feraleyes

We finally have a place to live! So now I can join the "Oh crap, now I have to move my stuff" party.
 
It took us forever to find a place. Rentals in the area were kind of a nightmare, all geared toward undergrads, and moving with a family and pets made it really tough. But what we ended up with is something out of a fairy tale: a stone cottage 7 miles from campus, backed by woods and next to an organic farm. I had goosebumps when we drove to look at it.
 
A little worried about paying for living expenses before hubs has a job in the area. A lot worried, really. But still riding the high of finding the best house EVAR.

This is a very informative thread!
 
About the US - I'd like to add that perhaps it would be better for the US to invest more funding into tertiary education, to reduce the cost of education - as Canada does.
 
Brazilian and Indian systems are almost completely run by the government and hence, costs are not high. Their problem is more to sort out the recruitment and the entire academic job system - the way it functions.
 
India is a classic example of how to destroy a well-structured tertiary education system by its own people. 
 
The argument given here makes sense, as when  these Indians come to a Western country, they do very well. They are obviously talented researchers.
 
For Canada - I don't know if it's right to involve the Undergraduates in the faculty appointment process. I'm not sure they have the expertise for the process. But the way Canada looks at funding the tertiary education as an investment in social welfare is quite commendable.
 
I hope we'll see more accounts from other countries as well.

Here's how it works in Canada, for the physical sciences. I'm going to assume the "traditional" path (i.e. going into the field right away, not taking time off etc.)
 
1. Getting into an undergraduate program / a BSc.
There are two main paths that Canadian students use. 
 
a- Direct entry to a University. Students take certain required high school science and math courses and admission is based mostly on the average score on these subjects. Some schools will allow/require applicants to submit "supplemental" applications where they write essays, get letters of recommendation, and show other things like community involvement. Things might have changed since I did this (8 years ago) but if your grades are high enough, you can just get in -- the supplemental stuff is only required if you are borderline. Also, there are no standardised tests (like the SAT or GRE).
 
b- College then transfer to University. Some students will attend a college first, for about 2 years, then transfer to a University. Colleges are institutions that usually do not grant 4 year degrees in science (but they might in something like business). There isn't much research either -- they are mostly for teaching!  The 2-year college program is designed to be transferable to a 4-year university -- there is a system in place to keep the courses aligned with each other. However, it might still take a transfer student 3 years at the University to complete the BSc.
 
Either way, the student generally leave with a BSc or an Honours BSc. Top grad programs in Canada prefer students with an honours degree. An honours degree usually requires the student to maintain a certain GPA, maintain a full courseload (5 courses per semester), take about 10% more credits, and complete an honours/senior research thesis. 
 
As for tuition -- in most of Canada, University tuition costs about $5000 per year plus books. College tuition is about $3000 per year. There are scholarships (merit-basis) or bursaries (needs-basis) available, but most of them will only pay for the first year. Student loans are available from the government on a needs-basis and usually you can get a few thousand dollars per year forgiven (don't have to pay it back). These loans are interest-free until 6 months after graduation. 
 
There are no private universities that perform scientific research in Canada (nothing comparable to say, the Ivy League or Caltech). The public universities are mostly funded by the government (although this has dropped slightly below 50% in recent years), so the real cost of tuition is probably at least 2-3 times the numbers quoted above. International student tuition is much higher (about 3 times higher). I think the general philosophy is that since educating our population will create overall benefits for society, every student's education is partially subsidized by taxpayer dollars. In the province of Quebec, they have even higher taxes and Quebec residents have access to even cheaper tuition (about half the amount that the rest of the country pays). 
 
2. The next step is to go to graduate school and get a Masters degree. There are no standardised tests in Canada for graduate school -- the main criteria is your academic performance and research experience. Students submit essays and letters of reference from former supervisors.

The MSc program is usually 2 years and is fully funded. MSc and PhD programs in Canada are separate programs, however many students will choose to stay with the same supervisor from MSc to PhD (see next step). Graduate admission in Canada is more like the job hiring process. Students submit their applications to the school, and there is a committee that decides which ones meet the standard for the school. Then, they forward the applications to the profs that are named in each application (and/or the profs that meet the applicant's interests). It is usually then up to each prof to decide whether or not they want to accept that student since the prof is responsible for a large portion of the student's stipend. The department is also responsible for a portion of the stipend too (through awards or TAships) so there might be some negotiation between profs and the department if the total number of students wanted exceed the budget. However, this usually means that a MSc student is admitted to a school to work with a specific prof or research group.
 
