Publications

[Chuck]

Obviously, all publications are not created equal. A non peer-reviewed undergraduate journal doesn't hold a candle to the ASA.

Does anyone have a link to a resource that helps further parse the hierarchy of academic publication?

I'm particularly curious as to the hierarchy of the following types of publications:

Journal with high impact factor

Journal with low impact factor

Special edition of a journal

Book chapter

Book (peer reviewed, academic press)

Book (general press)

Commentary

Book Review (in a journal)

Synthesis article/literature review

[Darth.Vegan]

On that note. Got my first book review done for the Anthropology Review Database. I am pretty excited as I am just a lowly undergraduate haha

[Chuck]

Congrats darthvegan! That's awesome.

And, incidentally, will look great on your applications next year.

[Darth.Vegan]

Congrats darthvegan! That's awesome.

And, incidentally, will look great on your applications next year.

That's what I am hoping for! I plan to develop a journal article from my thesis to submit for publication, but it probably will still be pending when I send my applications in.

[Karlito]

A note on undergraduate journal: I do not even consider that a "publication". I was an editor on such journal...No one read them, and the quality of submission is modest. If you list it as such on your c, you might look ridiculous to the adcom. Just sayin' and you do not have to agree with that!

[jenjenjen]

A note on undergraduate journal: I do not even consider that a "publication". I was an editor on such journal...No one read them, and the quality of submission is modest. If you list it as such on your c, you might look ridiculous to the adcom. Just sayin' and you do not have to agree with that!

Huh I kinda disagree with that, though I could just be getting defensive haha. For one of the undergraduate journal I published in I had to do a great deal of work in the "revise and resubmit" process that gave me a great introduction to the entire publication process. It went through the whole blind peer review process from two grad students at separate universities, and then onto a faculty member at Stanford (intimidating!) who gave me some of the best writing advice of my life. I went through multiple drafts before it even cleared him to go on to the copy editor, who proceeded to tear my punctuation apart. While I'm not defending the journal as the height of fabulous writing, it is used by a fair number of undergrad profs in rhetoric at a teaching tool. Admittedly I also had an article published in an internal school publication that required a fraction of that effort and probably is not read by anyone but faculty at my one university haha.

Okay kind of long winded but my point is that for some an ug publication can show that you have put some effort into taking your work beyond just submitting for a class final, and that you can work towards improvement based on outside commentary. I don't think it will look ridiculous to any adcom, even if it doesn't help your application that much.

[faculty]

I'm with Jen on this one.

While an undergraduate journal publication is not a high status publication, it would certainly enhance an applicant's CV. The process for publication varies widely, and some undergraduate journals would be more highly regarded than others, but any experience with a journal demonstrates an understanding of the academic norms around publishing.

Edited March 1, 2012 by faculty

[splitends]

Karlito, I think you're dead wrong here. I published in two undergraduate journals, and I know it impressed professors at my top ranked university, and I'm sure it helped me in the grad school admissions process. Yes, without question it is much easier to publish in an undergraduate journal than a professional one (and I'm sure that UG journals vary considerably in quality and competitiveness), but it's still an accomplishment and it says a lot about your ambition, your commitment to research, etc. Besides, you ARE an undergraduate-- it's a totally appropriate venue for your work.

Maybe you don't want to include it on your CV when you're actually on the job market a few years down the road, but you're doing yourself a huge disservice if you don't mention undergraduate publications when applying to grad school.

[socscholar]

From other applicants I've talked to, having some sort of publication seems like an important application boost. Pretty sure that to get into top programs it's a good idea to have substantial research experience and at least one publication.

Yes, most of them are in UG journals or random other things. Obviously you're not gonna have an ASA article before grad school. But having SOMETHING shows a commitment to scholarship and entering the field.

[Karlito]

Haha I see I elicited some serious backfire! Debate is always good. So I guess it all comes down to which journal. The one I edited was probably crap then...You are all right that anything to boost an application is good. However, I am still persuaded that presenting at a national conference is more important than a publication in a UG journal. Again, it depends which conference, of course.

