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Besides the time I spent in the Army, my happiest years have been those I have spent as a college student. I may have occasionally frowned on the impending exam and accompanying hours of requisite study, but the camaraderie and sense of community on the college campus among students made up for it. Teaching high school mathematics for two years was fulfilling but the deviants and lengthy at home preparation took the enjoyment out of it. Being a mailman had its moments but being chased by dogs was irksome. Yes, my happiest years were those I spent as a student. A desire to be blissful coupled with the opportunities an advanced degree will afford is why I want to attend graduate school.

A master’s degree in civil engineering with a concentration in structural engineering has everything I am looking for. With this degree, I can work for the Army Corp of Engineers helping retrofit and replace our nations deteriorating infrastructure, the Nuclear Regulatory Commission helping design the next generation of nuclear reactors, the C.I.A. as a science, technology, and weapons analyst, or I could get a position at a junior college teaching math or engineering. Why do I want to study structural engineering? The answer is simple: opportunities.

I especially like the applicability of structural engineering. With this degree, I am not relegated to designing buildings; wherever forcers are exerted, there is a potential need for a structural engineer. The screen saver on my office computer is a picture of the Millau Viaduct. As I admire the beauty of the tallest bridge in the world, I cannot help but ponder the science that enables it to withstand the forces it must cope with. As NASA designs the Orion space vehicle that will replace the space shuttle fleet, I envy the engineers that get to solve the structural challenges NASA doubtlessly encounters.

I am well prepared to begin structural engineering studies. My degree in mathematics affords me the ability to think analytically and logically. Before commencing graduate studies I will have completed a course in chemistry and physics; this will help get my scientific juices reflowing. Once admitted to the graduate program in structural engineering, I will avail myself of the opportunity and not disappoint. I look forward to entering the civil engineering department in the fall of 2010.

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I'm sorry if this is harsh, but this essay is a good example of what not to do.

This essay is repetitive, contains mostly irrelevant information, and doesn't tell the admission committee anything that will convince it to accept you.

Besides the time I spent in the Army, my happiest years have been those I have spent as a college student. I may have occasionally frowned on the impending exam and accompanying hours of requisite study, but the camaraderie and sense of community on the college campus among students made up for it. Teaching high school mathematics for two years was fulfilling but the deviants and lengthy at home preparation took the enjoyment out of it. Being a mailman had its moments but being chased by dogs was irksome. Yes, my happiest years were those I spent as a student. A desire to be blissful coupled with the opportunities an advanced degree will afford is why I want to attend graduate school.

I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that being happy in school is something most applicants will have in common. It doesn't separate you from the crowd, and doesn't tell the school why you want to go THERE specifically.

A master’s degree in civil engineering with a concentration in structural engineering has everything I am looking for. With this degree, I can work for the Army Corp of Engineers helping retrofit and replace our nations deteriorating infrastructure, the Nuclear Regulatory Commission helping design the next generation of nuclear reactors, the C.I.A. as a science, technology, and weapons analyst, or I could get a position at a junior college teaching math or engineering. Why do I want to study structural engineering? The answer is simple: opportunities

Again, you're speaking in generalities and stating the obvious. This paragraph is going to be true of all applicants. Why are you special?

especially like the applicability of structural engineering. With this degree, I am not relegated to designing buildings; wherever forcers are exerted, there is a potential need for a structural engineer. The screen saver on my office computer is a picture of the Millau Viaduct. As I admire the beauty of the tallest bridge in the world, I cannot help but ponder the science that enables it to withstand the forces it must cope with. As NASA designs the Orion space vehicle that will replace the space shuttle fleet, I envy the engineers that get to solve the structural challenges NASA doubtlessly encounters

"relegated" is probably a bad choice of verb.

That screen saver story is an irrelevant anecdote.

You also don't want to be talking about envying other people.

Nothing in this paragraph tells me anything substantial about who you are or why you want you degree. I envy the astronauts that went to the moon, but it's not like I'm going to start training for the next Apollo mission or whatever. What specifically drives you to follow this interest in engineering?