This is because the MSc program is generally research heavy. In the two years, the students take courses and do research concurrently. The courseload is pretty light, usually 4-6 courses over the two years, and research usually starts as soon as the student arrives, although most students don't make a lot of progress until the first summer. After the two years, the student is expected to have completed a MSc project, write a thesis, and defend it in some kind of oral examination. Unlike PhD work, the MSc project does not have to be original research or even publishable quality work, although it generally is. 
 
Funding comes from doing work as a TA, money from the supervisor's grant (to pay for the research work you do on your thesis) and fellowships awarded by the school or external agencies (such as the government). The funding packages have values that typically range from $25,000 per year to $35,000 per year at the MSc level. However, the student is expected to pay for tuition out of this money. Tuition is about $4000 to $7000 per year. 
 
3. After the MSc, the next step is to get into a PhD program and complete it!
 
The standard path is to apply to a PhD program after completing your MSc. Most students stay at the same school, but you have to reapply to the school since it's a separate program. You would even have to get transcripts and letters of reference from your own supervisor! However, this is mostly a formality. This also allows the student to change schools or just change supervisors (or change projects with the same supervisor) from MSc to PhD. If the student is extending their MSc work to a PhD, they can probably finish in an additional 3 years. If they change schools or projects, it might take another 4 years. 
 
There are two common exceptions though!
a- Many schools will allow MSc students to "skip" to the PhD program after the first year of the MSc. This allows them to skip the whole MSc thesis/defense thing and probably finish their entire degree in 4-5 years total. Each school/department has their own regulations of what is required to do this, but some people will recommend that you complete the MSc first!
 
b- Some schools will follow the US system and only admit students to a direct-PhD program. These students might get a MSc along the way for completing coursework, like the US system.
 
For a PhD, there would be additional course requirements. Unlike the US system, courses aren't front-loaded necessarily...usually students take them throughout their years. Most schools have some kind of comprehensive exam partway through and the comps are also a defense of the PhD student's thesis proposal in front of a committee (which is usually the eventual thesis committee). Many programs will consider the successfully defended proposal a "contract" -- i.e. once the student completes everything in the proposal, then they are ready to graduate! PhD level work must be original research and definitely publishable quality. The thesis can be a traditional manuscript, but some places will accept 3 first authored papers by the student instead. This kind of thesis would usually just require reformatting the published papers into thesis format, and some introduction, transitional text, and summarizing text added. 
 
Funding for PhD students work the same way as MSc students, above. Some programs may award higher stipends to PhD students.
 
4. After the PhD, the next step is usually post-doctoral positions for the academia-oriented graduate. These are 2-3 year research only positions. I think it's expected that you do at least one, usually two stints as a post-doc before you are seriously considered for tenure-tracked positions. At this stage, you are almost solely evaluated on your research performance/output. Transcripts from grad school are not usually needed, except for maybe fellowship applications. Most Canadians seem to do at least one post-doc outside of Canada if they did their PhD in Canada. 
 
5. The next step for someone who wants to be a tenured faculty member at a research university is to hope to get hired on a tenure-tracked position. Usually these are assistant professorships at Universities. The hiring process is a big deal. The Department usually have to compete with other departments in order to get the Dean/University to award a professorship position to them. The Department forms a search committee to solicite applicants. The committee usually consists of faculty members of all rankings, and some graduate student representatives. Sometimes undergraduates are involved as well. After they make a shortlist, these applicants visit the school for interviews and to give "job talks" -- usually these are department seminar or colloquia. Research is probably the main criteria, but teaching is also something that might be valued, depending on the department.
 
