BrianM
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Posts posted by BrianM
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How is it unfair? It's like taking an exam and scoring high, but having a low percentile, and then your buddy takes the same exam, on the same scale, but scores lower percentile wise. The exam is the same, it's simply who you are scored against that is different.
It is unfair, and the whole process is too.
My % rank show down almost 20% because of this stupid adjustment. Good job ETS.
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I am in the same position... it sucks. What did you end up doing
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Since it would be your 3rd time retaking it I say go for it.
But I completely understand where you are.
I studied for months, hours every day, and got a 970 on the old scale....I was so angry!
I am retaking it again this Saturday, and whatever score I receive I will stick with.
I will not give ETS more money , and I will not study any longer for this test.
There have to be professors out there and programs that do not weigh it as much, and hopefully they understand the test is a waste of time and money....but I guess only time will tell.
Good luck!
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I just took my first new practice test on the ETS software and got 20/40 on math and 21/40 right on verbal.
But, it says I got a 153 on verbal and a 143 on math?
This doesn't make sense...unless the "easier" questions are worth .25 or so points.
Anyone have any insight?
This is really disheartening as if I got 150 on math I would be breaking 1000 for the first time on an official ETS practice test
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It is really hard to improve your verbal. I had the same score on my verbal 2 weeks ago on the GRE as when I took it 2 years ago. I spent 5 months studying as well.
I would say stop studiyng the 1000 words, because I doubt any of them will be, and if they are they might not be a big help.
Try using the strategies but even those don't work well when you are taking the actual test.
Verbal is pretty much a crapshoot unless you speak like 18th ct writers.
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I will resurrect this.
I hope there are some more stories...and I agree Mal83, it is quite ridiculous that people complain about a 1300, or a 1200. I got a 970 after studying for 4 months, how about that for bad. And my verbal stayed the same as 2 years ago when i first took it.
I take it again in 2 weeks and have 0 faith that I will do well.
But hopefully some kinda and intelligent professor will look at my whole package and accept me, as I am more than capable at completing a Ph.D.
I already have a masters if that is any indication that I can work at a graduate level.
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The problem with low GREs is that they might cause people to question the rigor of your undergraduate program. It might be that you are a "poor test taker," but presumably you had to pass many tests during your undergraduate career, and you should have learned how to cope with the stress or whatever your issues were. The GRE is a test you can study for, so perhaps you don't know how to focus your studying appropriately. This might also be concerning to admissions committees. In other words, it is worth the effort to make sure you achieve acceptable GRE scores. They do not need to be perfect, but they should be very close to the average scores for the programs you hope to get into. According to data published by the school, the students in my program had (old scoring) totals above 1400. I don't know if the program selected for high scores, or if all applicants were in the same range, but why give them an easy way to eliminate you?
No offense but that is pretty much a stupid way of thinking.
The gre is NOT a test you can study for. Just because YOU did well does not mean other people will do well.
I studied since late March and took it last week...got a 970.
I study a few weeks for a psych exam and get a 96. Correlation of test in undergrad and the GRE? My ass.
The GRE is a mindless test that tests if you can tell which triangles can be solved, and how many unused 17th ct words you know.
it is disgusting that the admissions process puts so much weight on this idiotic test. I know they need "something" to weed out applicants. well how about research exp, clinical exp, classwork, etc.
And "learned how to cope with the stress" ? Really? You speak really easily. I get really anxious over this stupid test because of the weight so many put on it.
Some people can not do well on this dumb test because they just can't. Thousands of people are incredibly intelligent and can not do well on this test, I guess being a poor test taker makes them an idiot?
The gre is worthless and should be abolished, but since it is a huge money making monster, it never will.
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I just took my gre and got 147 and 146, pretty close to the ETS one. :|
When I took a full Kaplan test I got a 1130 total though on the old test...so idk what happened
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I wouldn't recommend the Kaplan workbooks. YMMV, but the Kaplan Verbal workbook had me completely psyched out. I scored pitifully on all the Kaplan Verbal practice tests and eventually just gave up on using them. On the actual GRE, I got 750-800 range, so there was no real correlation. The Kaplan passages are very poorly written and the correct answers virtually demand that you overstate conclusions that don't follow from the text itself.
