queenleblanc

Since I don't have any in-state post-bacc programs, I chose to pursue just the leveling courses, aka, pre-requisites. I have ended up with more debt than I thought, simply because I didn't know where to start looking to take the pre-req courses for the least amount of money, and I stumbled into SLP late last spring, too late for the one in-state option I could have done- by the time I contacted the program to see if I could get into the classes, they had 140 on the waiting list so I had to look out of state. I was not on on these forums at the time and had to navigate it on my own, so I found Longwood U in Virginia, and each course with them out of state has been about 1900. Totally more than I wanted to spend, but I didn't know about many other options that would have been cheaper. You are in the right place! Here is what I have found that might help:

Utah State. You can do the second bacc program, or you can apply as a non-degree student (free app) and just take the leveling classes required by the places you want to apply. Most programs have the list of pre-reqs they want, so it might be cheaper. It is around 800 a class, not too bad! Plus, it seems that most of the classes in the post-bacc program are available every semester, and I think you can take up to 5 at one time, which is awesome. You WILL need observation hours, even as an out-of-field student, some will make them up in the fall upon enrolling or in the summer prior, but most require them to be completed prior to enrolling in the fall. Some require observation hrs for course credit. USU is the only school I have found that offers obs hours for credit via the online method. I am lucky in that my program this fall requires the hours but they don't have to be for credit, so I can save the extra 5-600 that the credit would cost. It looks Ike exams have to be proctored.

University of Alaska at Anchorage. They offer the specific pre-reqs that ECU requires, and these are similar to most other schools. Around 800 per course. Apply as a non-degree student (free app), and check the course sequence schedule, because not all classes are offered every semester.

Vermont. Online program as well. They don't have all of the pre-reqs on the list for places I applied, but their program is one to consider.

Longwood. Love the classes I have been taking, if you can swing the cost of out of state tuition. It is in Virginia. There are ways to get in state tuition but I cannot. Exams are usually on your honor, and some are even open book because the material is so extensive and the content being tested is vast. I have enjoyed my profs thus far, too. I mostly functions through blackboard, but it is totally self-driven learning. That freedom can be very good for some people. After three semesters, I am tiring of having to motivate myself with courses that don't have work due every day but with big assignments and tests, but that also has been great since I work full-time. The assignments we do cover a lot of material and content, so I do feel like I am learning what I need to know. I wouldn't suggest more than 2 courses per semester if you are also working full time.


I would suggest making a spreadsheet of all of the schools you are interested in applying, what pre-reqs they require, and then apply to the programs that are the most affordable as far as the number of courses you take before, as well as the programs that you are willing to take what they require because you like them so much. I found that some programs do seem to focus more on school vs. medical, but you will get a well-rounded education in all programs. Look at faculty research interests, grant funding for research projects, how many semesters the program is, and the set up of your clinical hours. Some programs spread out the clinicals with the courses and you dive into clinicals right away. Others give you a semester to get settled in your coursework, then start on clinical rotation.

The program where I am going this Fall. ECU, the entire last semester is the full-time internship with no other classes (except for the thesis option I am taking). Each program has similar course sequencing, but the load of the courses versus your internship might change your mind on the program. Some people coming from their undergrad in CSD might be totally ready to jump into a part-time internship the first semester, and I would not be.

If you want the thesis option that most programs offer (some might require), check to see if there are profs that do what you think you are interested in writing about and researching. I have a list of about five topics right now simply because I wanted to start somewhere but I know the first semester of study will help me narrow that down). Some programs require comps (comprehensive exams) at the end. Some will let your passing the Praxis replace the comp requirement. Another thing to consider, if you are interested in not having the comp during your last semester.

As you research, you will find several schools that may be more geared towards out of field students, in that their list of pre-reqs is not as long. Some programs want that heavy CSD background from an undergraduate degree so their list of pre-reqs is extensive. Some programs are three years for out of field students, so you don't take ANY before you apply, while others make you start the summer prior so you enter with the other in field students in the fall right on the same pace.

