pete-mc Posted February 18, 2013 Author Share Posted February 18, 2013 To prevent students to use HKS as a backdoor to HBS, they dont allow HKS student to apply after they get admitted. It has to be done simultaneously. Can you please state where you read this info? Let's say I get admitted to HKS's MC/MPA (1-yr program), and I decide to apply also to HBS either prior to or after enrolling at HKS. Why would I be not allowed to do so? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete-mc Posted February 18, 2013 Author Share Posted February 18, 2013 I think the entire comparison is silly. He claims the caliber of HLS/HBS students is ridiculously higher, but the caliber of a PhD student in theoretical physics would also be ridiculously higher compared to HLS/HBS students. You can't reach a meaningful comparison between these schools because they seek to measure and create different things. The idea that even a Harvard undergrad would "make fun" of an HKS student, especially mid-career students who have vastly more impressive profiles and life experiences, is frankly laughable. I'm positive HLS/HBS are harder in terms of coursework, but people in those programs are required to have a more competitive mindset that prepares them for a linear, conventional career path. I think people often make the comparison with HKS because HLS/HBS students can get the same kind of jobs as a graduate of HKS, but not vice versa. But that's precisely the point: HKS prepares fewer people for a more narrow career path in a field that still has a large pool of jobs, and so it's naturally less competitive. HBS/HLS are more easily marketed for practically anything. And yet, the dividends paid from HKS/HBS/HLS in a public service context are roughly the same, so why not take the path of least resistance? One of the political officers during my State Dept. internship switched careers but was a graduate of HLS, and his boss (the Deputy Chief of Mission) graduated from a state school and god a mid-career masters. These labels--and the ridiculous comparisons being made here--matter less the further you get into your career. And for some public service career paths, they are ridiculous to begin with. Harvard alumni attest themselves that their degree only helps with the 1st job after graduation. What matters from there onwards is your performance and ability to network. I know top HBS/HLS/HKS graduates who did not at all end up with dream careers upon graduation because they simply don't have a CEO personality. But if you look at companies like GE, the kind of guys who make it to SVP level etc, are mainly people from state schools because they are the leader types. HBS says itself, they don't develop leaders, they train leaders / enhance their skills. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete-mc Posted February 18, 2013 Author Share Posted February 18, 2013 I don't think decision are released until March. Hi, would you mind sharing with us your profile / background info with regards to your HKS application? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete-mc Posted February 18, 2013 Author Share Posted February 18, 2013 Does anybody have any idea about what is going on in the admissions office recently? I am going nuts because of this waiting... Last time I checked on the admission blog is that decisions will be communicated sometime in March. Would you mind sharing with us your profile / background info with regards to your HKS application? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yhakak Posted February 18, 2013 Share Posted February 18, 2013 ? One of the political officers during my State Dept. internship switched careers but was a graduate of HLS, and his boss (the Deputy Chief of Mission) graduated from a state school and god a mid-career masters. These labels--and the ridiculous comparisons being made here--matter less the further you get into your career. And for some public service career paths, they are ridiculous to begin with. I concur completely...i'm applying for MC/MPA and i can attest that my coworkers come from all sorts of backgrounds and there doesn't seem to be a strong connection between where they went to school and how successful they are... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete-mc Posted February 18, 2013 Author Share Posted February 18, 2013 I concur completely...i'm applying for MC/MPA and i can attest that my coworkers come from all sorts of backgrounds and there doesn't seem to be a strong connection between where they went to school and how successful they are... Hi, would you mind sharing with us your profile / background info with regards to your HKS application? I'm also a MC/MPA applicant. Did you apply through Mason? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yhakak Posted February 18, 2013 Share Posted February 18, 2013 Hi, would you mind sharing with us your profile / background info with regards to your HKS application? I'm also a MC/MPA applicant. Did you apply through Mason? sure.. not applying through Mason (not experienced enough)...i have about 10 years of work experience (of these 8 in the public sector)...i'm applying through a fellowship program in my home country, so getting in would only be the first step, need to get the funding otherwise i can't go. As for stats: BA in economics from a US ivy league school (GPA about 3.25, a solid B+) MBA in finance from a leading local university (GPA 90/100) finishing up an MA in sociology from another well-regarded local university (GPA 95/100, but still gotta wrap up and hand in my thesis :-)) in terms of work, for the last 8 years i've been with the economic policy unit of a regulatory agency. Did the GRE 10 years ago, so not really relevant anymore, but at the time it was on the 800 point scale - 710 verbal, 780 math. 6 on the writing. how about you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vincehoward Posted February 18, 2013 Share Posted February 18, 2013 sure.. not applying through Mason (not experienced enough)...i have about 10 years of work experience (of these 8 in the public sector)...i'm applying through a fellowship program in my home country, so getting in would only be the first step, need to get the funding otherwise i can't go. As for stats: BA in economics from a US ivy league school (GPA about 3.25, a solid B+) MBA in finance from a leading local university (GPA 90/100) finishing up an MA in sociology from another well-regarded local university (GPA 95/100, but still gotta wrap up and hand in my thesis :-)) in terms of work, for the last 8 years i've been with the economic policy unit of a regulatory agency. Did the GRE 10 years ago, so not really relevant anymore, but at the time it was on the 800 point scale - 710 verbal, 780 math. 6 on the writing. how about you? Wow, that's a lot of degrees. What's the value add of another diploma? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
plenum123 Posted February 19, 2013 Share Posted February 19, 2013 (edited) Can you please state where you read this info? Let's say I get admitted to HKS's MC/MPA (1-yr program), and I decide to apply also to HBS either prior to or after enrolling at HKS. Why would I be not allowed to do so? I attended HKS admission session in NYC months ago, the HKS rep. stated that you need to apply both school in the same application cycle and get accepted at both school to pursue dual degree (3 years) HKS/HBS. You can finish HKS and then apply but you are not allowed to apply during academic year in hoping to do the joint program. And that would be 4 total years to complete both degrees. Edited February 19, 2013 by plenum123 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yhakak Posted February 19, 2013 Share Posted February 19, 2013 Wow, that's a lot of degrees. What's the value add of another diploma? Well, as i said i'm applying through a fellowship program so that changes the considerations quite a bit, my employer will give me study leave to do the program...it's less a career development thing and more a function of the fact that i think that doing the program will really help my work, i hope to do some interesting research if i get accepted... also, as you've probably figured out, i'm a "lifelong learner" type, i try to always be studying something, because just working is really boring...one of the nicer things about being in the public sector is the flexibility, i can go to class or to TA my section and make up the hours later, that sort of thing... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete-mc Posted February 19, 2013 Author Share Posted February 19, 2013 (edited) I attended HKS admission session in NYC months ago, the HKS rep. stated that you need to apply both school in the same application cycle and get accepted at both school to pursue dual degree (3 years) HKS/HBS. You can finish HKS and then apply but you are not allowed to apply during academic year in hoping to do the joint program. And that would be 4 total years to complete both degrees. I can understand that a little bit. But it still does not make a lot of sense. It says on the MIT website, for example, that you can apply to the MPA program at HKS after enrolling in the 1st year of MIT MBA and if you get accepted at HKS you can pursue the joint degree in the 3 years. Same goes for HKS and other MBA or JD programs (see HKS website). Why would Harvard discriminate against applicants to their own graduate school if they accept other graduate school applications after enrolling at HKS? And what if someone discovers after enrolling at HBS or HKS that they actually would like to pursue the joint degree? It just does not seem to make sense to me that someone would be restricted by a school to pursue additional studies once they are academically fit and eligible to do so. Edited February 19, 2013 by John (Mid-Career) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vincehoward Posted February 19, 2013 Share Posted February 19, 2013 I can understand that a little bit. But it still does not make a lot of sense. It says on the MIT website, for example, that you can apply to the MPA program at HKS after enrolling in the 1st year of MIT MBA and if you get accepted at HKS you can pursue the joint degree in the 3 years. Same goes for HKS and other MBA or JD programs (see HKS website). Why would Harvard discriminate against applicants to their own graduate school if they accept other graduate school applications after enrolling at HKS? And what if someone discovers after enrolling at HBS or HKS that they actually would like to pursue the joint degree? It just does not seem to make sense to me that someone would be restricted by a school to pursue additional studies once they are academically fit and eligible to do so. They did it because a sizable percentage of the class at HKS were trying to "backdoor" into HBS by applying during the first year. HBS wanted to cut down the number of applicants from HKS, and HKS wanted to discourage people who were only looking to attend Kennedy School as a backdoor to HBS from applying. Now in order to get the joint degree you have to meet the admissions standards for both schools at the same time. Makes sense to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soaps Posted February 19, 2013 Share Posted February 19, 2013 They did it because a sizable percentage of the class at HKS were trying to "backdoor" into HBS by applying during the first year. HBS wanted to cut down the number of applicants from HKS, and HKS wanted to discourage people who were only looking to attend Kennedy School as a backdoor to HBS from applying. Now in order to get the joint degree you have to meet the admissions standards for both schools at the same time. Makes sense to me. I'm glad for this. Maybe it'll allow more people who are actually interested in HKS and not a "backdoor" to be there this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
