Academic Snobbery in the Chemistry World - Experiences & Effects

[St Andrews Lynx]

Back in the summer I was in the office of a Seriously Big Name Professor (Ivy League) expressing an interest in his university and research program. SBNP asked me which other universities I was going to apply to for grad school. I listed the schools I had visited that summer: 2 Ivies, 2 state universities (public Ivies) and 1 centre city university. 

 

"Well, you named 2 good schools there," he replied. 

 

At which point I was introduced to the concept academic snobbery in the US system. 

 

Come February 2013 and I've not been accepted into the Ivies I applied for, but I have received an offer from a large public research university on the East coast. My interest is in industrial research careers rather than sticking in academia - thus I'm probably going to have to complete a postdoc at a Top 10 institution if I want to get into big pharma. What I'm concerned about is if academic elitism is going to play against me, and what I can (if anything) do about it. 

 

Have any other chemists on this forum gone to a large public research university for their PhD? Have you faced outright academic snobbery in the process of your graduate/postdoctoral education on account of this? Any advice for me?

[Usmivka]

Yeah, but for all you know it was his school plus one of the big state schools that were being referred to! It's common knowledge that for grad studies not all Ivies are equal. In aceademia a big research university and a Ivy aren't going to be viewed as that different by search committees (speaking as a former student rep on faculty search committees at both an R1 state university and a brand name private school).

 

The real problem here for you is not academic snobbery but brand name recognition by hirers in industry--coming from an Ivy or otherwise widely known and respected school will count for a lot more in hiring and salary negotiation in industry. The unfortunate truth is that most folks in industry don't get the nuances of departmental strength versus name recognition at the whole university level, and assume that the name brand school puts out better workers, even if very weak in your field. And it is a fairly course understanding at that, a lot of folks you apply with will think of the schools in terms of what they thought of as prestigious schools from their perspective of as high schoolers or college undergrads--there is little recognition that a brand name college may not produce the same skillsets that public schools are geared for (industry ready technical skills) or that the same institution may be middling or worse in terms of graduate studies, and that this varies greatly by field. Business types (the ones making the hiring decisions) know and care a lot about brand name.

Edited February 5, 2013 by Usmivka

[cleverfool]

I am currently working in big pharma, and the majority of the people I work with, PhD and otherwise, did not come from top 10 schools. Some do, and I'm sure that helps, but getting your foot in the door in this industry is as much about who you know as it is about what you know. Wherever you study, you should be going to conferences and keeping in touch with industry people you meet, as well as staying in touch with anyone from your lab/department that ends up in pharma.

It's a rough industry to get into right now, and I'm not sure it's going to get any better, but it definitely isn't an Ivy-only game.

[aberrant]

Just came back from a conference, and I totally agreed with cleverfool. It's more about what you know than where you are graduated from. Graduated from  an ivy might get you more interviews, but that does not guarantee you a job offer. After all, scientists are generally realistic -- with a degree in <insert the name of a subject here>, if one can't even perform a <insert a fundamental experiment routinely use in the same subject>, this person's degree is useless, no matter how prestige the program is.

[St Andrews Lynx]

Thanks for the input guys, that helps me a lot. 

[UBackwardsChemistry]

http://pipeline.corante.com/archives/2013/03/19/scientific_snobbery.php