6. After someone is hired as an assistant professor, there is some period of time (usually about 5 years) before they are considered for tenure (and promotion to Associate Professor). In this period of time, the new faculty member is working really hard to generate a lot of research, serve on committees etc. When it's time for tenure review, it's an evaluation by a committee again. Sometimes students are directly involved in the committee, but the department might ask the students to write in letters in support of or against a faculty member up for tenure. If the tenure application is not successful, this usually means the dismissal (but not always) of the faculty member.
 
7. After getting tenure, then the Assistant Prof is considered for promotion to Full Professor some 5 ish years later. The process is similar to the tenure review. The difference between Full and Assistant Prof is mostly only in department bylaws (for example, they might require the department head be a Full Prof etc.).
 
That's pretty much all I know about how it works in Canada. Obviously, I know more about the earlier stages (that i've experienced or know people who have done so), so my descriptions are longer in these steps! 
 
As for my opinion, I think this works great. You only pay out of pocket during undergrad (and it's already mostly subsidized). Grad school is basically a job (and the admission/hiring process is like that of a job). I'd consider grad school as some sort of apprenticeship, where you are slightly underpaid for your skills in exchange for the ability to learn/develop them. In the physical sciences in Canada, graduate students are generally treated decently and our stipends are generous compared to other fields. The take-home stipend amounts are even above the poverty line in most cases!

This is a great thread!
 
I'll talk about Indian situation, which is somewhat similar to the Brazilian one, but not exactly. The system is the same for the STEM and for the Arts, Humanities and Social Sciences disciplines.
 
India has a 3 years bachelor's degree, which will soon be changed to a 4-years degree, mostly to help those students who want to apply to the US universities, as the 3-years Indian Bachelor's is not regarded at par with the 4 years Bachelor's in the US.
 
One can have an Honours (Major) and one or two optional subjects (Minor) in the Bachelor's level.
 
Admission into Bachelor's is based on the % of marks one gets in the High school level - this is the only criteria for admission into college and hence, given the exploding population of India, there is a stiff competition for getting admission into prestigious colleges.
 
After the Bachelor's, it is mandatory to go through the Master's before registering for a research degree. Bachelor's is not enough to apply for a PhD, as is the case in many Western countries.
 
Entrance into Masters in the prestigious universities is based on a very competitive entrance test, in which hundreds of candidates compete for a few dozen seats. 
 
In lesser known universities, it is again based on the % of marks obtained in the Bachelor's level.
 
 Master's is a 2-years programme. After this, in top universities such as those in Delhi, it is mandatory to go through a 2 years MPhil (Master of Philosophy) before registering for a PhD. In other, lesser known universities, MPhil is not required and is not offered. Students go straight from the Masters to the PhD level.
 
Again, in the top-level universities, admission into MPhil is based on a competitive exam, comprising of written test as well as an interview, in which a tentative research proposal is submitted and cross-examined by the faculty. Again, only about 10% of applicants can hope to gain admission into MPhil.
 
MPhil is a research degree, spanning 2 years in the most rigorous universities, out of which first year has course work and the second year requires writing a dissertation and defending it in a viva before the dissertation committee and an external examiner. In some universities MPhil is of 18 months. 
 
Thus, a candidate registering for PhD in India already has 5-7 years of tertiary education. Those with MPhil have already written a post-Masters level dissertation and defended it.
 
PhD admission in the most prestigious universities is based on the past grades, an application including a research proposal and an interview in which the faculty cross-examines the candidate on the research proposal and related questions. In lesser universities, the format of the admission is the same, but the procedure is less rigorous.
 
PhD spans not less than 5 years in most cases in the most prestigious universities and in many cases can go upto 9 years (not including Masters and MPhil).
 
On the other hand, lesser known universities can grant a PhD after 2 or 2 and a half years and the PhD is much less rigorous in these universities.
 
In India, it's a good quality primary and secondary school education that is expensive and few people have the resources to get their children educated at these schools. But after one completes the school education, tertiary education is highly subsidised and one has to pay very nominal fees and needs to have money only for personal expenses.
 
The University never asks a candidate whether they have the money to support their University education - it's the candidate's headache, not the University's - that's the difference between a developing country and a developed country. 
 
From Masters onwards, most candidates get a scholarship for fees and personal expenses and for MPhil and PhD, one can get a luxurious fellowship on passing a highly competitive fellowship exam.
 
