Best way, for me, to study at the graduate level

[modernity_mike]

Hi folks, I'm looking for some advice regarding graduate work in philosophy.

 

Background: I received my BS in engineering in '13.  During my time as an undergrad I took two philosophy courses.  Shortly after undergrad I took one graduate course at another institution.  

 

Considering my background, it seems best to shoot for the MA.  But how do I go about this?  It seems as though the folks applying to and getting accepted into these top notch MA programs are those that actually did their undergraduate work in philosophy and who want to use the MA to springboard to a solid PhD program.  Given that, I'm up against some tough competition.  I would obviously need to retake my GREs (in which I didn't score all that amazingly) and addition to making an old term paper into a writing sample.

 

Having said this, are there any decent terminal MA programs that offer evening courses?  I ask because one option for me would be to continue to work as an engineer while taking a course or two at night.  The school where I took a graduate course only offers graduate courses at night, but they simply don't place folks that well.  The other option is to quit work and do an MA full-time.  In this situation I'd ideally not be paying tuition and at least get a stipend (though I'm assuming stipends at the MA level are few and far between).  Hell, considering my background, it'd be surprised if I even got tuition reimbursement.  Considering this, I think it'd be easier for me to go with the first option, in which I pay my way through the MA.  I'm also assuming that if I say that I'll pay my way through school, it will be easier to get into a program.

 

Are any of you folks getting your MA part-time (in which the program does indeed have evening courses)?  Any other advice regarding this matter would be greatly appreciated. 

[Hopephily]

I take it that you're hoping eventually to pursue a phd in philosophy and so I'm going to write with that in mind. All of the MA programs that I am familiar with don't allow for part-time residency (they require at least 3 courses a term). So one of your options might not really be an option. 

 

You're right that the competition is pretty stiff at the top MA programs. If you don't think you have much of a shot getting an offer at this point (let alone a funded one), then you might consider taking another semester (or year) of graduate seminars either at your local institution or, if possible/necessary, at a more reputable one (I don't know where you did your BS). You can do this as a non-degree seeking student at many schools--again I don't know the particulars about your school so mileage may vary. But this is usually something you can do part time. This could help you get more classes under your belt, get to know faculty that may write your letters for you, improve your writing sample, and also give you a taste for grad school in philosophy. 

 

However, taking this route is going to have drawbacks given your situation. Obviously it'll take a chunk of change but beyond that, working full time and studying philosophy part-time is likely going to limit your philosophical progress. Again since I'm assuming your goal is to become competitive for phd programs, you're going to want to get the most out of your classes which takes a lot of time and energy. You can certainly make it work, but while it's already incredibly hard to develop as a competitive applicant, it'll just be that much harder for you. 

Edited December 1, 2014 by Hopephily

[modernity_mike]

I take it that you're hoping eventually to pursue a phd in philosophy and so I'm going to write with that in mind. All of the MA programs that I am familiar with don't allow for part-time residency (they require at least 3 courses a term). So one of your options might not really be an option. 

 

You're right that the competition is pretty stiff at the top MA programs. If you don't think you have much of a shot getting an offer at this point (let alone a funded one), then you might consider taking another semester (or year) of graduate seminars either at your local institution or, if possible/necessary, at a more reputable one (I don't know where you did your BS). You can do this as a non-degree seeking student at many schools--again I don't know the particulars about your school so mileage may vary. But this is usually something you can do part time. This could help you get more classes under your belt, get to know faculty that may write your letters for you, improve your writing sample, and also give you a taste for grad school in philosophy. 

 

However, taking this route is going to have drawbacks given your situation. Obviously it'll take a chunk of change but beyond that, working full time and studying philosophy part-time is likely going to limit your philosophical progress. Again since I'm assuming your goal is to become competitive for phd programs, you're going to want to get the most out of your classes which takes a lot of time and energy. You can certainly make it work, but while it's already incredibly hard to develop as a competitive applicant, it'll just be that much harder for you. 

 

Thanks for the reply, your advice sounds good.  While it will cost me to take courses as a non-degree seeking student, I'd still be able to save some money, pay off my loans and increase my chances of getting into a solid MA program.

 

Edit - The issue now is that many universities (especially those in the area I live) offer their courses during the day or early evening.  

Edited December 1, 2014 by modernity_mike

[Hopephily]

Sure thing. Best of luck! 

[philstudent1991]

Most graduate programs offer their seminars almost exclusively in the evenings, while cross listed courses are during the day. You'll need to be flexible to succeed in graduate school, but your desire for evening classes is probably not a deal breaker. Working part time, however, is probably not going to work. If I were you, which I am not, I would only go to an MA that offers funding. More on that in a second.

 

Yes, the competition at top MA programs (Tufts, Brandeis, GSU, UW Milwaukee, NIU) is stiff. But they are not closed to non-traditional students. While most people at such programs likely majored in philosophy, you wouldn't be alone in not being a philosophy major in undergrad. But, you MUST have some philosophy background to have a chance. As you say, taking some philosophy courses to improve your application is a good idea. But going into debt for philosophy, before even entering an MA, is not a good idea. But everyone has different economic concerns of course so only you can really evaluate that.

 

Yes, funding at the MA level is not like a PhD level. But among the top five, I believe that GSU, NIU and UWM all offer decent funding.

 

On the GRE. Idk what your score is but don't overestimate its importance. A high verbal is important, as a general claim. But some MAs don't really weight the GRE much at all, and I wouldn't expect any at all are deeply concerned about the quantitative score, provided it's not embarrassing. That's just my guess though. But I can guarantee this: some terminal MAs only require the GRE because it's a university mandate they are bound to. If they could waive the requirement, they would. That is telling about how much they worry about it.

 

You don't mention the three most important things: GPA in philosophy, letter of rec from philosophers and writing sample. If you lined up these effectively, they could overcome a questionable background, at the MA level at least.

[primenumbers]

You should note that most top MA programs are just as competitive and have just as high variance as PhD programs, so if you can improve your background locally as a non-degree seeking student, it may be wise to apply to both if you are sure that is what you want to do.  

[Lyzl]

One thing that others here haven't mentioned is Canadian MA programs.

Some Canadian MA programs are competitive in getting students in ranked Ph.Ds (though not of the same tier as Tufts and the like), and are often easier to get funded. Simon Fraser (Vancouver), Ryerson (Toronto), and Concordia (Montreal) for Continental work are all options.