Poliphilo
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Posts posted by Poliphilo
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The quantitative/qualitative distinction is hugely more important than what concentrations your school offers.
You can often "create" a concentration via electives, creating a reading course or choosing a thesis topic.
That being said, most MPP programs don't give you a lot of electives.
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Sorry to hear not everyone on here got in. Hope everyone enjoys their other grad programs or jobs.
Received an email from U of T today welcoming me to the MPP class of 2017. It mostly had dates about orientation, the summer Math bootcamp and when class starts. It went to my spam filter. so fellow MPP'17s check your spam filter if you didn't get it.
Folks from Toronto and those who went to U of T, what is a good place to live in Toronto as a U of T grad student? I'm looking for something that is reasonably priced and not too far from campus. I'm okay living in a really small unit.
Best wishes to everyone.
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Thanks Poliphilo, for sharing. I am still deciding....mainly between my 2 job offers and SPPG. Did you talk to the general UofT Graduate School or SPPG in particular?
SPPG. Edited my post to make that clear.
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Recently spoke to UofT SPPG admissions. Thought I'd share a few things.
so can anyone hazard a guess at when/if a second round of offers might go out?
UofT said they'd send out second round of offers in early April.
UofT said in the last 6 years everyone has gotten an internship who has passed the first year courses. Prior to this 1 or 2 people a year didn't get an internship. They said this was mainly due to personal reasons (e.g. ESL issues, severe interview anxiety). In the unlikely event that you can't get an internship after year 1 you have to get an internship after year 2 to graduate. Most people get an internship though UofT's internal internship postings but you can get apply for external postings. Although everyone has gotten an internship keep in mind some are as short as 6 weeks and many people don't get their first choice.
UofT said about 35 out of the 80 students get financial funding in year 2 an amount between $3-8k.
Deadline to reply for 1st round is first week of April...I would assume second or third week of April second round should be out.
I am curious to all those who got the Offer of Admission, and reported on the forum here....how many of you are already decided to go to SPPG or still deciding or decline??
I failed to negotiate a higher entrance scholarship with UofT but have accepted UofT anyways. Looking forward to connecting with others in the MPP `17 class!
Edit: spoke with SPPG, not general Graduate school.
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I am also trying to decided between U of T, Queen's and Carleton. I do have a few questions for the other posters:
1. Poliphilo, where did you hear that you can only do an internship with the Federal Service at Queen's?
From what I understand, no one is guaranteed an internship position, anywhere. I went to the U of T info session and they were quite insistent on this point. You are *required* to do an internship at the U of T, but there is no preference given to U of T, or any other university at any government organization. The internships are posted and anyone is able to apply. So of course not everyone at Queen's gets into their internship of preference - that's the case at any university.
Still, I would love to hear more about what the alumni said - is 10 months enough to learn the skills they need? I do worry that with only one economics class (Carleton and UofT have both Macro and Micro), Queen's is light in that area. However, Carleton seems as quantitatively focused as the U of T.
Anyone with any other insight or info?
1. From Queen's website and the admissions officer I've spoken with.
"When is the internship offered?
Full-time students who have completed their program of study are eligible to compete for and accept a one-term co-op position with the Government of Canada through the MPA Internship (MPA-890). A small number of students choose this transitional school-to-work program each year."
2, As to whether 10 months is enough, it depends. 10 months is probably enough for some policy jobs. I know Queen's MPA grads working in the FPS and OPS who get by just fine. However, they have told me that there is a trend towards more quantitative analysis. A lot of policy job ads are starting to require strong quantitative skills and this is likely to continue. If you're interested in monetary or fiscal policy you should definitely look into a program with a strong quantitative focus.
Hey everybody, on the topic of the internships and financial matters, does anyone know what happens if (god forbid) a person in the program doesn't get an internship? Is it the case that you have to pay for more school until an internship is completed? I'm just trying to decide if going to UT is an economical choice. Obviously it opens a lot of doors, but I'm nervous about all the contingencies. I already have about $20,000 debt from my two previous degrees, and now it's looking like that number will be closer to $50,000 when all is said and done. Does anyone know how many students fail to get an internship in the summer? Also, does anyone know exactly how UT's loan program works? They claim to cover the difference of what OSAP does, but do they have similar interest rates?
Regardless, I think I'm going to accept my offer at UT since I didn't apply anywhere else and finding a job with my MA in philosophy has been difficult to say the least. Anything someone can tell me to ease my mind about the cost would be super appreciated.
Don't quote me on this, but I assume that if you don't get a internship between the summer of Year 1 and Year 2 you could do an internship after year 2 in order to graduate. That is how most co-op/internship requirements work at universities in Ontario. I have a call scheduled with UofT and will report back when I find out. I'm also curious.