The Math Workbook was similar enough to the sort of questions you get on the GRE, but if you don't have a background in math, like me, you'll find the explanations in the text fairly inadequate, so you'll constantly be going off to look things up elsewhere.
Do you mean the Kaplan math workbook?
I have been using all the Kaplan and Princteon Review books. I hope my scores on the kaplan practice tests and sets are representative of the test tomorrow!
I have found them useful so far...
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I also did remarkably poor on the quantitative section when I took the test last year. My percentile rank for the verbal section was slightly lower than yours and my AW score was not nearly as impressive, but it was enough for me to get accepted into my first-choice program with full-funding (a package that included a two-year fellowship). What follows is a bit of a cautionary tale. Late in the application process, one of my recommenders advised me to retake the test to raise my quantitative score if only to improve my chance of receiving a competitive fellowship. I retook the GRE and regretted wasting the money as I was only able to marginally increase my quantitative score, and I’m not even sure the scores were received by the schools before the deadline.
Bottom line: if you want to be considered for competitive fellowships at top-tier universities, then retaking the test to improve your quantitative score may be beneficial, esp. for the ivies. However, and this is important, I think your scores are strong enough that I wouldn’t even consider retaking the test until you’ve produced an exceptional writing sample and SOP. I did not apply to the same program as you, but I applied and was accepted into a humanities program at one of the schools on your list (not an ivy) and they made it clear during the admitted students’ reception that the GRE scores have very little weight overall. The keynote speaker was literally laughing at the notion that the GRE played any role in our acceptance, but then he started to back-pedal when his laugh became too derisive, because let's face it, scores are obviously somewhat important in funding decisions—that said, every university and every department’s standards are different. Sorry for the mixed advice, but that's the way it goes.
Thanks for that! It is great to hear when certain schools basically shun the gres. I took a practice test from the ETS book last night in my GRE course and I pretty much flunked it so I have been feeling horrible since.
It is weird because I took a practice test from kaplan on Sunday and got a score of about 155 on both sections!!!
Hopefully some nice professor out there has mercy on my soul and pays attention my credentials rather than to this test.
Deisdeis, that's awesome that you emailed a potential advisor asking that! I've been too scared to do that lol!
I don't know if you know this, or if it has been mentioned but your letters of rec writers can also mention and reason for a low GRE score. That may help as well.
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I definitely want to do research, but research on texts, not research involving populations or other types of quantitative data. (Or at least, not quantitative data that needs to be analyzed algebraically!) I agree with you - the math was killer! I'm so impressed with the scores people have been getting around here.
Are max scores on the verbal unusual? Maybe it will offset how completely heinous the math score is, haha!
Yes lol. At least for my field, psych, people get lower verbal than math scores about 80% of the time.
I think your high verbal wil def offset your low scores.
Do the programs you want to go to have cutt of scores for the gre?
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I meant that I would spend 8+ hours a day, AT LEAST 4 days a week, and for about 2 months. So, roughly, 32 hours a week, give or take a couple hours. My life literally consisted of GRE, work, eat, sleep. Yikes.
Same here, not fun when the result isn't what you want huh?
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Alright on Verbal? Lol, that's the max score!! You did perfect on Verbal, how did you manage that?
We are in the same boat w math so don't feel bad lol.
Math is terrible on the test, just as is verbal but I am sure for what you want to do math is not imporant what so ever. Unless you want to do research?
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Depends on a lot of factors. For example: research exp, letters of rec, fit with potential adviser, etc. Honestly, most people anywhere will tell you that those gre scores will not cut it. But then again lots of schools I am applying to do not have a cut off, so it would be incredibly unfair for them to just look at ONE insignificant aspect of your application and toss you out.
I have heard stories of people with a total of a 1000 combined making it to about 3 interviews out of 10 applied schools. And they got in!
Then I heard of people with almost perfect scores and great undergrad stats, and don't make it anywhere.
So it really is variable and depends on a bunch of factors.
I would say, retake it just one more time and see what happens, now that you can select which scores you want to send you can just send whichever is better.
Who knows, you might get lucky and get a better score!
I'm in the same boat as you, horrible at this stupid test and freaking out!