Resources in Sciences labs vary from being very well-funded at prestigious universities to being strapped for resources at other places.
 
All the Universities and most of the Engineering and Medicine institutions are owned and funded by the government. Private institutions are lesser in number and are much lower in prestige value than the government-owned ones. There are some run by the Christian Missionaries, funded by the Churches in the West that are regarded as prestigious, but these are few in number.
 
Engineering Bachelor's is a 4 years degree and hence, at par with the US degree. The IITs (Indian Institute of Technology) are very prestigious and IIT undergraduates get either a funded admission or a job offer in the US and other Western countries quite easily.
 
Post-Bachelor's, engineering students can get an MTech and a PhD if they like. Admission is again based on competitive entrance exams in BTech, MTech and PhD levels. The Engineering entrance exam is highly competitive and out of thousands who appear, only a few hundred qualify. 
 
Similarly, MBBS degree is of 4 years and admission is based o a highly competitive exam. After the MBBS, one can get an MS and go for super-specialization if one wishes. All admissions are based on very competitive entrance exams.
 
Engineering and MBBS degrees are much more expensive than the normal college and University degrees in other subjects. Besides the government-run moderately priced institutions, there are many private institutions where large amount of money is required to get these degrees.
 
One can get a Master's in Business Administration (MBA) after a Bachelor's in any subject. Admission into MBA programmes is based on very competitive entrance exams and these programmes are usually very expensive. 
 
In India, a PhD is not necessary to get a regular job in a University. High Second Class Master's is the required degree, along with passing an eligibility exam conducted by the government for getting into university jobs.
 
All University jobs are government jobs.
 
In more recent years, the government has made rules about granting points for publications and conference papers. However, there is no check on where the publications should come from and where papers should be presented. The emphasis is more on quantity rather than quality.
 
Hence, immediately after getting a Master's, candidates begin to look for academic jobs. Given the swelling population of India, each year the number of candidates multiplies by several-fold. This causes stiff competition - almost cruel in nature. There are large number of candidates having same qualifications applying for very few jobs.
 
This means, that appointments in reality are not based on merit and knowledge of a candidate, but on what kind of powerful contacts one has. The result is that almost always quality is compromised and mediocrity is very consciously promoted. This is the bane of Indian academia.  
 
To add to the problem, Indian work laws provide that a person in a regular job - called a "permanent job" in India - at par with the tenured jobs in the US - can't be fired. They get all the health, travel and living benefits over the salary and don't have to face any serious quality checks in their work. They need to show some publications for promotion, but there is no check on where the publication should come from. It's easy to show the required number of publications and keep on getting promoted.
 
Because mostly mediocre people are hired and the more brilliant researchers are sidelined, these people who get the jobs, try to suppress innovative research from their students - because they suffer from a sense of insecurity. This happens in all universities of India - including the most prestigious ones.
 
So, the problem in Indian academia is not that there is any lack of talent, resources or universities with good infrastructure. The problem is that innovative, critical research of younger scholars is consciously killed by their seniors.
 
Because of this, most talented candidates try to leave India as soon as possible after getting a Master's degree - because Indian 3 years Bachelor's is not accepted in the West. They leave not because there is any lack of resources, but because they know they can't grow after a certain stage.
 
From the prestigious institutions, in the STEM disciplines the emigration to the West after Master's or even after PhD is almost 100% - same as from the IITs.
 
In the Arts, Humanities and in the Social Sciences, emigration happens after Master's or MPhil stage for Master's or PhD admission in the West. The % of emigration is lesser because even in the West there are lesser opportunities in these disciplines. But whoever is a good researcher and knows it, leaves.
 
Only such people stay in the Indian academia, who are mediocre, but know they can use non-academic routes to get a permanent job in India - from where they can't be fired.
 
Thus, a person who has a regular job in an Indian university is more likely than not to be a mediocre academic. Those who have taken a long time to find their feet despite a good publication record are likely to be much better than those who have got the job. And eventually they do find their way out of India at some stage.
 
This is really the problem with the Indian academic system, not the lack of resources. And as far as I can see, it can't be solved. 

Can anyone else believe that they are going to be doing their PhD?
 