Do look at the cost of the program. GAships might be available to help with cost at some universities, but how commonly are they awarded to SLP students is something to ask about. If you know you don't want the expensive program cost, take that into consideration when you choose where to apply. No sense in wasting an app fee if you wouldn't go if you got in, just my $0.02.

It would be difficult for me to give you a list of schools to consider, but the places I applied are all in my signature below. Depending on your geographic preferences, you may want to look into them. Feel free to ask questions about any program in particular!

Just in case no one else says this- make sure you only apply to ASHA certified programs. You can find out what programs are certified, what areas of research they have, etc, on ASHA.org and look for EdFind. You can search by state, online, offering a PhD, etc... Have fun, and good luck! Come back with questions! I wish I had found the grad cafe earlier last spring when I started on this journey. Hopefully someone else can learn something from my experiences!

Oh scratch that, you said NJ... Let me look that up really quickly.

Here is the link to the applications and checklists for both types of applications in NJ. You can do your initial license in NJ, which is the temporary license application, or you can apply to transfer after earning your CCC'S in another state. It appears NJ does compare with NY as far as the detail and the massive fees for licensing.

http://www.njconsumeraffairs.gov/aud/aud_applications.htm

I have had to look up this stuff for my teaching career, so I am used to reading the legal stuff with transferring licenses. It is a pain, but it is worth it to have your full license in that state, which some employers prefer.

My personal opinion is that diversity can be good in your educational background, but is not necessarily the only rule to follow.  I did my bachelor's and 1st master's degree at UNC Chapel Hill - B. Music Performance, and MAT.  The master's program I'm applying for now -- speech-language pathology, is actually ranked very highly at UNC, so I did end up applying there again for this second master's, and will eventually apply there for the PhD program, regardless of whether I attend UNC for this master's degree. In my case, I'm switching fields, which may be different than people coming from in-field.  
 
I also chose to apply elsewhere because the new experience, new campus, and different school, will give my CV some variety for when I do apply for PhD programs... not to mention the competitive nature of the admissions process and "no guarantees" even if it is your alma mater. Perhaps this is something to consider in your case.  
 
So... I guess it just depends on the circumstances.  If your grad institution specializes in your area of research and is the right fit for your PhD research, I don't see anything wrong with doing the PhD at the same institution.  There are several MA-to-PhD programs that people pursue simply because they WANT to have all of their research run concurrently, giving them an enriched experience (musicology at UNC is one program I know about, as well as the SLP program at Boston).  The diversity can be beneficial, so I would at least consider other universities to check for those same things - fit, area of research, etc.  

Technical points: (unless otherwise specified)
2 pgs, double-spaced
1" margins
name in the header on BOTH pages
page numbers on BOTH pages
(SOP's are often printed out by an admissions officer clerk, and you can make it easy for them by over-labeling)
I also included the name of the school / admissions office address (etc) on the top of my front page as a reference for every SOP I wrote (did 7 applications, so this helped me to keep them straight)
 
Advice from SLP admissions committee professors:
-Stick to the topic or prompt ; show your personal style in your writing, but don't be too "flowery" or over the top or they won't take your SOP seriously
-If no prompt, you need to show that you are interested in THEIR program -- not just the SLP field -- something that is specific to their research areas, focus areas, internship or externship opportunities, the location of the university, etc.
-Don't be afraid to show your personality.  They get TONS of application essays (400+ in many cases), and you want yours to stand out -- mention something about you as a person, what makes YOU, you.  If you have life-changing experiences that led you to the point of applying for this field, mention those.  Some departments are more interested in the academic side of you, so beware of putting too much into this part, but definitely show YOU in the essay, and you will stand out for who you are.  
-If you have any areas of interest that you must include in order to be eligible for scholarships, grants, or research assistantships, be SURE to include those.  Check to see if an extra essay is required for any of those opportunities.  
 
Definitely get it proof-read, and then STILL, you proof it again.  I missed "led" on one of my essays (the "l" was deleted) and was glad to catch it before submitting.  It seems like a small, mundane detail, but imagine being on the admissions committee... you receive essays with one or two typos, and they automatically go in the "maybe" pile, or even the "no" pile.  The competition is fierce!
 