I'm taking it in less than 2 weeks, I took a course and it did not help one bit! Such a waste of money....and it was taught by a cognitive psychologist!!!
Also I have been studying for 4 months now, hardcore! Every day, hours and hours.
My practice test, although I was frustrated and skipped a few math questions and did not really go back and check them, was almost 200 points higher since I took the GRE in 2010.
So I say retake it, you never know:) Best of luck!!!!!
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I will repeat what the other poster said: you will need above 1200 minimum to be seriously considered for a PhD program. Do not underestimate the depth of competition. Programs may not have an official cutoff for GREs and they may look at the overall application, but many applicants will have comparable or better applications plus much better GRE scores.
In my subfield, a lot of programs saw as many as twice the average numberof applications this past cycle. I have a master's with a 3.957 GPA, 1450 (V:720, Q:730, W: 5.0) GRE, 760 Psych GRE score. I applied to 12 PhD programs this past cycle and squeaked by with an acceptance off a waitlist at a total of one school.
Again, this is not the time to be idealistic. Do whatever it takes, within ethical considerations, to get your GRE score above 1200 at least. Do whatever it takes to get more research experience.
I am in a course, and have about 10 books, and have been studying since late March. I still have trouble, some people are good test takers and others aren't. All the gre does is ruin people's lives. I will not retake it again if I score about a 1000-1100, its incredibly unfair and hopefully some professors know that.
Well I won't be applying to "competitive" schools, but I guess in this economy all schools are competitive.
Also, I will be applying to about 23 schools so maybe that will help, and I have also emailed the professors I am interested in so hopefully the will truely look at my app.
And I hear that fit is more important that a meaningless GRE score. Hopefuly I will land a position with a professor who does not put too much weight into that worthless test.
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I don't know anything about music programs but I do know that now you can pick which scores you can send to your schools.
You can't mix and match best scores from different tests, but you can send the best set to w.e school you want.
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Thats why I prefer to send my applications in Ireland and Scotland eventually! Why is still this process of having to take the GRE's ?Why isn't the 4 years holding my head over the tons of books to get a good grade not enough? And even so, must these exams be so god damn pain..? Why in UK is not a test such the GRE? And in UK and Ireland there are very good universities as well..
Simple answer is money.
ETS makes billions from everything that goes into testing its disgusting. Every stats class I have had states that the GRES has no validity or reliability, something we are all familiar with.
Yet, we are still forced to take it. I have gotten over being frustrated over it, I was seriously getting massive headaches because of this test. Now I am just trying to be calm, accepting of it, and just trying to do my best.
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If 1100 is the cutoff, successful appliants are probably higher.
But more optimistically for lower-scorers, the sample of universities that report their scores is probably biased upwards.That is, it's bragging to say, "Our admitted students typically have GRE scores >1200," so universities that can say that advertise it. In contrast, schools whose incoming students have lower GRE scores just don't mention it, so the selection bias gives a false impression that you need an exceptionally high score to get in anywhere.
I hadn't thought of that!
That is really encouraging. Thanks!
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Well I really only know about Clinical Psych programs, but I applied with a masters just like you. I would say that having a masters definitely helped me during the application process; however, it will not save you from the trash pile if your GRE scores aren't above the cutoff. GRE's don't tell you how well you perform at a graduate level...they tell you how good you are at the GREs lol It gives them an objective measure they can use to cut down the large numbers of applicants. Low GRE's and GPA's are the first criteria many schools use to initially narrow down the applicant pool. If your GRE's aren't high enough, they might not even look at your resume/CV to know that you have your masters. You should want to get a score of 1300 or higher on your GREs, 1200 at the very minimum. I know someone who is BRILLIANT who has a perfect graduate GPA, is first author on several publications in big journals, and is honestly just impressive in every way...only thing was that they scored 1160 on the GRE's...unfortunately, they had to do several rounds of applications, and ultimately, they weren't able to even get an interview invite till they raised their GREs to 1200...I honestly could not believe how unfair it was...but that's how it is. I'm not telling you this to scare you. I'm telling you so that you can seize the opportunity to study as hard as you can while you still have a few months till app deadlines! Personally, I know exactly what you're going through - I'm usually not a good standardized test taker...BUT I studied like my life depended on it for 4 months straight, all summer, everyday, and I was able to get respectable scores my first try - so there IS hope!!!! You can do it - you've gotten this far!!! The final hurdle!