I am well prepared to begin structural engineering studies. My degree in mathematics affords me the ability to think analytically and logically. Before commencing graduate studies I will have completed a course in chemistry and physics; this will help get my scientific juices reflowing. Once admitted to the graduate program in structural engineering, I will avail myself of the opportunity and not disappoint. I look forward to entering the civil engineering department in the fall of 2010

Finally you talk about your credentials. But here too, you speak in generalities. The adcom will know that successfully completing a Math degree means that you have good analytical and logical thinking (but most other applicants will as well). It'll also be clear from your transcript that you took a course in chemistry and physics - I'm sure that'll be true of enough applicants, and besides you're not telling the adcom anything it didn't know before. You promise to be good...but why should anyone believe you? Your essay didn't contain anything to convince us.

This essay is lacking in many ways. It doesn't give a good description of your background, of your specific interests, future goals, or why you want to attend any specific university (the "fit" paragraph). I think you need to go back to the drawing board and rework this.

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so it looks as if you're going to be going with the "start the SOP with an anecdote" route, which is common enough but you have to choose just one! right now, you have too many anecdotes and not enough of: a description of what particular topics/interests you'd like to pursue while in graduate school; what makes you prepared to start that exploration; what makes the school(s) you're applying to a good fit for helping you further develop; and what you might do with your graduate education beyond the particular topic/interest you will choose to write about.

look at the prompt(s) for the schools you're applying to, try responding to each part, and maybe that will help you write something more suitable for an SOP.

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I think this needs to be rewritten, but I think it will be very good if you keep reworking it. You are a good writer, and have some interesting tidbits thrown in, but you need to make sure they remain only tidbits and fleeting references. Your sentence about being a mailman is good because it is one brief sentence. Try to limit your anecdotal comments, and to make those you keep brief. I personally took a similar approach to you in my first draft - my initial SOP was very conversational, and showed a lot of my personality. I have since removed the most entertaining parts of my SOP, after holding on to them as long as I could justify, and have edited down the unrelated comments that had me going off on unnecessary tangents. There are still sarcastic and anecdotal comments in it, but they each take up no more than a sentence and are integrated into more relevant points.

Another thing is that you list all the possibilities that come with a career in your field, but you don't say exactly what it is you want to do. The people reading this will know exactly what kind of jobs people with the degree they offer will pursue, but what they don't know, and what they want to know, is what you are planning for yourself.

Also, your mention of your time in the army is kind of awkward, as you bring it up vaguely in the first sentence and leave it there. Maybe you should mention how your army skills would be applicable? As for teaching, you should be careful with your wording about the excessive work. You kind of make it sound like you enjoyed being a student because it was less work than being a teacher. I know that's not what you mean, but you should still try to rephrase that part to avoid sounding work shy.

Overall, I think it's good that you're injecting some personality into your essay. I don't know anything about the field, but I imagine that the average structural engineering SOP is a lot more bland and formulaic than the average humanities SOP, and for that reason the people reading your statement may be a bit more receptive to a less rigid, more conversational essay. You should take it as a real compliment that I actually read the whole thing - with most sample SOPs I've read, I quit somewhere in the first paragraph because they're too pretentious and not very sincere. So while I say you should definitely rewrite this a few times (we can all benefit from doing that), you're off to a good start.

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I am applying to a master's program at a non-research based school. I have a degree in math and no research experience to speak of. I will be getting a conditional admit--admittance to the graduate program will be based on my performance in the filler classes I will be taking the first 3 semesters. I also have no experience in the field of study I am applying for(structural engineering)

I say all that to say this: there is not much for me to talk about. Any explicit suggestions are welcomed and strongly desired. Thanks in advance.

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I think Fuzzy covered most of it. Your SOP doesn't say anything other than "I want to be a civil engineer because it'll make me qualified to do these jobs".

since you're applying to engineering, you need to list more than a physics and chemistry class as your 'science' experience. A math degree generally states that you have solid computational skills but you're probably weaker in terms of applied science and laboratory skills. You should discuss any experience you have with applying your technical knowledge to solving problems (anything from school projects to home improvement to research experience). If you have experience with things like finite element analysis, definitely discuss that as structural engineers use such techniques heavily.

the SOP is suppose to highlight why you're a good fit for the program and for engineering programs a big part of that is whether or not you possess the technical capability.

Also, since you're looking at structural engineering, you should look into the FE and when you want to take it.

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As fuzzylogician said, this may sound more harsh than I mean for it to, but this is a really poor essay.