All the MPP students I've talked to have gotten an internship, but I guess that is a bit of confirmation bias on my part. I'll also ask what % of students get internships as well.
Not sure how UTAPS works. On the bright side most people who get internships make 7-10k during the summer between year 1 and year 2. I also know several MPP students who manage a part-time job while in the MPP program so working part-time could help minimize your debt levels.
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so i have a 3.3 cumulative and 3.9 (4.3 scale) for my last two years. 2 good letters from profs, no OPS or anything. undergrad in sociology/social anthro from kings university. a few people told me my letter of intent was well written. how sore should my ulcer be?
You're competitive. You have an upward trend for your GPA with is good. A lot of other applicants already have policy or government work experience and higher cumulative GPAs so that is likely why you didn't get an offer in the first round. You still have a chance of getting an offer in the 2nd round but I wouldn't bank on it.
Thanks Poliphilo! I work in the field of immigration right now, but I have no direct public service/policy experience.
Ideally I would like to find a position post-grad in the OPS, with the City of Toronto, or in the private sector, so I know UofT seems like a logical choice. It was my first choice when I was applying, but I am still really torn. I am having trouble justifying that amount of tuition when I now have other great options and already have student debt to think of.
I have been accepted to the policy analysis specialization at Carleton, so I feel like I would be getting a lot of the same competencies as I would at UofT. I talked to a co-op advisor there today, and the vast majority of Carleton placements are with federal public service, but it sounds like there are opportunities to land placements outside of Ottawa through self-directed search. I like the idea of doing 2 co-op placements instead of just the one internship too.
Queen's seems to specialize in the policy areas I am interested in (health, social), and place well into the OPS, and it would be a lot more affordable than UofT since it is a 10 month program, but the pace of the program also worries me a bit since I don't have a strong quantitative background. It seems also like UofT's internship program may be stronger?
I feel like I am driving myself crazy weighing out the pros and cons. I am going to go to Kingston and Ottawa next weekend to see if the idea of moving to either of those cities from Toronto is enough to push me to accept at UofT
Sorry for the ramble!
For those of you choosing UofT's MPP program, why is it your top choice? Your reasoning may help me decide.
Thanks again for your reply Poliphilo, and for the employment stats!
Hi DBT, I understand that debt is scary. I'm hesitant to take take on debt for my MPP but you have to weigh how many doors an MPP will open for you vs how many doors X amount of debt will close for you I think it is worth it. Yes debt does prevent you from taking lower-paying jobs that you may enjoy, but having an MPP allows you to get higher paying policy jobs that you wouldn't be able to get without an MPP.
From the Queen's almuni I have spoken to their program is short but intense. The internship program they offer is after the 10 months of courses, optional and only with the Federal Public Service. As well, not everyone who wants an internship with the Federal Public Service gets it.
UofT's internship program is in the summer between year 1 and year 2 and pretty much everyone gets a placement somewhere. Most are placed with the OPS.
Pros of UofT
-In Toronto. Easier to develop a network in Toronto and land a permanent job in Toronto after you graduate if you go to school there.
-Strong placement with the OPS and the private sector (for a MPA/MPP program).
-Strong quantitative training. A lot of policy job and the higher paying jobs are requiring applicants to have a strong quantitative background. Having a strong financial background makes it easier to go private sector if you get tired of government (e.g. finance, government relations).
-PAID internship offers good hands-on experience.
-Strong international reputation. Helps if you're gunning for something like the UN or IMF.
Cons of UofT
-It's expensive. Sticker price is $16k a year
-It's in Toronto. Some people don't like the big city and Toronto has a high cost of living.
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sooo...now i should start worrying.
Stressulcer, the first round of offers have gone out. There will at be another round of offers, the size of which will depend on how many reject the first round of offers. As long as your application is still "under review" you haven't been rejected yet!
If you're willing to share your stats we can give you a better idea of your odds of getting accepted in the second round of offers. Best of luck!Thanks! You too!!
I did my undergrad at UVic. I actually don't know exactly what my GPA was, as Uvic uses a 9-point scale. My grades were good but not anything amazing. I had 4 letters of reference for UofT, two from Uvic professors I had taken several classes with, one from my employer, and one from a volunteer position. I spent a fair amount of time on my statement of purpose too.I have also been accepted to Queen's and Carleton's MPA programs, and Carleton is offering a much larger scholarship so I really don't know which one I'm going to choose. They all seem like really strong programs, but with different structure and emphases and different career opportunities post-grad. Any insights/advice anyone has would be greatly appreciated
DBT what do you want to do after your MPA/MPP? Carelton places very well into the federal public service. U of T places very well into the OPS. U of T's program is focused on quantitative analysis and policy. Carelton's program does teach policy but I would say focuses more on public administration (hence it awards a Master in Public Administration rather than a Master in Public Policy). Last I checked U of T also placed the best into the private sector of any MA/MPP program in Canada. I cannot seem to find the stats right now though. I will post them if I can find them later.