Thanks for the reply!
Most schools I am applying to say they have either no cut off or some around 1100 or 1200, but that they look at the whole application.
Hopefully emailing the professors like I have, and will again, will remind them to pull mine out of the pile.
I have been studying for 3 months now and still see only a little improvement. I am not good at these tests, but I won't go into my rant about them.
Also I am applying to 20+ schools and most are not really competitive. So I am confident, even with a 1000 on the GREs that I will get at least one interview!
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Hi all,
I, like many, am freaking out about the coming application process. I am confident in my past record but believe that the only thing holding me back would be the GREs.
I took the exam 2 years ago and got an 840 total. I have been studying since April and took a practice test last week. I got a 970 total, although I forgot to do the last 3 math problems and just pressed finish. D'oh!
So I was wondering if getting around a 1000 or 1100 would be enough for most schools to at least look at my apps.
I have been doing everything right as far as applications are concerned. I have been emailing professors and asking if they are taking students. I have been doing research, undergrad for one year and grad for over a year(which will be presented at a conference and am a co-author on). I am also starting my own research in which I will be a co-author.
My letters of rec will be strong, I am getting them from two professors who know me well and another who is helping me on research that will have known me for about seven months when he writes the letter. The other two were professors, one being the person I helped out with research and am a co-author on her study.
I was a teachers assistant for a semester in undergrad so I have that experience.
My GPA was also a 3.59 for grad school.
Does having a masters help low GRE scores? I would imagine it proves that I have the ability to perform well at the graduate level.
Is it really the be all end all? I hear different things from different people and know that for all schools its different.
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Really? University of Toronto required my GRE scores when I applied last Fall.
Same here, I'm applying to British Columbia and they require it, as well as the others mentioned above.
OP- I'm in the same as you mate, I've taken the GREs before and got an 840 total. I made it into all the Master's programs I applied to, (6 schools) but now I am applying to Ph.D programs.
I keep freaking out thinking that the GREs are the be all end all of the application process. But lots of the schools I see state there are either no cut offs or they they look at the whole package first before throwing out your app.
Some more competitive schools state that there is a 1200 or 1100 cut off. I don't know where people get the 1300 number, maybe from schools like Princeton or Harvard lol.
Good Luck! We all freak out together
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ETS doesn't care about anyones opinions. Only people's opinions that will cause them to make more money. If they could somehow weasel a harder section into the test they would, as long as it caused people to spend money on classes and tests.
Its really sad this test even exists, I don't believe in the whole, "it differentiates between 2 similar candidates". To me its all about money and I am sure the universities get something out of this for making students take it.
- Fresh Brew and Hanyuye
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Well, the ones on the website are going to be averages, probably based on what ETS expects to see based on past testing. Actually even two scores of 144 aren't necessarily comparable; that's why they give the percentile for your score for that exact test along with the number. A 144 in one case might put you in the 60th (my numbers arbitrary) percentile, while a 144 on a later version of the same test might put you in the 65th percentile, compared to everyone else who took it.
So, once you take the test and get your scores, you'll know your exact percentile.
Ah, thanks.
So they will remain in the general region, with about a 5 to 10 % rank difference I assume?
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How accurate are the percentile ranks from the ETS site?
It doesn't make too much sense that a 600 on the old test = a 144 about.
Is this really correct? And how would this change in July when the percentile ranks are "updated"
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Anyone?
Been studying for 6 months and seeing NO improvement on verbal score
in GRE/GMAT/etc
Posted
I will never come back on these forums again but I want to leave this last note for you.
I took the GREs again last Saturday and got 1050-1070!
My verbal went up almost a hundred points, and what I did was use Princeton Review's 1044 question book.
The verbal sections really help build your instincts for getting better grades.
So I would say do that.
My math stayed the same but I had a 570 on math and a 490 on verbal, with some fluctuations.
F YOU GRES!!!!! DIE!!!!! I AM FREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!