I found the most difficult aspect of writing an SoP was just knowing what went where in the essay. I came up with this outline and I've been told by my professors it's one of the best statements of purpose they've ever read:

I. Introductory paragraph: I basically just discuss my educational background here. I show (instead of telling) my language preparation, which is pretty key for the degrees to which I'm applying.

II. Explain my academic interests and how X school fits into those interests. I work in the names of professors with whom I'd like to work (though subtly). I discuss particular avenues of research I'm interested in and show how I'm already doing work relevant to it (using buzz-words from the field, citing primary sources).

III. Another reason school X is good for me - I go on to discuss the research of a few professors and how my interests/background coincide with theirs.

IV. Senior Thesis - I give a short paragraph about my senior thesis. I name my advisor (who is a known name in the field), discuss the thesis' relevance, etc.

V. Concluding paragraph - I explain my intentions after grad school in brief. I mention that my desire to teach has been with me since my first year of undergraduate studies and that I've been a tutor in some capacity (I give the names of a few courses for which I've tutored) for my entire undergrad career. I give another reason why the program in general is good for me - how it makes people into the kind of scholar I want to become.

At any rate, my outline doesn't seem to have the same zing my SoP does, but there you have it. Perhaps that can help.

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I am applying to a master's program at a non-research based school. I have a degree in math and no research experience to speak of. I will be getting a conditional admit--admittance to the graduate program will be based on my performance in the filler classes I will be taking the first 3 semesters. I also have no experience in the field of study I am applying for(structural engineering)

I say all that to say this: there is not much for me to talk about. Any explicit suggestions are welcomed and strongly desired. Thanks in advance.

Start at the very top: what does the SOP prompt ask about? Do you answer everything?

You are applying from another field -- what caused your interests to shift?

What prepares you for work in this new field? Any relevant background, coursework, etc?

(For an applicant from an outside field, these questions are really tantamount to: "how do you know this is what you want, if you've never done it before?" You want your SOP to answer that implicit question).

What do you want to do with your degree after you graduate?

(notice that this is different from what you COULD do with the degree. You talk a lot about the opportunities this degree will afford you, but not about what do you actually want to DO with them - which of these many options you talk about are the ones that make you want to get the degree?)

Why that specific school? Any interesting faculty? Courses? Facilities?

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Besides the time I spent in the Army, my happiest years have been those I have spent as a college student. I may have occasionally frowned on the impending exam and accompanying hours of requisite study, but the camaraderie and sense of community on the college campus among students made up for it. Teaching high school mathematics for two years was fulfilling but the deviants and lengthy at home preparation took the enjoyment out of it. Being a mailman had its moments but being chased by dogs was irksome. Yes, my happiest years were those I spent as a student. A desire to be blissful coupled with the opportunities an advanced degree will afford is why I want to attend graduate school.

A master’s degree in civil engineering with a concentration in structural engineering has everything I am looking for. With this degree, I can work for the Army Corp of Engineers helping retrofit and replace our nations deteriorating infrastructure, the Nuclear Regulatory Commission helping design the next generation of nuclear reactors, the C.I.A. as a science, technology, and weapons analyst, or I could get a position at a junior college teaching math or engineering. Why do I want to study structural engineering? The answer is simple: opportunities.

I especially like the applicability of structural engineering. With this degree, I am not relegated to designing buildings; wherever forcers are exerted, there is a potential need for a structural engineer. The screen saver on my office computer is a picture of the Millau Viaduct. As I admire the beauty of the tallest bridge in the world, I cannot help but ponder the science that enables it to withstand the forces it must cope with. As NASA designs the Orion space vehicle that will replace the space shuttle fleet, I envy the engineers that get to solve the structural challenges NASA doubtlessly encounters.

I am well prepared to begin structural engineering studies. My degree in mathematics affords me the ability to think analytically and logically. Before commencing graduate studies I will have completed a course in chemistry and physics; this will help get my scientific juices reflowing. Once admitted to the graduate program in structural engineering, I will avail myself of the opportunity and not disappoint. I look forward to entering the civil engineering department in the fall of 2010.

fuzzy has addressed most of the issues I would have commented on.

I would also watch your word selection. You have an odd combination of supercasual idioms -- "besides" (which should never be used by anyone not in the mafia), "scientific juices flowing" = ewwwww -- and stilted formal verbiage -- helping retrofit and replace our nations deteriorating infrastructure.

