reneegavin Posted June 10, 2014 Share Posted June 10, 2014 Hello everyone, I have always wanted to enter the counseling field. I am currently 39 years old, and have bounced back and forth with the idea, but if time and money were no issue, it would be my dream. My question is...is it worthwhile, especially at my age? I realize I am not ancient, but I may only be able to attend school part time, the schooling is very expensive, and I don't know if I would get past the Bachelors degree. What kind of jobs are out there with only a bachelor's degree? Also, does the end pay allow you to pay back your student loans? I have read on here that several people have completed their degrees online. Can anyone recommend a good one. Thank you so much for any advice you have! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nightwolf1129 Posted June 11, 2014 Share Posted June 11, 2014 My wife has a BSW and she's been working with special needs & autistic children in local school districts for the past few years. I think the main advantage to obtaining a BSW is, if you were to decide to pursue an MSW, you'd qualify for advanced standing and would only have to spend a year in graduate school. From what my wife has told me, BSWs are not easy as field placement is a huge component to the curriculum (e.g., unpaid internships). As for pay at the Bachelor level, you'd probably be looking at anywhere between $25,000 - $35,000 a year depending on the type of job and location. In the field of counseling, licensure is always required to practice and state laws mandate that counselors should have at least a Master's level of education. This is not to say that someone with a BSW may not necessarily be able to work in a counseling-related setting, but the interaction with clients would be limited. I believe there are various youth centers, substance abuse treatment faciliites, etc. that hire those with BSWs & BAs in Psychology, Sociology, etc. I myself work as a Psychology Research Assistant but my particular job is a 2 yr term position. Most of my colleagues use positions such as a Research Assistant as a means to build-up their resume/CV for a graduate school application. I don't think one could necessarily make a living with only a Bachelor's degree in a counseling/research field. Lastly, most of the jobs I've seen that hire those with BSWs are typically non-profit organizations or schools which may not pay as well. If you were able to attend a public university to obtain your BSW to help mitigate the financial burden, that might be your best bet. There are schools throughout the country that offer a combined BSW/MSW degree which is typically a 5 year program and afterwords you'd receive your MSW. If I were in your shoes, I'd look into that to see if it'd be feasible and/or manageable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pdwilks Posted June 11, 2014 Share Posted June 11, 2014 First of all, age is not the issue. Anyone with drive can go to college to start or finish a degree. If you want the degree go for it. I just turned 50 and walk in 3 days for my BA and will be 53 when I walk for my MSW. I actually feel as if my age has worked for me because I see my goals more clearly. My outlook on class and professors is different than it was when I was 18 and just out of HS. I appreciate professors now more than I ever did back in the 80’s. There is also the big factor of money; because I am paying for this myself (or paying it back because of loans) I take my classes and grades seriously. I study more now, enjoy the books or texts more and get out of the class more than I might have 25, 20 or even 15 years ago. I have life experience to bring to the table that the younger students don’t and it helps me to understand or see things differently. On the other hand the younger students help me to see things from their perspective too. As for different online schools, look at your state school where tuition will be cheaper than private schools. An example for me, CSU East Bay $2610.00 a quarter not including books and other fees on the other hand Private schools are $30000.00-50000.00. Public schools may have some grants, but private schools have different funding. As my financial aid person said, “Can’t hurt to try for private and see what they will offer”. Look up your local schools first, see what they have to offer, then look to state schools to see if any are online. Some online schools do have restrictions for who can attend. While my BA degree was not an online degree, I completed one of my minors all online. They are not that bad, however there is A LOT of writing and reading. It felt like more than an on campus class. Also they take a large amount of self-regulation to keep on top of due dates, papers, postings and tests. Falling behind can cause you to lose points and perhaps a grade. As I said in the beginning, age isn’t your issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reneegavin Posted June 11, 2014 Author Share Posted June 11, 2014 Getting a bachelor's in Social Work is the quickest way into counseling, correct? I ulimately want to counsel people with eating disorders, anxiety, family or marriage counseling...wouldn't even mind career counseling. However, I've heard of some tough and even somewhat scary internships that people have had to take in the social work field. Is this usually the case? There is a school that offers the 5 year BSW/MSW, but it is over an hour away, and I simply couldn't do it every day and still maintain a household and see my family. