If You Have The Money = Congratulations! Admitted.

[YoungR3b3l]

Hello guys

As international applicants, we hear the topic statement quite often. Having money makes it more easier to have to you admitted into some grad schools. Now im not talking about top 10 schools in the US, nor the worst ones. I mean the average/good ones.

If you have the money, whether it is a personal funding from parents or whoever, or its via a scholarship from your countrys government, your chances of admission is expanded.

I remember one of a faculty members who earned his PhD from Syracuse university in political science told me an advice when applying, which was that showing the university im applying to a financial paper statement from the government would give my application more weight.

Now I know that no1 can get into a grad school with 0 money or without providing a financial statement if he wasnt asking for a scholarship from the university itself, but Im talking about admitting here.

Another case is a friend of mine applied to Ball State University via a third party, he got a rejection. He was told from the office (third party) is that the rejection was due to low test scores and having a scholarship would've had him admitted conditionally.

I know it may sound illogical, but things arent ideal as we may think. Does having a "fat budget" can be correlated into a higher chances of admitting? As international applicants, we hear this ALOT.

Thoughts would be appreciated.

Edited August 7, 2014 by YoungR3b3l

[GeoDUDE!]

I think it depends on the program; my program funds ALL students through RA/TA/Fellowships. No student is allowed to pay their way in a degree program. 

 

But it makes sense: if a school knows you can pay for it, they should be more likely to accept you. They want that money. 

[bhr]

I think it's a little more complicated than that. As I looked at schools, almost every program had guaranteed funds of some sort, either through TAing or other departmental jobs. Even with that, as a humanities student, my stipends are going to fall short of allowing me to live comfortably, so I'm taking a small loan out through FinAid/FAFSA. I would guess that most programs, particularly outside of science and tech (where RAs get better pay), are the same way. As an international student, you won't be eligible for those funds and will have higher tuition premiums (along with higher relocation costs, travel expenses, ect) so I can see why a program would want to know that you can actually afford to attend.

 

The other side of that is that programs often don't like when students take outside jobs. Before I got the funded offer at my current program, I had considered taking a job with ResLife at another school that hadn't been able to get me out of state waivers. The department didn't outright discourage it (they couldn't), but it was clear that they didn't want me that heavily committed outside of the program.

 

As an aside, I understand you are upset about not getting into your program of choice, but this is the third or fourth post you've made that comes off as bitter. Let it go, figure out where you fell short academically this year, and improve your cv for this season.

[ExponentialDecay]

Generally speaking, yes, in a capitalist economy, if you can pay money for something, you are more likely to be able to obtain it.

 

Factors are: how much money? where is this money from? what is this money going to pay for? what are the strings attached to this money? what will be the real impact on the receiving party?

[VioletAyame]

I am an international student and I really had no problem securing funding during my application process. I think the biggest issue with funding international students is we can't establish residency and thus the program woud have to pay out-of-state tuition and fee for us for the whole 5 years, which can be really costly. Our stipend is just the same with domestic students and is really nothing compared to tuition and fee. It's certainly harder for us, but I was admitted to three programs, all with full funding, and a lot of people have been too, so it's nowhere near being an impossibe task. One was a private school so it's basically the same tuition and fee for everyone, eliminating the problem. The other two were public but fortunately I received a 2-year fellowship at both places, so the department would only be responsible for my tuition and fee for the 3 years in between. It might be a factor that I was competitive enough for university-wide fellowship, but during the visits I also met quite a few international students funded entirely through RA/TAships. It seemed to be a no-issue in my experience.

 

I did not have to provide any proof of funding beforehand (I woud not have been able to anyway). During the application process, I specifically asked the programs if I have to fill out the financial affidavit, and they all told me not until I as admitted but not funded by the department or university. It makes sense to require financial proof only when you have to self-fund. I'm not sure if the adcoms would even look at your affidavit if you send it along with your package or if they even know the rules in funding international students to pay attention to it. And I don't know if I want to join a program which admits me specifically because you can pay them. Don't get me wrong, I know it can be hard for us to get funding but I don't think the ability to pay should come into play during the admittance process at all. After they look at your file and determine that you're good enough but don't have to money to fund you, they can always send out an acceptance and ask you if you can self-fund (there's a prevalent sentiment here that you should never pay for a PhD, but that's a discussion for another day). Now securing external funding (grant or fellowship) is another thing - it should increase your chance of being accepted since it proves your ability to get funding, which is always important to any graduate programs.

[spunky]

I know it may sound illogical, but things arent ideal as we may think. Does having a "fat budget" can be correlated into a higher chances of admitting? As international applicants, we hear this ALOT.

 

this is quite interesting because that was actually sort of my case. my program is unfunded. most people apply with funding coming from some sort of agency (which i was ineligible at the time because i was an international student) and there are no RA/TAships until the PhD level (and those few and far in-between and not very well-paid anyway). there is even a note on the website when you apply not to get discouraged if you don't receive an acceptance letter because most of the applications get rejected due to lack of funding.

 

another international student told me that, when he applied, he printed out some personal financial statements and attached them to his application, just barely making reference to them in his SOI. 

 

so i did the same thing (and asked my mom for some extra $$$ so the financial statements would look flashier) and got in. my advisor never mentioned whether that was a factored in my acceptance or not (and i never asked) but most students senior to me said it must've played a role because applying without proof of funding in this program almost amounts to asking for a rejection letter.

 

i guess at the end of the day you just use whatever you can to get in, cross your fingers and hope for the best. 