So, you think you have nothing to write about. That is impossible. You just have some standard in your mind that you need to challenge. Do you want to be a creative writer or a grad student in engineering? I can't really tell from this SOP. If it is the latter pick one career track and use it to focus your essay. No one is going to arrest you if you change your mind later or even if you already know that you are open to other avenues. The point here isn't a session with your therapist; it's to make a convincing case for your admission. I really don't need to know about your screen saver or how happy you were as an UG. As a rule of thumb, use creative devices only if you have been told many times by many people not related to you that you are an excellent writer. Barring that come up with a formula and stay on the conservative side.

Why are you applying to this school? You chose it for a reason but I don't see it here.

After reading this I have no idea why grad school, why for you, why now, why here, or why I should care.

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fuzzy has addressed most of the issues I would have commented on.

I would also watch your word selection. You have an odd combination of supercasual idioms -- "besides" (which should never be used by anyone not in the mafia), "scientific juices flowing" = ewwwww -- and stilted formal verbiage -- helping retrofit and replace our nations deteriorating infrastructure.

So, you think you have nothing to write about. That is impossible. You just have some standard in your mind that you need to challenge. Do you want to be a creative writer or a grad student in engineering? I can't really tell from this SOP. If it is the latter pick one career track and use it to focus your essay. No one is going to arrest you if you change your mind later or even if you already know that you are open to other avenues. The point here isn't a session with your therapist; it's to make a convincing case for your admission. I really don't need to know about your screen saver or how happy you were as an UG. As a rule of thumb, use creative devices only if you have been told many times by many people not related to you that you are an excellent writer. Barring that come up with a formula and stay on the conservative side.

Why are you applying to this school? You chose it for a reason but I don't see it here.

After reading this I have no idea why grad school, why for you, why now, why here, or why I should care.

Hi Coyabean,

Can you please explain to me why "besides" should never be used by anyone who is not in the mafia? English is not my first language and I would like to learn more about the taboo of this word. I've never heard of such association before.

Thank you.

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To my credit, I had a feeling it was kind of weak. Thanks for all of the advice. I will work on it some more and post the revised edition. This is the prompt provided for the SOP by the graduate office for anyone who was interested:

Write a brief statement (500 words/3500 characters or less including punctuation, but not spaces) describing your reason(s) for pursuing graduate or postbaccalaureate study. Include any additional information concerning your preparation that is pertinent to the objective specified. You may also send a resume and/or letters of reference if required by department.

I just can't think of anything good to say. It is a tier 3 school and I am confident I will get in; the SOP is perfunctory and a box I am having trouble checking.

P.S. The intro paragraph of my SOP is my way of giving the graduate school an intro. to who I am--my life experiences. I feel this is important. It is purposefully vague.

Edited by CHOCTICK
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I just can't think of anything good to say. It is a tier 3 school and I am confident I will get in; the SOP is perfunctory and a box I am having trouble checking.

P.S. The intro paragraph of my SOP is my way of giving the graduate school an intro. to who I am--my life experiences. I feel this is important. It is purposefully vague.

I strongly advise you NOT to view the SOP as perfunctory for any school, regardless of rank. And don't be overconfident- I was that way the first time I applied to grad school and got burned pretty badly. You cannot take anything for granted in this process. If you view the SOP as merely a box to be checked, the adcomm will be able to tell and will most likely be turned off by your lack of effort. You are trying to convince them that you are mature and well-prepared for grad school; one of the best ways to do that is to take their admissions requirements seriously.

As for the intro paragraph, I agree with you that it is important to show them who you are. However, I don't think you've gone about that in the best way. The way it is written, you don't show them who you are; it sounds generic and contrived. IMO, vague is only appropriate when discussing personal issues that the adcomm doesn't need to know about- for example, in my SOP I said that "family circumstances" took me to my undergraduate school, rather than tell them I married a sailor and was forced to transfer there. In that case, vague is better- they don't need or want to hear the gory details of my personal life. So I think you should work on adding more concrete details about your academic and work experiences and less superfluous information.

One last point, and I'm surprised no one else mentioned it: what struck me the most when I first read through your essay was the negativity. The irksome dogs, deviants, and lengthy preparation- all of that should be removed. There shouldn't be anything negative in your SOP. Try to twist those sentences around to be more positive. For example, you said being a mailman had its moments- what were they? Briefly mention a positive aspect of the job and how it prepared you for grad school or taught you something about your chosen field.

