Looking for help with undergrad course selection

[skruzchkns]

I'll be graduating in Fall 2013 with a biochem degree and will be applying to PhD programs in Immunology for admission in Fall 2014. To fulfill my degree requirements I have the option of taking Physical Chemistry I or Intro to Physical Chemistry. It was originally my intention to take the regular pchem class but I'm starting to rethink it. Of course it's going to be harder than the intro class and I'd rather spend more time in the lab than studying for a class I don't necessarily need to take.

I guess I'm wondering how much admissions committees look at specific courses on a transcript. Would I be better served by taking the harder course that will decrease my availability for research, or is it better to take an easier class that allows me to contribute more time to a project?

[aberrant]

I personally would go for the regular pchem class even though immunology programs probably put a lot less weight on physical science courses (if anyone can verify this). the only reason I would suggest you to take the regular pchem class is for the learning purposes. while it may not be a wise option to take a more difficult class while you are committed to your research/lab and possibly other classes that you'll be taking at the same time, one of the things that you learn is time management. The way I see it is that you will need to practice and maintain a good balance between coursework and research, without significantly drops your efficiency in lab work. I'm pretty sure sooner or later you will have to juggle between heavy-duty coursework and research in grad school, if not as an undergrad. so you might as well take this opportunity as another way to prepare yourself for grad school.

It is not about how much time you put into a project, or physically stay in the lab. Is it about how effectively you use your time and perform your tasks efficiently. If you are capable to do things in an efficient manner, I don't think it will be a big problem to take a harder class at the same time.

Just my 2 cents.

[skruzchkns]

You're right.. if I can't handle both as an undergrad then it's going to be pretty tough later on. Thanks for the feedback!

[Xanthan]

I personally would go for the regular pchem class even though immunology programs probably put a lot less weight on physical science courses (if anyone can verify this). the only reason I would suggest you to take the regular pchem class is for the learning purposes. while it may not be a wise option to take a more difficult class while you are committed to your research/lab and possibly other classes that you'll be taking at the same time, one of the things that you learn is time management. The way I see it is that you will need to practice and maintain a good balance between coursework and research, without significantly drops your efficiency in lab work. I'm pretty sure sooner or later you will have to juggle between heavy-duty coursework and research in grad school, if not as an undergrad. so you might as well take this opportunity as another way to prepare yourself for grad school.

It is not about how much time you put into a project, or physically stay in the lab. Is it about how effectively you use your time and perform your tasks efficiently. If you are capable to do things in an efficient manner, I don't think it will be a big problem to take a harder class at the same time.

Just my 2 cents.

I disagree. Sure, learning is well and good, but there are lots of things you could learn, and don't, not because they're not valuable, but because you don't have time. (Latin, tap dancing, astrophysics.) And this assumes that a "harder" course will cause you to learn more, which I'm not sure is a reasonable assumption. The PChem I class may cover similar concepts as the Intro to PChem, but with more mathematical and experimental rigor. As a non-chemist, you may learn more by not having to focus on the math.

Frankly, the adcoms for PhD programs will look at your transcript, and they won't know the difference between "Intro to Physical Chemistry" and "Physical Chemistry I." They will know the difference between an A and a B: you will be judged on your GPA. And they will be looking at your letters of rec, and if you put in extra effort in your current lab, your letter will be (should be) better. You want to learn time management? Get a part time job, or juggle several hobbies with school, or get a dog (that's not a joke--dogs force you into having a set schedule).

There are several skills that become of great importance in grad school that undergrads often lack. It's OK to have a life and relax a bit--science isn't going anywhere. And you need to embrace the limits to your own knowledge... you can't know everything, and you need to know where to marshal your effort to best effect.

[emmm]

I agree with Xanthan -- I doubt anyone will know how the two classes differ. Think about what kind of work you might like to do in the future and work on getting the skills you'll need for that. If you don't think pchem will be that important later on, why spend a ton of effort on it now?

[Usmivka]

Frankly, the adcoms for PhD programs will look at your transcript, and they won't know the difference between "Intro to Physical Chemistry" and "Physical Chemistry I."

True. I say this as an undergrad chem major. If you want concepts, spending a bunch of time learning the specific math to solve a partition function in the Boltzmann distribution may not be the best use of your time. If your labwork now or later will depend on your ability to manipulate and interpret physical chemistry data (spectra, calorimetry data, whatevs), this is worth your time--but then shouldn't you be taking a PChem lab rather than lecture? Otherwise, maybe not a good use of time. This decision making is part of time management too. You don't train yourself in how best to use your time by dumping your energy into something you niether want nor need.

But for counterpoint, many people are better hands on learners than memorizers. A intro class may just give you some formulae and say "solve," but I learn more if I can track how they were derived and the assumptions that went in, and I get a better "tactile sense" of what it actually means. An overview classes can leave me with factoids that I quickly forget instead of problem solving skills and reference materials that I can always come back to.

Good luck.

Edited May 26, 2012 by Usmivka

[Pitangus]

I agree with Xanthan and emmm that the course name will not mean much to adcomms.

However, course numbers can give a rough indication of the rigor or depth of a course (100 level vs 300 level, for example).

But because numbering systems and course availabilities vary by institution, I don't know how much adcomms generally consider course levels. Maybe they only notice if your transcript is all 100 (intro) level courses or something extreme like that.

In addition, because you are not applying for chemistry programs, I don't think it's necessary to take the higher-level P Chem (unless you are actually interested in it, as emmm suggests).

As long as you've taken a decent number of upper-level courses in biology/biochem, an intro-level P Chem course would look fine.

If I were you I would instead focus on my research project and maintaining my GPA.