[splitends]

I don't think they're really comparable-- that is, I don't think you can really translate the value of any one item on your CV into another, like one undergraduate publication is worth two undergraduate conference presentations is worth one professional conference presentation, etc. It just doesn't work like that. I've already written at length about this in another thread, but different professors on different committees value different things. Anything you can add to your CV will probably help.

And frankly I don't think publications and presentations should be mutually exclusive. If you have a paper you can publish in an undergraduate journal, you should also try to present it at conferences, both professional and undergraduate. If you have a paper you were able to present at a conference, try to get it published. I'm a huge proponent of getting as much mileage out of of every research project you can, and doing so definitely helped me beef up my CV.

But back to the original post: are you trying to learn more about the publication hierarchy for grad school admissions purposes, or trying to figure out how to best go forward once you're actually in grad school?

[Chuck]

Wow! This has been a really great discussion with regards to publications for a grad school applicant.

My question was more along the lines of preparing for the job market CV (eons away for most of us, I know). Perhaps this is the wrong venue to be asking such a question. I just thought someone might have a handy reference or advice on the matter.

[Darth.Vegan]

I plan on submitting an article developed from my honor's thesis for publication in a professional journal. Is that a mistake? My faculty advisors seem to think it is a great idea, but should I be looking for an undergrad journal or something else with a lower bar to submit to? The topic is in social movements.

[Darth.Vegan]

@Chuck

I think your hierarchy as outlined in your first post is probably correct. My only caveat would be that single author is more valuable than co-author in some cases and move one up over the other. For example, I would rank a single author chapter in a book above a co-author journal article.

[splitends]

Yeah, that looks like an excellent thing to discuss with a future advisor. I have a feeling that there are a lot of unofficial rules that change from discipline to discipline, and maybe sub-discipline to sub-discipline. And I'm sure the birth of online publishing has been baffling for the discipline.

@xdarthveganx: Was the list supposed to be hierarchical? Because I would be shocked if publishing a book in your field counts less than journal articles, especially from less esteemed journals...

[Darth.Vegan]

Yeah, that looks like an excellent thing to discuss with a future advisor. I have a feeling that there are a lot of unofficial rules that change from discipline to discipline, and maybe sub-discipline to sub-discipline. And I'm sure the birth of online publishing has been baffling for the discipline.

@xdarthveganx: Was the list supposed to be hierarchical? Because I would be shocked if publishing a book in your field counts less than journal articles, especially from less esteemed journals...

It seemed that it was because book reviews were near the bottom and low impact journals were listed below high impact. But on 2nd look I think you are correct, any order as it's written may have just been subconscious or by chance.

On 2nd look I would rank it in this order with the caveat again that single author on some of these may rank it above co-authored work.

Book (peer reviewed, academic press)

Special edition of a journal

Journal with high impact factor

Book (general press)

Book chapter

Journal with low impact factor

Synthesis article/literature review

Book Review (in a journal)

Commentary

[lovenhaight]

I plan on submitting an article developed from my honor's thesis for publication in a professional journal. Is that a mistake? My faculty advisors seem to think it is a great idea, but should I be looking for an undergrad journal or something else with a lower bar to submit to? The topic is in social movements.

Definitely submit to a professional journal! The worst they can say is no (and they often do, so don't take it personally if that happens), THEN move to an undergrad journal.

[sciencegirl]

For the job market at the top tier competitive level, it's basically 1-2 really solid journal publications as a single author- ASR and AJS are basically the gold standard here. I have heard that having 1-2 articles in those journals will trump more articles in other journals (though there is a hierarchy beyond that based on subfield). The field has really shifted in the last ten years.. it used to be that 1-2 journal pubs anywhere was a good thing, but recently, there really has been a push for quality as opposed to quantity (lower ranked journals/co-author, etc).

A few friends were just on the job market and qualifications were often expressed in terms of "so-and-so has an AJS already". A book contract is helpful, and apparently, there has been this recent phenomenon where 2 graduate students in Sociology in recent years have pulled off published books when in graduate school. (I can list names in PM, but they both now are starting TT jobs at Ivy departments). Of course, that is super ambitious and above and beyond all the expectations of most graduate students. Aim for 1-2 journal entires in decent journals, if in AJS or ASR then you've already really proven yourself.