Good luck!! 

I should add, once y earn your CCC's, moving states appears to be way easier. So consider doing your C's in the same state as your masters program, then move.

Transferring your license is known as "reciprocity" (same as what teachers do when they move states). In the ASHA page you read, there is a list of states 29 plus DC and if memory serves me correctly, these are states with the reciprocity agreement. To change from one state to another, you just apply for a license in that state (usually around $50) and submit your copy of your previous state's license, sometimes also the praxis test scores. If the state you are going to eventually work in does NOT have reciprocity with the state where you complete your masters degree and initial licensure, you need to verify that your masters program individually meets the licensure requirements for that state. There are only a few states in that category on the ASHA page. Always verify licensure requirements with each states dept. of instruction or education, or possibly even the legals statutes, which you can search online for most states.

There may be circumstances when you don't have to pay to apply for a new license in the state where you move, it depends on whether the state will recognize your previous license as it stands, or if they want to issue you a new one, which some employers may prefer. Sounds like NY might be like that, based on your description in the OP.

What I am doing, since we are very likely going to be moving to South Carolina some time after I graduate, either immediately or after completing my C's, I am going to apply for both NC and SC licensure and make sure I met both states requirements as I do the hours of clinic that are required (that's usually the only difference).

Technical points: (unless otherwise specified)
2 pgs, double-spaced
1" margins
name in the header on BOTH pages
page numbers on BOTH pages
(SOP's are often printed out by an admissions officer clerk, and you can make it easy for them by over-labeling)
I also included the name of the school / admissions office address (etc) on the top of my front page as a reference for every SOP I wrote (did 7 applications, so this helped me to keep them straight)
 
Advice from SLP admissions committee professors:
-Stick to the topic or prompt ; show your personal style in your writing, but don't be too "flowery" or over the top or they won't take your SOP seriously
-If no prompt, you need to show that you are interested in THEIR program -- not just the SLP field -- something that is specific to their research areas, focus areas, internship or externship opportunities, the location of the university, etc.
-Don't be afraid to show your personality.  They get TONS of application essays (400+ in many cases), and you want yours to stand out -- mention something about you as a person, what makes YOU, you.  If you have life-changing experiences that led you to the point of applying for this field, mention those.  Some departments are more interested in the academic side of you, so beware of putting too much into this part, but definitely show YOU in the essay, and you will stand out for who you are.  
-If you have any areas of interest that you must include in order to be eligible for scholarships, grants, or research assistantships, be SURE to include those.  Check to see if an extra essay is required for any of those opportunities.  
 
Definitely get it proof-read, and then STILL, you proof it again.  I missed "led" on one of my essays (the "l" was deleted) and was glad to catch it before submitting.  It seems like a small, mundane detail, but imagine being on the admissions committee... you receive essays with one or two typos, and they automatically go in the "maybe" pile, or even the "no" pile.  The competition is fierce!
 
Good luck!! 

I bought a condo when I moved to my first teaching job, thinking I'd do small renovations and sell the condo in 5 or so years (about the time of a PhD program) ... and it is STILL on the market.  Honestly, the money savings might look attractive, but consider the carrying costs when the time comes to sell it.  Get some good advice from multiple real estate agents in the area where you are looking to buy and really look for homes that will have a good ROI when you want to sell, because let's face it... it's not a forever home.  
 
That's just my perspective; others may have had much better experiences with purchasing a condo for the duration of time of the doctoral program... check into the housing market history where you are looking and see what kinds of homes are hot on the resell, because that's the kind of home you will want to buy, if you buy. 

Think of it like a job interview.  Do you know what the assistantship entails?  Is it mostly clerical / administrative?  Have you held previous office-type jobs?  I would state very strongly how organized you are, that you would like to learn a lot of how the clinic works "Behind the scenes" etc.  They may ask you how you are going to balance being a first-year grad student with an assistantship.  Also have an answer ready for the inevitable "what are you strengths and weaknesses" question (I HATE that question and I have gotten it at EVERY SINGLE interview I've ever done whether school related or job related).  