I have to keep pinching myself.

Alright, I'm gonna cheer you guys up. Please, if you haven't been accepted anywhere yet, don't read. And keep the faith-- it only takes one.

Some highlights from the last week or two.

In the student union here, one of those wonderful old grand collegiate buildings, with dusty paintings of past presidents and fancy old stone arches and a flag room, where in the holiday season they get this giant Christmas tree and the local elementary school kids come and sing carols, they keep a fire going in the winter. It was snowing out. I sat in a chair next to the fireplace, facing the window, and just read what I was interested in reading for hours. No purpose, not for a class, not stressing out taking notes, just reading in front of the fire.

I got an email from one of my students. She's one of our brilliant engineering students. The first couple years of engineering are hell, here. They come right out tell the students: we're trying to get you to quit. You're not going to make it. She was looking to see if I would write her a letter of recommendation. She said that she had gone into the semester expecting my class to be a drag, but that it ended up being her favorite class. She told me that I was the only instructor who knew her name.

Yesterday, I got lost in a research spiral for four hours.

In my building, there's the Purdue Online Writing Lab, there's the journal Arthuriana, there's an Indigenous and Endangered Languages lab, there's an audiology and phonology clinic where little kids run around with diodes on their heads so we can do brain scans, there's an Xbox hidden in a room undergrads don't know about, if you need to blow off some steam.... Our offices are mixed between the different programs and subdivisions. In mine, we've got people doing rhet/comp, ESL, SLS, lit and philosophy, theory and cultural studies, getting their MFA. Sometimes I just sit around and listen to them gab about their projects and research. Wherever you guys go, you'll be surrounded by brilliant people doing amazing things. Forget imposter syndrome. People are doing real research, right next to you-- you can't help but feel inspired.

Sometimes my students come to my office hours just to hang and gab about music and movies. I put my feet up on the desk and joke about how hard engineering is.

There's never any money, and the car broke down again, and I can't afford to fly home for my best friend's engagement party. But even in Lafayette, IN, there's a bunch of cool bars where you can get cheap hoppy beer and good pretzels. My girlfriend and I go to concerts and see free movies on campus. Yesterday I helped some brilliant young students carry their solar electric car into the union. We just built the world's fastest campus supercomputer and an electrical wire only four atoms thick. That stuff moves me. There's a farmers market, April through October, just down the street from our house. I try to bike to school twice a week. The secretary will let you sneak some free printing if you're nice to her and I order free books from publishers all the time. Tomorrow I've getting together with some people in my cohort so we can write a panel proposal for the Watson conference. My curriculum design class is putting together an IEP that's actually going to be implemented; you can get cheap milkshakes at the convenience store in the Stewart center. I'm growing a big bushy grad school beard, because why not? The director of my program is brilliant and caring. She's on leave this semester, so she wrote us a letter. She ended it by saying "I love you all," and she really meant it.

On Fridays, I can sleep in as long as I want.

You guys are gonna have everything you wanted. This is just the bullshit you have to put up with for just a bit longer. In 8 months, you'll be ensconced in your programs, and the idea that you could care that some other program rejected you is going to seem like an absurd dream. All of this will be worth it the moment you're writing and researching and you get there and say, yeah-- that's what I want to say. Just hold on.

This is, perhaps, going to sound strange, but can you tell me how course registration went? I'm looking at the course offerings for fall and I'm already excited. Wanted to know when registration happens and what the chances are that I'll actually be able to enroll in courses I'm excited about.

hi all,
 
kinda like lmac.... i got word from the last school i applied to and i got in. waiting on funding information which seems like a big challenge. but note: i got rejected from the first 7 schools that i applied to. 
 
i recently talked to a co-worker who told me that his wife applied to phd programs for 3 rounds until she got in. if you want it keep going for it. it only takes one.

Any recommendations for apartment complexes to check out or avoid?  I'll likely be attending UF as a Philosophy grad student.

Not because it is, apparently, a Lovecraftian nightmare where the living envy the dead?
 
Artist's rendering of emoryenglishphd's thesis defense.
 