It sounds like your life has provided you with a lot of raw material to work with. I'm sure that you can write a fantastic essay with a bit of work.

Good luck, and stay positive! :)

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Hi Coyabean,

Can you please explain to me why "besides" should never be used by anyone who is not in the mafia? English is not my first language and I would like to learn more about the taboo of this word. I've never heard of such association before.

Thank you.

Ahhhh, knowing that actually helps. I thought your syntax a bit interesting. For the record, my humor falls flat for international audiences. I just meant that it is a bit too informal. Also, keep in mind that Subject-Verb-Object is really the best way to structure a sentence if you want to keep it direct.

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I strongly advise you NOT to view the SOP as perfunctory for any school, regardless of rank. And don't be overconfident- I was that way the first time I applied to grad school and got burned pretty badly. You cannot take anything for granted in this process. If you view the SOP as merely a box to be checked, the adcomm will be able to tell and will most likely be turned off by your lack of effort. You are trying to convince them that you are mature and well-prepared for grad school; one of the best ways to do that is to take their admissions requirements seriously.

As for the intro paragraph, I agree with you that it is important to show them who you are. However, I don't think you've gone about that in the best way. The way it is written, you don't show them who you are; it sounds generic and contrived. IMO, vague is only appropriate when discussing personal issues that the adcomm doesn't need to know about- for example, in my SOP I said that "family circumstances" took me to my undergraduate school, rather than tell them I married a sailor and was forced to transfer there. In that case, vague is better- they don't need or want to hear the gory details of my personal life. So I think you should work on adding more concrete details about your academic and work experiences and less superfluous information.

One last point, and I'm surprised no one else mentioned it: what struck me the most when I first read through your essay was the negativity. The irksome dogs, deviants, and lengthy preparation- all of that should be removed. There shouldn't be anything negative in your SOP. Try to twist those sentences around to be more positive. For example, you said being a mailman had its moments- what were they? Briefly mention a positive aspect of the job and how it prepared you for grad school or taught you something about your chosen field.

It sounds like your life has provided you with a lot of raw material to work with. I'm sure that you can write a fantastic essay with a bit of work.

Good luck, and stay positive! :)

Kiebelle here says something I had not thought of, but with which I totally agree. You don't want the adcomm thinking to themselves, "So they gave being a mail-man a go and that didn't work, tried teaching and that didn't work, and now sees grad school as a ticket out."

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coya, the person who asked you about "besides" is not the OP.

Or did you mean peanuttheanthro's syntax in general in this forum?

Oooooh. Ok. Yes the odd syntax was actually for the OP. Oops.

And the SVO advice is in general, I guess, but definitely applies to the OP. There were some odd sentence constructions that asked too much of the reader, IMO.

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Oooooh. Ok. Yes the odd syntax was actually for the OP. Oops.

And the SVO advice is in general, I guess, but definitely applies to the OP. There were some odd sentence constructions that asked too much of the reader, IMO.

Hi coyabean and captiv8ed,

Sorry I'm lost here. What's the OP? You meant the SOP?

Do you mean my syntax is weird? :o

Coyabean - thanks for the SVO advice!

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How is this? I plan on adding it somewhere in the original SOP;I am still pondering how I will edit the original one. Am I the only one who sees humor in the first paragraph of the original SOP. Deviants and dogs are funny--please no one comment on how a SOP is no place for humor.

Two areas of interest to me within structural engineering are smart structures and toughening mechanisms. As the population

increases, land management will become more of an issue. As a result, the homes of the future will be under the world’s oceans;

but to be able to handle the forces from underwater currents and changing pressure, such structures will need to be able to

adapt. I would like to contribute to designing structures that can reduce their own drag and increase their own strength. Having

attended XXXX university for my undergraduate degree, I feel confident I can get the foundation I need to tackle these issues

from my alma mater.

Another area I find intriguing is computational methods and mathematical modeling. My mathematics courses included work in

computer programming, number theory, abstract algebra, analysis, and linear algebra. I am interested in how linear algebra along

with differential equations and computer programming can be employed to optimize the design process while simultaneously

maximizing structural integrity.

P.S.: Some of you guys can be rough in your Critiquing :D

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How is this? I plan on adding it somewhere in the original SOP;I am still pondering how I will edit the original one. Am I the only one who sees humor in the first paragraph of the original SOP. Deviants and dogs are funny--please no one comment on how a SOP is no place for humor.