Aw, thanks guys for the encouraging words about BU. My mind keeps pondering why I was waitlisted.. My V and Q scores are technically a little low for the BU average, but. I wouldn't think that would be the reason.....but I guess I'll never know.
 
I am happy with the places I have heard back from. 2/3 is good. I guess next week I will see. I think UNC Chapel Hill and Vandy said next week.

If you are TA'ing by yourself, you should definitely address the issue broadly regarding questions that could be looked up in the textbook index, or a quick review of the slides / lecture notes.  If you are being flooded with questions the day before a quiz, the very first time it happens in the semester, I would try to answer as many as I could.  Afterwards, I'd post an announcement or email that emails concerning course material on the impending exam, sent after the final day of office hours, may not be answered in a timely fashion and you advise them to contact peers, use all available textbook and library resources in order to find their answer, and only email you as a last resort, knowing that they may or may not receive an answer.  
 
As a student, if I wait to email the TA or professor the DAY before an exam, I automatically know that I'm unlikely to get a response that I need and subsequently I would rather look up the info or consult a peer than bug the TA or professor.  
 
If you are TA'ing a class full of undergrads, there will be growing levels of independence, but you will also need to facilitate this area of their learning.  You really shouldn't fuss or refuse to answer altogether, if you haven't already advised them of what their options are.  Doing so can create a very poor academic relationship between you and your students.  I agree with what a poster above said regarding setting a deadline: this is critical for their own learning as well as your sanity.  
 
Good luck! 

The problem at UNC appears to be the grad departments delaying on the decision process... Actually, the real problem is the entity that sends out the official decisions. Many of the grad departments are not allowed to send out the decisions themselves; instead they issue a decision to the graduate school who then sends it to you. It is a darn shame but with the budget cuts NC has experienced in the past few years at the university level, all of those "extra" personnel that helped to make application season run more smoothly are now out of a job. If the way the grad school handles this process is enough to make you turn them down even if offered admission, its too bad... But from what I have been told, the professors and admissions people in each department or school are equally frustrated. I had to call four times about getting my application status and the department person told me they had sent out all offers of admission but that the graduate school was the only way they were allowed to communicate those offers, and I should be hearing shortly. After my fourth call /email, my decision was finally made available on the online site, and there is no evidence that my calls had anything to do with it actually being made available at that time, either.

It's sad that a department of mostly clerical staff, not related to the academic disciplines for which we apply, have so much affect on admissions and in turn, may cost them some great MA and PhD students.

So... here's my list of "I wish I knew" (back when). 
I wish I knew how much I would grow to dislike my first career choice. I wish I knew that SLP existed, and that it is more than just teaching kids how to say their R's and L's.  I wish I knew that I could help people with voice disorders when I was teaching middle school chorus and elementary music. I wish I knew how much I would like the medical side of SLP ... especially voice and swallowing.  I wish I knew that SLP is so much more than speech and language.  I don't regret my first career and I will always treasure those experiences and moments... but I could be SO much farther along.  Heck.  I could have my PhD by now.  

fuzzylogician, I see you posted this past posting. However, I think chopper42 is looking for answers that are SLP oriented. The posting you referenced are answers from all areas of study.

When I was getting my undergrad, I wish I had known that SLP existed. 

Here's my advice on this. The reality is that these are low scores for the GRE. I would say continue with the spirit of submitting an application, and if for your are not accepted this year, then DON'T PANIC. Getting into grad school for speech is tough. Keep in mind that at the application level, you are unfortunately only a 2-dimensional application, so maybe other facets of your application will outshine your GRE.
 
In the absolute worst case, you apply next year. Try to see every response as an opportunity, no matter what the outcome is. As I was trying to say, in the worst case scenario, and you're not accepted because of a 'test', re-take it, But the next time, take your time to learn the GRE. My Kaplan teacher once said, "the GRE doesn't test how smart you are, it tests you on how well you can take the GRE". It's really a matter of strategy and perseverance. 
 
