sometimes it is easy - just do tons of interviews and pull a qual paper out of this on a topic of your choice in line with your interests and the interests of the departments you like). Anyway, this all applies if you get rejected everywhere, which is not the case yet. Do not desperate...I was in the same situation as you and was pondering about what to do...until I got accepted into a top program 2 days ago. I wish you luck.

[kikiD]

Thanks, @Karlito. I received two more rejections today, one of which particularly hurt. I have one more school to hear from, but right now it looks like I'm faced with the "50ish school or bust" dilemma that I mentioned. My plan is to collect all the info I can about the program I have been admitted to, and if I'm not absolutely confident in it, then I am going to go back to my mentors and come up with a new plan for next year.

[sociologyplease]

As much as I hate being rejected from four programs in the last 24 hours, I am at least grateful they are finally sending these rejections so I can focus on my acceptance!