[lovenhaight]

I think that the high/low impact journals designation should probably be fleshed out a bit more. ASR is obviously high, but the regional journals seem to have their own hierarchy as well. I suspect that some might be lumped into the higher categories with others in the low. My personal take on the weight of a journal tends to relate to how easy it is to get something published. If they take anything or they take the initial submission right away, they probably aren't a heavy hitter. Again, that's just how I've come to think about it - others might have a different perspective.

[Darth.Vegan]

Definitely submit to a professional journal! The worst they can say is no (and they often do, so don't take it personally if that happens), THEN move to an undergrad journal.

Do you think it's better for my grad app to have a pending review for a professional journal or an actual publication in an undergrad journal?

[splitends]

@xdarthveganx, I would seriously reconsider depending on your timeline. If you're applying to grad schools next year and would just start submitting to journals now, it's extremely unlikely you would actually have something published when you turn in your apps. I've heard that saying you have a paper submitted for publication is pretty pointless, since virtually anyone can submit a paper (though I'm willing to bet it would shed a certain amount of positive light on your seriousness as a scholar that you attempted). But it won't be the same as an actual publication.

The one caveat would be if the prof who's encouraging you knows about a particular journal with a more expedited process than the top ones (which can be like 18 months from submission to publication). I would definitely talk to your prof about it more, but I would personally lean toward UG publications that will be done for sure by the application deadline...

[Darth.Vegan]

@xdarthveganx, I would seriously reconsider depending on your timeline. If you're applying to grad schools next year and would just start submitting to journals now, it's extremely unlikely you would actually have something published when you turn in your apps. I've heard that saying you have a paper submitted for publication is pretty pointless, since virtually anyone can submit a paper (though I'm willing to bet it would shed a certain amount of positive light on your seriousness as a scholar that you attempted). But it won't be the same as an actual publication.

The one caveat would be if the prof who's encouraging you knows about a particular journal with a more expedited process than the top ones (which can be like 18 months from submission to publication). I would definitely talk to your prof about it more, but I would personally lean toward UG publications that will be done for sure by the application deadline...

Thanks for the advice. I honestly don't have any idea how people get published multiple times while in undergrad, professional journal or otherwise. The timeline just doesn't seem to work! I have a couple smaller original research methods papers for methods classes that I can submit to undergrad journals. I think I still want to save any articles I develop from my thesis for professional journals. I was particularly looking at Mobilization.

[sciencegirl]

I think splitends is referring to the process at more professional journals.. which take over a year from start to finish because of the review process and then the revise and resubmit part... for undergrad journals it could be much quicker. If you submit to an undergrad journal now, you could very well hear by the time you start working on apps.

@lovenhaight - beyond ASR and AJS, I'm not quite sure how to rank the regional ones, and then other other social science ones (ie, Qualitative Sociology).. I think a good rule of thumb is looking at the CVs of your mentors in your field. The journals they are willing to put on their CV and publish in are probably good bets as solid ones to aim for. In terms of ranking a list, thats probably not the best approach since I bet that after the top 2, there is a set of journals that are roughly the same as still really great to get published in.. and then a set of journals that you would probably be advised against. I figure in grad school I hope to get really good advising on this. I mean, this is why we are going to school right? To learn?

[AaronM]

What do you guys think about my situation? I am third author on a paper that (from what we've been told by professors who publish there regularly) has a good shot at being published in Soc of Ed and we just got accepted to ASA where I'll be doing the presenting. How do you think grad schools will look upon this? I've gotten a lot of good experience doing analysis, literature review, the publication process, and working with three other top professors in my department. Do you guys think grad schools will look and say: "Third author? Probably didn't do anything" or will it help show good potential on my side?

[splitends]

I'm sure it's safe to say that something is always better than nothing. I can't imagine that any evidence of you participating in original research will be dismissed by any admissions committee. How much it will count is probably impossible to say, but, seriously, how can that do anything but help? It's a publication in a professional journal (the vast majority of applicants won't even be a third author on such a publication) and a presentation at a professional conference, and I'm sure it's also a great letter of rec from the prof you published with.

Just out of curiosity, have you already applied and you just want to speculate after the fact how your application is being seen, or are you planning to apply in the future?