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheCrow Posted June 11, 2014 Share Posted June 11, 2014 You would need an MSW to do third-party-reimbursable clinical counseling (i.e., their insurance company would pay you), which is what you seem to be interested in, as well as at least two years of supervision thereafter. With a BSW, you could do case management, which means you could work with people with the challenges you mentioned, but you would do so on the basis of helping them find and navigate various resources, not in the typical counseling setting. You might have an easier time doing an online bachelor's degree in another field (or by doing your first two years at a community college and then transferring into an online four-year degree at a local public university) and then attending a two-year MSW program. Alternatively, you might see if there are any MSW programs in your state that will allow you to earn an MSW online/distance learning if you already have a job in social services and then try to get one of those jobs while you earn your bachelor's degree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nugget Posted June 11, 2014 Share Posted June 11, 2014 As I heard someone once wisely say, "In 5 years you are going to be 44 years old. That is a certainty. Do you want to be 44 years old without a BSW or 44 years old with a BSW?" TLC and Catlovers141 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nugget Posted June 11, 2014 Share Posted June 11, 2014 Many Canadian schools offer cheaper tuition (international rates) than some state schools (American fees). This may be an option for you. You'd simply need to double check that these schools meet your state's licensing requirements. There are 2 online schools that I'm aware of, in case you're interested. http://umanitoba.ca/faculties/social_work/programs/fort_garry/506.html http://www.uvic.ca/hsd/socialwork/future/bsw/index.php Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reneegavin Posted June 12, 2014 Author Share Posted June 12, 2014 (edited) I know I spoke with someone who has a BSW and said they regret it. They say their job is incredibly stressful. Lots of paperwork to bring home, their hands are tied with what they can do for people. Also, lots of student loans and they don't make much money to pay it back with. Does this seem to be the norm? With the social work degree, do you get put into a lot of sketchy internships? If I were to get a bachelor's degree in something other than social work, it would then take me 2 years to get my MSW and 2 years of supervision as opposed to the 1 year to get a MSW after getting a BSW, right? Am I understanding it correctly? Edited June 12, 2014 by reneegavin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheCrow Posted June 12, 2014 Share Posted June 12, 2014 If I were to get a bachelor's degree in something other than social work, it would then take me 2 years to get my MSW and 2 years of supervision as opposed to the 1 year to get a MSW after getting a BSW, right? Am I misunderstanding it? With a BSW: one year, at MSW schools that offer advanced standing (not all do), followed by two years of supervision (in every state except Georgia, I think) With a non-BSW bachelor's: two years for the MSW followed by two years of supervision One of the main considerations is with careful planning (and maybe CLEP tests) you could finish the bachelor's degree in something else in less than four years and perhaps even mostly online. Unless you're already working in social services, I would plan to attend the MSW full-time (it'll take you longer part-time and not all schools offer that option). In comparison, the BSW will require field placements and will probably be less flexible about online courses etc. Also, a significant component of the MSW is field placements, unlike most other master's degrees. A lot of this has to do with what state you're in and what your local (particularly public) universities happen to offer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TLC Posted June 12, 2014 Share Posted June 12, 2014 I dont have much to add however, I am a huge advocate of CLEP tests. I am glad the TheCrow mentioned them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nugget Posted June 12, 2014 Share Posted June 12, 2014 With an MSW you aren't restricted to counselling and case management. I suspect that this area of social work would have the most cases of burnout. You could also do policy work, create new programs, do research, apply for grants and funding, do community education (like health education - family planning, smoking cessation, etc) and run community programs and work with clients in a group. I know I spoke with someone who has a BSW and said they regret it. They say their job is incredibly stressful. Lots of paperwork to bring home, their hands are tied with what they can do for people. Also, lots of student loans and they don't make much money to pay it back with. Does this seem to be the norm? With the social work degree, do you get put into a lot of sketchy internships? If I were to get a bachelor's degree in something other than social work, it would then take me 2 years to get my MSW and 2 years of supervision as opposed to the 1 year to get a MSW after getting a BSW, right? Am I understanding it correctly? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reneegavin Posted June 12, 2014 Author Share Posted June 12, 2014 One of the main considerations is with careful planning (and maybe CLEP tests) you could finish the bachelor's degree in something else in less than four years and perhaps even mostly online. Unless you're already working in social services, I would plan to attend the MSW full-time (it'll take you longer part-time and not all schools offer that option). In comparison, the BSW will require field placements and will probably be less flexible about online courses etc. Also, a significant component of the MSW is field placements, unlike most other master's degrees. A lot of this has to do with what state you're in and what your local (particularly public) universities happen to offer. So, when you say something else, I am guessing that means it should be something similar, such as psychology, counseling, social sciences, etc...? Also, one thing that slightly concerned me was a post on the psychology board in which several people said they are making less money with a master's degree in psychology than they made at pre-college jobs! Is this true of social work as well?? Although money certainly isn't everything, I will be paying back student loans for both myself and my daughter, so I have to take that into consideration. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nugget Posted June 12, 2014 Share Posted June 12, 2014 If you do a BSW, there should be flexibility in the electives courses that you take and you should be able to do these online. If you're not sure yet if social work is for you, why not do some volunteer work before you go back to school to see if you will like the field? There should be some flexiblity in the first year of the BSW program to take more elective courses (especially if you do it part time) in addition to a couple of social work courses to see if you are still interested in social work. The great thing about elective courses is that they can be tranfered to another program if you end up deciding that this field isn't for you. Social work is a broad, vast field with so many different areas you can work in that a lot of people don't know about. There are some limitations with only a BSW, but I do know that with an MSW you will be able to work in all of the areas I mentioned in my previous post. This is a great link with videos on nearly 50 different areas you could work in with an MSW that you may find useful and informative. Good luck! http://www.socialwork.utoronto.ca/alumni/profiles.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reneegavin Posted June 17, 2014 Author Share Posted June 17, 2014 I spoke to the head of the social work program at the college I would attend. She said my 2 best options would be either getting a Bachelors degree in Applied Behavioral Science, then a MA in counseling or a MSW. My other choice would just be to do the Bachelors in SW, then the masters in it as well. She said the only problem with the social work programs is they are only available during the day and the field education is 200 hours per semester for 3 semesters! The Applied Behavioral Sciences does not seem to have field education. However, would the ABS degree severely limit my ability in finding a job? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheCrow Posted June 17, 2014 Share Posted June 17, 2014 Social work is very much not something that you can just do on the side. Even if you could attend school part-time, at least in my state you would need to work almost full-time to get enough supervised hours to get your LCSW (licensed clinical social work license) within the time limit (here it's a certain number of hours within in a three year period) and be eligible to do counseling. The bachelor's degree in applied behavioral science will not authorize or license you to do anything like counseling that you're not already able to do right now, but having a bachelor's degree in general will make you more employable. What do you envision your life as being like after the MSW? How many hours would you want to work? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reneegavin Posted June 17, 2014 Author Share Posted June 17, 2014 Would I be able to do anything with the bachelor's degree in applied behavioral sciences?If I got that, then went for my master's in social work or behavioral applied sciences, I could then do counseling, correct? By the time I am done with schooling, I would want to work full time at least until my loans were paid off, which would be a long time! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nugget Posted June 17, 2014 Share Posted June 17, 2014 (edited) Well if you plan to go straight from a bachelor to masters program, then being able to work in the field of ABS won't impact your life in any significant way. It sounds like the flexibility of the ABS program would work better for your life circumstances and you could do an MSW or counselling MA later on. But if there is any chance that you may change your mind or no longer be able to attend grad school (ie: finances, family obligations, changing interests, etc), then a BSW would probably be your safest bet as you could definitely find work in the field with only a BSW. But this would depend on whether or not you could fit it into your schedule somehow. Additionally, if you decide to take time off to work after undergrad to take a break from school or to save money for school (for instance), then doing a BSW might be a better idea. Edited June 17, 2014 by jenste Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reneegavin Posted June 18, 2014 Author Share Posted June 18, 2014 (edited) Well if you plan to go straight from a bachelor to masters program, then being able to work in the field of ABS won't impact your life in any significant way. It sounds like the flexibility of the ABS program would work better for your life circumstances and you could do an MSW or counselling MA later on. But if there is any chance that you may change your mind or no longer be able to attend grad school (ie: finances, family obligations, changing interests, etc), then a BSW would probably be your safest bet as you could definitely find work in the field with only a BSW. But this would depend on whether or not you could fit it into your schedule somehow. Additionally, if you decide to take time off to work after undergrad to take a break from school or to save money for school (for instance), then doing a BSW might be a better idea. That is what I figured. I have to say...I am really unsure after taking this path. I was talking to a friend of a friend who is has a bachelor's degree in SW now. She said that the jobs are scarce, the pay is horrible, and the hard work and dedication are simply not worth it. She said that she knows people with masters degrees, and they cannot find