Statistics PhD: UChicago vs CMU

[LZQ]

Hello! I hope all of you have received fantastic offers!

I'm lucky to receive offers from the University of Chicago and Carnegie Mellon University statistics PhD programs. However, I have been vacillating between the two choices for a long time. I noticed there have been a gradcafe topic similar to this several years ago, but that didn't solve my problems.

I am open to a wide range of research topics, but I prefer theoretical research to application a little bit. My research experiences during my undergraduate years focused on application, and those are good starting points, but I want to switch to theoretical research during PhD years. I think I am well prepared for it, since my undergraduate school greatly emphasizes mathematical training in its course system. Going to academia is my first choice for the future, though going to the industry is also OK for me if I really want to quit academia in the future. 

It seems that UChicago has many rising stars working on theoretical statistics. Also, UChicago statistics department has a strong connection with Booth School and TTIC, which also have many great statisticians. However, the surroundings of UChicago are too dangerous. Since I am an international student, and my parents are outside the US, they will worry about me for days and nights if I go to UChicago. There have been some terrible shootings in the past two years. One of the victims is an alumnus of my undergraduate school, and another victim has close connections with many of my schoolmates. Those were terrible news!

For CMU, it is located at a much safer place. However, their new faculties seem to focus more on applications, and they have fewer alumni going to academia than UChicago. Also, CMU is a smaller school than UChicago, so there may be fewer collaborators. 

Could you please give me some advice? Thank you very much!

Note: I started a similar topic under "Decisions, Decisions", but I think I should start it here. I'm quite a novice for gradcafe. I'm sorry for the mistake.

[Econometrician]

Well, like you say, UChicago is heavy on theoretical, and CMU does a lot of more applied stuff. Personally I'm more into CMU's research and vibe but you seem to be more into UChicago's, plus I honestly think you shouldn't worry about a 'dangerous location' too much, as it's not likely to actually be dangerous unless you wander into the sketchy places. And I do think living in Chicago rather than Pittsburgh is a big step up if you care about social life at all. So, you know, given that you prefer to do theoretical stuff and to go into academia later, I'd probably say UChicago. But CMU is a great department too.

[Ryuk]

I am not international, but I get the feeling that stories of danger around U.S. campuses are overblown abroad. I am currently in a department located in a city that has a "dangerous" reputation and it really isn't a big deal in day-to-day life. It sounds like the location and fit of U Chicago are better and I wouldn't let scary headlines influence your decision. 

[PhysicsKid]

I would definitely second what Ryuk said. A vast vast majority of students have no safety issues at UChicago and, especially as a graduate student, you have a choice in terms of where to live. I have many friends who are in PhDs at UChicago and they love living in the South Loop area. There is a UChicago shuttle between them and campus (in addition to Merta and the Red Line) and the south loop area is very safe.

Largely I would say that if you feel you would be happier at UChicago, you should go to UChicago.

[LZQ]

Thank all of you for your suggestions! After I learned more about these two departments, it seems for me that the research of CMU matches me better currently (although I'm also OK with UChicago's research). What UChicago attracts me is that they are recruiting many amazing young faculties these years. I think this is a sign of their ambition and their rising-up, and I'm really into this kind of feeling. However, I'm not sure whether it is too naive to choose a grad school because of reasons like this.

[kidbayes]

I'm currently a graduate student at UChicago (I live in Hyde Park), and I don't really feel that safety here is an issue. If you avoid bad neighborhoods, walking around at night, and taking the public transportation frequently, then I don't think there is much reason to worry. The level of safety in Chicago varies greatly depending which neighborhood you are in, and Hyde Park for example, where the University is located, is relatively safe with many professors living here. The south loop is also fairly safe also, and you can stay in these neighborhoods exclusively and basically experience all the university has to offer.

There was an international student who was killed last year in a mugging; I don't want to make light of that situation, or assign any blame to the victim at all, but I think I read that he refused to hand over his laptop (which he had out).

As far as your specific research interests, I can't really comment on which school is a better fit, however, I think if you are geared towards theoretical research in academia, UChicago might be a better fit. The stats courses are very rigorous and heavily focused on theory and so are the courses in other departments, but they still provide relevant practical experience. The general feel of the university is that, as a whole, it is aimed towards students who truly enjoy the subject and are pursuing academia (compare to state schools for example, which as a whole seem more aimed at sending students into positions in industry). I think this might be important, since you can take courses in other departments outside of statistics and they will still be generally good quality.

Also, in the US, UChicago is in general much more prestigious that CMU, with UChicago being on the same tier as ivy-league schools while CMU is not. Further, I have a strong suspicion that our placements for stats graduates interested in academia is probably better than CMU on average, but I'm not completely sure. On the other hand, CMU seems to be much better at computer science, so if you're interested in something related to that then that is something to consider. Although, despite the relatively low ranking, I still think the CS department here is pretty good, plus you can take courses/do research at TTIC.

Edited March 13, 2023 by kidbayes

[M1ller]

It's a misunderstanding that CMU focuses on applied statistics; Check out Wasserman, Ramdas, or Balakrishnan. Actually, except for Barber, who is one of the best theorists in the world without a doubt, I think nobody can match them in terms of theoretical research and advising. Gao and Ma are amazing, but they are junior faculties and have not proven their ability for advising PhD's. In fact, except for 6-8 Professors, many of faculty members in UChicago can be viewed as biostatisticians. However, UChicago has another statistics department in the Booth School of business, which has strong theorists such as Rockova. I see some recent graduates were advised by those Booth faculty members, wrote JRSSB or JASA and went to prestigious postdocs (although I do not know how much opportunities stat PhDs in physical sciences division have with Booth). Therefore, for theoretical research, I think CMU and UChicago provide similar opportunities. I think if you can work with Barber, UChicago is slightly better, but she only accepts one PhD student a year. 

UChicago is a very prestigious school as an undergrad institution. They are excellent in almost every fields they deal with, except for computer science. They do not have engineering department, and their CS department is ranked below 50. CMU is ranked 20-ish as an undergrad institution, but they are top notch in computer science and machine learning, and many of their research are related to statistics department and many of their faculty members advise stat PhD students; check out Aarti Singh's publications and students, for example. In my opinion, the prestige as an undergraduate institution is only applicable to undergraduates, and PhDs would only enjoy the prestige of their graduate program. In terms of statistics, I think UChicago has a slightly more reputation than CMU. For machine learning, however, UChicago is not even in top 30.

UChicago offers very rigorous coursework and quals, which are very nice but is an overkill in my opinion. The quals forbid students from doing research in their first years. I believe that CMU's courseworks provide the key skills needed for the research of the theory of modern statistics. You can check out lecture notes and also Youtube videos of CMU 36-705 or 36-702. Also checkout this syllabus (https://www.stat.cmu.edu/~aramdas/martingales18/m18.html). You will figure out the style of CMU's courses. To sum up, I think CMU provides necessary skills, while UChicago trains you more than enough. Either way is good, and it's your choice which training you will have.

In terms of placements, surprisingly, UChicago is leaned toward industry; check out this page (https://stat.uchicago.edu/alumni/phd-alumni/). The cohort size is around 15-ish, and the ones not listed there are probably in the industry. Note that the listings include non-stat PhDs, and also they are not initial placements; Walter Dempsey, for example, is listed as an Assistant Professor at UMich biostat, but he did Postdoc for four years. In my opinion, Yale and UW are better than UChicago when it comes to producing assistant professors doing theoretical research. The postdoc placements of UChicago are amazing, though.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited March 28, 2023 by M1ller