I called up UF on Friday night (it was morning there, owing to the time difference) and was shocked and thrilled to be notified by Professor Sidney Dobrin, graduate coordinator, that my name was at the top of the acceptance list!! He further mentioned that acceptances will be e-mailed next week (this week) and explained my funding package to me. Really excited as he was very kind and forthcoming with the things the adcomm loved about my application and since his area is posthumanism too, he'd read my WS and loved it!!
 
I'm guessing everyone will be notified very soon.
 
P.S. they have an incoming cohort of 6 PhD candidates this year out of about 150 applications.
 
Hope this helps

I called up UF on Friday night (it was morning there, owing to the time difference) and was shocked and thrilled to be notified by Professor Sidney Dobrin, graduate coordinator, that my name was at the top of the acceptance list!! He further mentioned that acceptances will be e-mailed next week (this week) and explained my funding package to me. Really excited as he was very kind and forthcoming with the things the adcomm loved about my application and since his area is posthumanism too, he'd read my WS and loved it!!
 
I'm guessing everyone will be notified very soon.
 
P.S. they have an incoming cohort of 6 PhD candidates this year out of about 150 applications.
 
Hope this helps

@ sebastianteddy I'm sorry to hear of the reply to your e-mail. But looking at your signature one can safely say you've come up trumps this season and have some great choices to choose from!! 
 
I still hope UF turns out to be an acceptance for you  and will be rooting for you!

Hmm... well maybe it's not over yet? Who knows what's going on there... 
 
But again, major congrats! 

I called up their office and was directed to the grad secretary as well.  She said she'd seen my name somewhere and I assumed she was referring to the e-mails I'd sent her prior  to submitting my application asking her many questions. She kept me on hold for a while and I assumed she'd forgotten . She then came back and said she was transferring the call to the graduate coordinator , I presumed at that point that they'd lost my application or something.
 
 
and...THANK YOU!! it's a great relief no doubt to know that I atleast have one acceptance
 
I have still not received my e-mail from their office but I was assured that they'll be sent out this week.

Don't worry, I'll -1 one of your innocuous comments. Only when you least expect it...
 
 

Here's a friendly reminder that some of us are waiting to hear from schools you know you will not be accepting offers from. Please tell them "no" soon! Waitlistedness (a technical term) is the pits! 

May you all enjoy the rest of application season as much as a baby elephant playing in the surf.
 

At the top of the Tufts waitlist! I'll take it.

What is this "real life" you speak of?

I never knew how to use commas. 

So weird. Am I wrong, or is there no way to actually view this decision that's supposedly been made?

I have been wondering how many people actually submit their results. How many acceptances are genuine? How many rejections unknown because their recipients are not exactly keen on telling (even though it's anonymous)?
I would bet that about 10-20 percent of acceptances go on here. Sometimes less, but rarely more.
But the truth is that we, the unknowing, hang on to the submissions like onto oxygen tanks. We keep refreshing the page for our school and programme (yes, admit it) in the hope (or fear!) that results may start showing. Yet, in the background, sits the ever-lurking fear that acceptances might have gone out without our noticing. That there are people out there, evil people, heinous people who sneakily got accepted into OUR programmes and don't even bother to tell us. Because we have a RIGHT to know, NOW! And we pile up on the paranoia as the month goes trickling by...
 
Thoughts, fears, tales to tell?
 
(Yes, I am both insomniac and bored. One day, I'll invent a job where you get paid for that.)

BIG HUGS. I'm so sorry to hear that it's been a crappy week so far. Don't ever apologize for being a supposed downer--especially on the "0% confidence" thread. This is an excruciatingly stressful experience, and you're allowed to have feelings! And to express them! I hope that things start looking up soon. Your prospects are not all gone yet. And although commuting wouldn't be ideal, it IS doable. People do it all the time... I knew a couple that got married after their MAs and one did a PhD at UChicago while the other stayed in a different program at Berkeley or something. They're still together, so, yay for long-distance/commuter romances?
 
And yo, dude, you already have a lot to be proud of! An MA! A good CV! A prospective publication! Lots of people who believe in you! Awesome taste in movies (re: the quote in your signature)! Also, HAPPY BIRTHDAY! You lived another year! 
 
 
 
(...Am I helping or being annoying? Sorry.  )