We have no crystal ball as to how the next few months will play out, just keep positive and patient.
 
Best of luck!!!
Erica

Every time I scroll past the title of this thread my guy reaction is to reply: "Get over it."
 
As said, it's not a big deal.

This is kinda off topic from the rest of the replies, but I think signing an email with a first name is common. For example, I'd send emails to grad schools I was interested in just to ask basic questions about the application and they would almost all reply with their first name. That doesn't mean I would dare call them by their first name. I don't even know them. 

Emily Post roolz. The general etiquette when it comes to addressing someone is to use the last name until invited to do so otherwise either directly or indirectly. If a person introduces themselves or is introduced by their first name, that's an invitation. I have one professor who said grad students use her first name because we're colleagues. I have another who is Dr. ____ only to students, and first name to other faculty.
 
It's best to err on the side of etiquette in a new situation.

I am still getting used to this trend, and it still makes me a bit uneasy. I generally call them Dr/Professor X until they say to address them by their first names.

Do you have to do Spanish literature? I'm in an English lit track PhD program and I could shift my emphasis to composition or maybe tech writing. Does your department offer a different emphasis you can do that would be more interesting? You might still have to take literature courses, but if you're aiming at something else, translation, linguistics, or whatever, would you be more interested in that?

Contemplate the end result of where you are.  Does earning your PhD help accomplish a goal you have for your life after you finish the program?  Does the PhD program set you up to choose many different directions, and at least one of them includes goals you now have for yourself?  Just a couple of thoughts. 
 
I did a M.A.T. right after my undergrad, expecting to teach music k-12 as a lifelong career.  5 years into teaching, I finally found that while I enjoyed that career to a point, it just wasn't the right fit.  I did one more year of teaching while I completed pre-reqs, and now I'm back in a MS-SLP program with a much more clear direction of my life goals, career goals, talents, research ambitions, and putting that all together.  I have a much stronger sense of where I am going.  And now I also have student loans left over from the MAT degree to pay off, at some point, plus the student loans of my current MS program building.  
 
YOU are the most important person in this whole equation.  Don't finish a degree you don't see yourself ever needing or using just because of pressure.  Do what is right by your department, and investigate what needs to happen for the course(s) you are slated to teach next semester.  Above all, seek vocational counseling to help you determine your next step.  If you have an allied health sciences dept they usually have counseling from vocational and rehab departments.  You will not want to be "that person" who has started and quit a PhD program only to eventually figure out that you really should have completed it... especially since you are funded.  

Your LOR writers will know whether or not you have waived the right, which means they might not feel as comfortable writing an honest evaluation of you. The admissions committee will also know this and they may question whether or not the LOR writer was comfortable enough to actually write an honest evaluation of you. You should always waive your right -- it's not really an option, consider it like yet another EULA you click "yes I agree" to in order to install/use any software!
 
If you want to know what you need to improve on, it's probably much much better to just sit down and have an honest talk with your profs. Give them some advance notice so you don't catch them off guard. I think if you are trusting these people to write the LORs for you, then hopefully your relationship is good enough so that you can have an honest talk like this (although you might want to wait until you're about to leave if that makes everyone more comfortable).

All of the schools where I applied last year required 3 references, and 2 of them had to be academic (CSD preferably).  I had a colleague where I worked (I taught music) write me a glowing recommendation (in her words) about my work ethic, ability to learn / teach outside my main content area, and overall teaching ability.  The other two were two of my pre-req (online only) professors, so in my case it was critical to have someone who knew me face-to-face.  The other recommendations were great - one let me read it, and I heard feedback from one school about my LOR's in general.  So... if the LOR requirement is 3, shoot for 2 out of 3 to be CSD faculty.  If LOR requirement is 4, at least 2 should be CSD faculty, and that is only in your circumstance, where you have a prior Masters (so do I) and that professor can provide a GREAT reference of your academics even though it is outside CSD.  
 
That being said, double check the LOR requirements of each school before you ask for the letters. 
 
Hope that makes sense. :-)

From a teacher with a M.A.T. ... (headed back to school for Speech-Language Pathology, researching validity of standardized testing, etc.) 
 