Two areas of interest to me within structural engineering are smart structures and toughening mechanisms. As the population

increases, land management will become more of an issue. As a result, the homes of the future will be under the world’s oceans;

but to be able to handle the forces from underwater currents and changing pressure, such structures will need to be able to

adapt. I would like to contribute to designing structures that can reduce their own drag and increase their own strength. Having

attended XXXX university for my undergraduate degree, I feel confident I can get the foundation I need to tackle these issues

from my alma mater.

Another area I find intriguing is computational methods and mathematical modeling. My mathematics courses included work in

computer programming, number theory, abstract algebra, analysis, and linear algebra. I am interested in how linear algebra along

with differential equations and computer programming can be employed to optimize the design process while simultaneously

maximizing structural integrity.

P.S.: Some of you guys can be rough in your Critiquing :D

Sorry about that! I'm in that applyingtograd comm on LJ and we dispense with all niceties there. We're all super busy with our own apps and offering help where we can and I think in the rush we -- meaning I -- can seem brusque. Plus, I'm an Eng major in UG. We're bred to be writing snobs. Pay it no mind. If I'm offering my admittedly cheap advice then it means that I think the SOP is worthwhile. When they're beyond hope I just skip them. LOL

And yes, I think this second one is MUCH better. You simplified the sentence structure, took out some of the flowery language and it sounds like you know what you're talking about. You might want to clarify what population you are talking about unless that's a discipline thing that will be understood by other engineers? I can't help there. But I totally got needing to use math and inventiveness to create new ways of building structures that respond to climate changes! And I'm Eng and Poli Sci. If I get it then you are doing your job.

Good luck.

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Hey Coyabean, this addendum does not replace the SOP that is at the top of this thread. As you examine it, consider it in context of the entire thing--I plan on squeezing it in somewhere. "Flowery Language"???? Thanks for your advice.

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How is this? I plan on adding it somewhere in the original SOP;I am still pondering how I will edit the original one. Am I the only one who sees humor in the first paragraph of the original SOP. Deviants and dogs are funny--please no one comment on how a SOP is no place for humor.

Two areas of interest to me within structural engineering are smart structures and toughening mechanisms. As the population

increases, land management will become more of an issue. As a result, the homes of the future will be under the world’s oceans;

but to be able to handle the forces from underwater currents and changing pressure, such structures will need to be able to

adapt. I would like to contribute to designing structures that can reduce their own drag and increase their own strength. Having

attended XXXX university for my undergraduate degree, I feel confident I can get the foundation I need to tackle these issues

from my alma mater.

Another area I find intriguing is computational methods and mathematical modeling. My mathematics courses included work in

computer programming, number theory, abstract algebra, analysis, and linear algebra. I am interested in how linear algebra along

with differential equations and computer programming can be employed to optimize the design process while simultaneously

maximizing structural integrity.

P.S.: Some of you guys can be rough in your Critiquing :D

I am not trying to be rough, nor do I want to pick on you (I feel like we're tearing you apart and I actually just want to give you a hug because I remember what it was like to have my SOP torn apart last year!).... You can be funny in your SOP if you want to, as long as you are aware some adcomms will have your sense of humor, and others will not - and unless you know them personally beforehand you're tossing a coin.

You also want to be careful of telling adcomms about what is going to happen with structural engineering in the future or the processes involved - Instead of describing to them why homes will be underwater, etc. (which i am sure they already know the process or are aware there is research in that area) try citing some research on the subject... ie "per professor XYZ's research on underwater structures, i find myself interested in the inner workings of drag, and structural strength" (I am not by any means an engineer so insert your fancy engineer lingo where you will)... You want to make it sound like you know what you're talking about, but not come off as though you are explaining the process to them.

I would also caution you against looking at the SOP as a box to check - as for many committees, once the initial cut is passed (ie GRE, GPA - whatever it may be) it is the sole piece of paper that can help you get in or out. I was over confident in applying to programs myself last year, and I didn't do enough research on what an SOP should be like, and that is why I am here in this forum again this year. Its not that we want to be rough, its just that many of us have done this before or have experience in the process and we don't want other people to make mistakes that we made before if we can help them avoid it. In fact, I stay at this grad school forum, because its the least rough of any of them out there. haha.

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