jobs either. Apparently the big name counseling companies in the area pay horribly. She said she has seriously contemplated going back to factory work. I just can't put all of this money and time into this and not get any return Edited June 18, 2014 by reneegavin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nugget Posted June 18, 2014 Share Posted June 18, 2014 (edited) I can see why you would feel discouraged. With that information you got from your friend, the prospect of getting an BSW looks a lot less appealing. What aspect of social work interests you the most? Perhaps there is an allied program or field that would give you those things that you are looking for with better working conditions. A couple that come to mind if you like counselling... an Educational Counselling MA or a degree in Career Counselling (to work as an employment counsellor). There are other professions that also do a bit of counselling that you may have never considered before, like becoming a Dietician or a Psychiatric Nurse for instance. I can't speak to the job situation in the US, nor average starting salaries as I've noticed there is a difference in Canada. With a bit of research and self-exploration, I'm that sure you'll find something you like that is worth your time and energy to pursue. Best of luck! Edited June 18, 2014 by jenste Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reneegavin Posted June 18, 2014 Author Share Posted June 18, 2014 I wouldn't mind educational or career counseling, but the jobs are so limited. Basically one counselor per school, and I'm not even sure where career counselors get hired. I would love to be a dietician. That is my second dream career. However, the nearest school for that is over an hour away, and is incredibly difficult if not impossible for a non traditional student. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nugget Posted June 19, 2014 Share Posted June 19, 2014 (edited) Considering that you are only willing to drive so far away and have limited flexibility in your schedule, you might have an easier time deciding by coming up with a list of schools you are willing to drive to and picking the best major amongst those schools (rather than picking your major first and trying to find a school that offers it). I don't think that bachelor programs that require internships are typically offered online, unfortunately (unless things are done differently in the US). Based on your previous posts, it sounds like you want to be in an applied program, have strong job prospects, reasonable salary potential, and work in a helping profession. You will most likely need to complete on campus course work for that (but could probably get away with completing your electives online to make things a bit easier for you and try to get internships that are close to your home). If you would be willing to consider driving to the school that offers the dietician program 2 days per week, I don't think it would do any harm to call the department, explain your situation and see what they recommend. If you could do your elective courses online, get internships close to your home, and arrange your class schedule to only be on campus 2 days per week, then there might be some potential with that program. Edited June 19, 2014 by jenste Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hiclub2 Posted June 19, 2014 Share Posted June 19, 2014 (edited) Only if you attend BSW for public school but not Private school Edited June 19, 2014 by hiclub2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MSW2015 Posted June 24, 2014 Share Posted June 24, 2014 You would need an MSW to do third-party-reimbursable clinical counseling (i.e., their insurance company would pay you), which is what you seem to be interested in, as well as at least two years of supervision thereafter. With a BSW, you could do case management, which means you could work with people with the challenges you mentioned, but you would do so on the basis of helping them find and navigate various resources, not in the typical counseling setting. You might have an easier time doing an online bachelor's degree in another field (or by doing your first two years at a community college and then transferring into an online four-year degree at a local public university) and then attending a two-year MSW program. Alternatively, you might see if there are any MSW programs in your state that will allow you to earn an MSW online/distance learning if you already have a job in social services and then try to get one of those jobs while you earn your bachelor's degree. This is simply not true. I'm a Licensed Social Worker in Ohio at the BSW level and I do clinical counseling. The only major insurance that I can not bill is Medicare. Medicaid and most private insurances will pay for counseling services from someone licensed at the BSW level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheCrow Posted June 25, 2014 Share Posted June 25, 2014 I don't know about Ohio: In order to set up a private practice as a clinical social worker, one must have the following credentials: • A masters degree in social work from an accredited school of social work • A minimum of two years or 3,000 hours of post-graduate experience in a supervised, clinical setting. (Some states require more. Check with your state licensure board for a confirmation of hours.) • A clinical license in the state where the practice will be located http://careers.socialworkers.org/documents/Opening%20a%20Private%20Practice.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kristopher Posted June 25, 2014 Share Posted June 25, 2014 (edited) Perhaps MSW15 is not billing, but the organization they work for is. I am almost certain you cannot bill independently in Ohio without an LISW. Edited June 25, 2014 by Kristopher Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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