 
1) What are the major concepts you've been teaching?  Those will determine at least 75% of your questions if not more. 
 
2) How "in depth" do you intend to test?  Does that match up with how "in depth" have you been teaching?
- If you have not been teaching above the level of definitions and connections of concepts (level 1 and 2 on Bloom's taxonomy), you should not expect your students to push to level 4 of Bloom's taxonomy.  FYI -- From most basic to most complex, Bloom's taxonomy includes: Remembering - Understanding - Applying - Analyzing - Evaluating - Creating.
 
3) You should include some questions that test the finer details of concepts that may be more important than others; include several questions pertaining to a particular topic or lecture if that materials is supposed to be more highly weighted for the content of the class. 
 
4) Regarding wording: MAKE SURE your question targets what you want it to target.  Don't leave room for mis-interpreting the question.  Many PhD professors (and not just doc students) forget this basic tenet of a valid and reliable assessment.  If the students are mis-interpreting the question or prompt, you will get a range of answers that do not coincide with the content you were trying to target, and many upset students who DID know the material you were trying to target when they see their test and hear your explanation of the question.  
- There are tons of resources online if you google "creating good questions for tests" or something along those lines.  Look for journal articles FROM THE EDUCATIONAL RESEARCHERS (not your content area) about standardized assessment.  I cannot emphasize that last part enough.  You go to your content folks for clarification on the material; you go to educators for clarification on effectively assessing the acquisition of knowledge by your students. 
 
5) Regarding choice selections: It is good to use 4 choices.  Avoid a test full of "all of the above" or "none of the above" as choice E.  Use when necessary, but overuse is confusing and inappropriate.  Additionally, you will want to use a "distractor" answer item -- one that if the student does not fully understand the concept, they might choose.  HOWEVER -- don't let the distractor item be too close or too likely.  You might think that you're giving the answer away, but that's because you know the content much better than those you are teaching.  Some will inevitably choose the distractor.  The other two choices might pertain to one or two parts of your question and would be there as choices for students who don't accurately read through the test question OR those who just haven't studied that concept.  They need to be semi-likely but could be the "opposite" answer (if there is a dichotomy of answers) OR a "not quite fully wrong" answer.  Above all -- be sure that the correct answer is truly correct and does not reference terminology that you haven't taught. 
 
- Be careful about knowing what you've taught --- what you mentioned in one sentence in a lecture 5 weeks ago is not what you taught.  What you scaffolded in instruction, built upon as a foundational concept, and was repeated at least twice is what you taught.  So many "professors" who haven't studied education need to be aware that picking some random sentence off the powerpoint is NOT the way to create a test.  If you're testing it, the question / prompt / item should be essential knowledge for your content area and should be built upon in future classes.  
 
6) If this applies to you or anyone else:  If English is NOT your first language (not making any assumptions here, just generalizing): Get a second pair of eyes on your questions from someone else in your content area to see if your use of the language is working to target the goal.  If in a TA position, your professor / mentor may be a good resource, but be careful that they're not just supporting you and not really thinking through the question.  I have had TA's with ESOL and they struggle to explain concepts and struggle even more after they get dozens of emails about the quiz they put up on blackboard -- the question written, in 90% of those cases, did not match up with what they were intending to ask.  
 
 
Honestly, the best tip for TEACHING (and assessing) is the following: "Begin with the end in mind."  If you don't know what you're going to assess, then how do you know what you're going to teach?  This is just a self-analytical idea -- not accusatory of you or anyone else.  Look back through and think about what the "take home" messages are from your classes.  Did you effectively teach them?  Is it worthy of assessing on a M/C test, or should it be assessed in some other way (such as a short essay, project, whatever).  If you didn't effectively teach them, (1) the answer choice distribution will be variable and not normalized; (2) you will have "smarties" who struggle unnecessarily.  
 
 
There is an art to creating a good M/C test.  Knowing what you intend to assess BEFORE you start teaching is a key place to start.  Hopefully you have been doing that all along.  
 
 
Good luck!