[Guest |||]

It is an unfortunate reality, but money can compensate for second rate and third rate students.

[bsharpe269]

PhD programs seem to fall into 2 categories. 1) They only admit students they fund or 2) They fund some/most of their students but do admit some other good students who can afford the tuition.

 

For the first category of schools, your financial situation is irrelevant. For the 2nd category of schools, my guess is that many universities just assume that international students (and maybe domestic as well) cannot afford to attend and reject applicants they cannot fund unless they have a reason to think that you can afford tuition and cost of living. I don't think this is a case of universities being unfair to wealthier students, just being logical in their decision process. For example, If a program has 20 great international student applications that they would love to admit but lack funding and one applicant shows that they can attend without funding then why not admit the student?

 

I don't see a good alternative to the current process. Not many international students are admitted, especially when compared to the number that apply. Although this makes the process more competitive for international applicants, public universities are funded by US tax payers and foreign students cost programs more money. I don't think the majority of tax payers would be willing to pay higher taxes to fund more international students when there are plenty of qualified applicants from the US as well. Additionally, the parents of US applicants have been paying taxes towards these universities for many years and my future income will go towards paying for public universities. Alternatively, international applicants have never finanically contributed to these schools and unless they permanantly move to the US, its possible that they never will. This is the reason that less international students are admitted. International students basically get a free ride to phd the parents of domestic students have paid for their student's fellowships through taxes and the domestic students will "repay" the stipend in the future through taxes. This is an issue that domestic students also deal with when attending colleges in other states. If I wanted to go to college in a neighboring state instead of my home state then I would be less likely to be admitted and I would have to pay higher tuition since my parents have not been paying taxes in that state to fund my tuition.

[lifealive]

Really? My program actually wanted to recruit international students. Administrators believed that the presence of international students raised the profile of the program and made the university look like a global powerhouse.

 

My school waives the tuition of everyone who has a TAship regardless of what state or nation they're from. It's debatable whether or not the waived tuition actually costs the department "real money" or if the charges are just symbolic. According to some people I've talked to, the department must pay the tuition and fees for each grad student they wish to fund (tuition that is more expensive if someone is an international student). According to other people, the department is never charged the tuition in the first place.

 

In any case, I'm not sure why we should all be outraged by the allegation that the playing field isn't the same for international students who want to attend US schools. Education costs money, and US schools are funded with the expectation that they will foster a more educated US electorate. We still haven't become a completely borderless, global society that views all people as citizens of the world and entitled to the same benefits. It works both ways. As a US citizen, for instance, I can't just expect another country's university to throw open its doors for me and pay me a full stipend. They MAY do this for me if I show them I am talented enough, but it's going to take some wrangling and some paperwork--much more than for someone who grew up in that country, paid taxes to that country, and will probably stay in that country after their degree is completed. Being an international student is complicated because of citizenship and visa issues.

[spunky]

 

In any case, I'm not sure why we should all be outraged by the allegation that the playing field isn't the same for international students who want to attend US schools. 

 

I don’t really think there is much of an ‘outrage’ in terms of whether or not the odds are stacked against international students when coming to North America to study. It seems more of an issue that YoungR3b3l is raising concerning his/her specific case of not making it to his/her program of choice and trying to understand why.

 

Nevertheless, though, I do think it’s important to mention that even if things are a little tougher for us, int’l students, the system is still pretty fair. It’s up to *us* (and not the university) to do our job to make sure our qualifications are top-notch, our English is decent enough and that we will contribute to the university (or the country we’re in) the same we’re taking from it, whether it’s through our money, our talent or both. If we can’t do it, well then tough luck and try again next time.  You can’t get everything for free and as much as this playing field tends to favour a certain type of int’l student (e.g. those who can self-fund, those who have taken English lessons from an early age so they’ve mastered it, who are familiar with the Western school system, etc.) it also guarantees that the departments will get the best candidates for the best positions. University departments are not charities and each potential thesis advisor is going to invest his/her time and energy to mentor his/her students so they can become top notch scholars.

 

Whether money opens doors to graduate departments or not seems irrelevant. Money opens doors to EVERYTHING… graduate programs, work placements, public office, etc. It isn’t fair, but that’s how the system works. If you don’t have the money to help you out then make sure your own talents and qualifications will speak for themselves the moment an admission committee deliberates whether or not you should be accepted.  

[Vene]

Really? My program actually wanted to recruit international students. Administrators believed that the presence of international students raised the profile of the program and made the university look like a global powerhouse.

Are you at a public or private university? If you're at a private university the points bsharpe made don't really apply to you. Regardless, there are definitely less federal funds available to finance international students in the US and many grants can only be given to domestic students. The administration may well have concluded that it's worth the financial cost to boost their prestige, but I am certain that the financial cost was weighed when they decided they wanted to recruit international students.

[lifealive]

Are you at a public or private university? If you're at a private university the points bsharpe made don't really apply to you.

 

My school is public. Even public universities want to boost their prestige by admitting talented international students, believe it or not. Moreover, private universities also receive federal funds.

[Vene]

My school is public. Even public universities want to boost their prestige by admitting talented international students, believe it or not. Moreover, private universities also receive federal funds.

Not trying to imply any of that, but a graduate department in a public university will have to provide less in tuition for a domestic student who either is or can establish residency compared to an international student. So, it can become fiscally harder to justify bringing in an international student over a domestic one all else being equal.

[Lifesaver]

YoungRebel has tons of money. He drives a Porsche, you know.