plenum123 Posted February 20, 2013 Share Posted February 20, 2013 Roughly 8,000 people apply to HBS each year, they just dont care and it's a student's problem I believe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete-mc Posted March 1, 2013 Author Share Posted March 1, 2013 A friend who also applied told me that HKS decisions will be out in the week of the 15th this month. Good luck everyone! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Revolution Posted March 1, 2013 Share Posted March 1, 2013 Ugh. HKS has such a huge inferiority complex to HBS. Seems like almost everyone at HKS wants to be at HBS. They did it because a sizable percentage of the class at HKS were trying to "backdoor" into HBS by applying during the first year. HBS wanted to cut down the number of applicants from HKS, and HKS wanted to discourage people who were only looking to attend Kennedy School as a backdoor to HBS from applying. Now in order to get the joint degree you have to meet the admissions standards for both schools at the same time. Makes sense to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vincehoward Posted March 1, 2013 Share Posted March 1, 2013 Ugh. HKS has such a huge inferiority complex to HBS. Seems like almost everyone at HKS wants to be at HBS. It can be annoying, especially at Harvard grad school parties. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Revolution Posted March 1, 2013 Share Posted March 1, 2013 Yeah I'm sure. I mean at Harvard the HBS students are the kings of the hill, the alpha males, and the HKS students get no respect at all. Did you apply to HBS and HKS? It can be annoying, especially at Harvard grad school parties. cunninlynguist 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete-mc Posted March 1, 2013 Author Share Posted March 1, 2013 It can be annoying, especially at Harvard grad school parties. Can you describe what you mean with "it can be annoying"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete-mc Posted March 1, 2013 Author Share Posted March 1, 2013 Yeah I'm sure. I mean at Harvard the HBS students are the kings of the hill, the alpha males, and the HKS students get no respect at all. Did you apply to HBS and HKS? May I ask what you are basing your judgment "HKS students get no respect at all" on? Did you study at Harvard? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Revolution Posted March 1, 2013 Share Posted March 1, 2013 Basing it upon talking to a lot of friends who went to harvard, including hbs, hls, hks, and undergrad. There is definitely a hierarchy of sorts at Harvard. The HBS students are revered and envied by everyone. May I ask what you are basing your judgment "HKS students get no respect at all" on? Did you study at Harvard? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete-mc Posted March 1, 2013 Author Share Posted March 1, 2013 (edited) Basing it upon talking to a lot of friends who went to harvard, including hbs, hls, hks, and undergrad. There is definitely a hierarchy of sorts at Harvard. The HBS students are revered and envied by everyone. Just out of curiosity, if you had to rank the schools against each other by your described criteria, what would the internal hierarchy look like? Edited March 1, 2013 by Public Policy Expert Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kadisha Posted March 1, 2013 Share Posted March 1, 2013 Basing it upon talking to a lot of friends who went to harvard, including hbs, hls, hks, and undergrad. There is definitely a hierarchy of sorts at Harvard. The HBS students are revered and envied by everyone. Talk about not being grateful for what you have. Typical spoiled rich kid mentality in my opinion if we're to go by the stereotypical Harvard attendee. If you apply to HKS (if you're not using the backdoor method to HBS) there is no reason you should be envious of HBS students. Why should you? You're not interested in a business program otherwise you would have applied to HBS. You're interested in government or public service. Maybe the military has made that indifferent to the whining of those that are not grateful for what they have, I don't know. I do know if I do attend HKS, and go to one of those grad parties and some one tries to pull that crap on me I'll politely give him the finger, and that's me being nice. Rugger 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alf10087 Posted March 1, 2013 Share Posted March 1, 2013 Agreed with Kadisha. If you apply to the HKS it is because few programs will provide you with better tools to make a real change in the causes you're committed with. If one is trying to get into Harvard just to be looked up at parties, there is something wrong. Honestly, this discussion seems completely out of order. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Revolution Posted March 1, 2013 Share Posted March 1, 2013 Plenty of people applied to both mba programs and hks, including myself. There are people who are NOT interested in public sector who apply to these programs. I agree that it's bad, but this is the general culture at harvard. Not saying that I like it or condone it but just reporting what my friends have told me and what I have witnessed when I visited my buddies at HBS. Talk about not being grateful for what you have. Typical spoiled rich kid mentality in my opinion if we're to go by the stereotypical Harvard attendee. If you apply to HKS (if you're not using the backdoor method to HBS) there is no reason you should be envious of HBS students. Why should you? You're not interested in a business program otherwise you would have applied to HBS. You're interested in government or public service. Maybe the military has made that indifferent to the whining of those that are not grateful for what they have, I don't know. I do know if I do attend HKS, and go to one of those grad parties and some one tries to pull that crap on me I'll politely give him the finger, and that's me being nice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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