Edit: Found U of T employment stats you might be interested in. http://publicpolicy.utoronto.ca/wp-content/uploads/pdfs/SPPG_Alumni_Employment_Statistics.pdf
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I'm not sure if I can point to anything in particular that is noteworthy. I guess it would have been the combination of my GPA (3.90), letters of recommendation, and statement of interest. I don't have any experience in the public sector or anything like that.
Thanks for sharing your stats Patient of Patience. Did you go to the University of Toronto for undergrad? I wonder if they show preference for their own.
Poliphilo, Curious where you went for undergrad? maybe $5000 only provided to top top UT students??? Cause you two seems to have great GPAs, both exactly the same at 3.90 unless you are out of 4.3 rather than 4.0.
I go to undergrad at Western University and studied abroad in the UK. I have a 3.9 cumulative GPA on the 4.0 scale. They might convert my UK grades to the GPA scale differently that I have.
I'm going to try to see if I can negotiate a larger funding offer regardless. Ozone15, I'll let you know if I'm successful.
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I was offered a $5,000 entrance scholarship.
Patient of Patience would you please mind sharing your stats (e.g. GPA, work experience, quality of LORs)?
Do you know why you were offered that much?
I could really use the $2000, and would appreciate if you had any knowledge that would help me negotiate.
Thanks.
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Received an acceptance email from UofT today.
They are offering me a $3000 entrance scholarship and have given me 4 weeks from today or accept or decline the offer of admission. I'm probably going to accept the offer in the the next couple days and decline my offers at the other graduate schools I've been accepted to. They want me to accept or decline the offer via postal mail which seems a bit archaic.
Anyone else received an acceptance email? If so, are they offering you any funding? I'm wondering if I could possible negotiate a larger entrance scholarship. As far as I know in past years they have only awarded up to $3000, so I think I'm already at the max.
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@Ozone and Poliphilo, check U of T ROSI. Log in with your student number (listed on your application) and you can check to see if you were invited. I was
so that's probably a good sign for everyone else for whom a decision was made. Good luck!Thanks JTMurray. U of T ROSI also says I've been "invited." I take that as a good sign.
I assume they are trying to figure out funding offers or are busy dealing with the strike but I don't know what the hold up is.
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Yeah, exactly. OK, well, at least I'm not alone. I'll be sure to post here once I've been contacted in some capacity. Do the same, Poliphilo?
Sure, I'll post here when I hear anything further. Their office is probably closed now, so hopefully I hear something tomorrow.
Edit: Spelling
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My status has been changed to "Decision Made", but I've not yet received an e-mail regarding what the decision is. Heh. I'll keep people posted.
I assume that means you got in because it is early for them to start a wait list or start sending out rejections. But I guess we will have to wait to find out.
My status also changed to "Decision Made." Haven't received an email or phone call from them either....
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I did a google search to learn about the MPP experience at UoT from previous students and what I came across was very disappointing. It seems like the faculty there is a major problem as they are not very helpful. Would you like to share your findings about UoT MPP. Is it really good?
What negative feedback have you heard of the program? I have heard admissions is unresponsive to student inquiries but aside from that not much criticism.
Thanks
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Hello!
Its me again! I have replied to you in my thread. Could you share your background and also the other schools to which you have applied?
Thanks!
Here are my stats:
-3.95 last 2 years, 3.9 GPA cumulative in humanities
-3 summers working for the Ontario Public Service (OPS)
-2 references from professors, 1 reference from OPS supervisor.
Accepted:
-Ryerson, MPPA. $6k fellowship, possibly TA/RA position
-Queen's,MPA: Possible funding; possible RA position
-Waterloo, MPS; No funding, no job offer. Strongly encouraged not to work during the first year of the program.
Awaiting Decision
-University of Toronto, MPP (In past years they have given out 1-3k entry scholarships).
Rejected:
-None.
I called the UofT's MPP admissions last week and they said first round of offers will go out in early to mid March.
Best of luck everyone!
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Why not to attend University of Toronto's School of Public Policy and Governance for your Master of Public Policy
in Government Affairs Forum
Posted
It typically offers a $3000 entry scholarship to almost everyone in first year. In second year some people get scholarships about $3000-4500 and others get teaching assistant jobs that pay about $3000-4000. They try to spread around the funding--teaching assistant positions arent' really awarded based on merit or grades.
There is also needs based funding called UTAPS that can be quite generous up to $14,000. But there are rumours it won't be offered next year. Don't know if this is true or not.
Traditionally SPPG places very well into the Ontario Public Service. Your best bet if you want a job is to network. Employers don't really care about grades.