Good Enough?

[TakeruK]

I agree with that, Lyre... The contacts I've made so far have truly enriched my research and focus.  At this point, I'm a little reluctant to ask for assistance in the whole admission process though.  It seems so "interested" to me--like the people that wait until application season to reach out to certain professors at certain programs.  It seems like the act telegraphs interest (as it probably should).  I'm of the mind, I guess, that those personal relationships and discussions should enrich thinking, stimulate creation, and target research which would hopefully translate into publications, conferences, and general personal growth.

 

In my opinion, these personal relationship should exist because: 1) you are genuinely interested in the field, and 2) your professor is genuinely interested in your career development (could be as simple as making sure you ask them for a LOR, or mentoring/guiding them through the whole process).

 

I have found that some professors like mentoring more than others, and some professors will go out of their way to provide opportunities to promising students. Other professors have opinions that are like "undergrad/grad student = labour source", so they might not really think about their students much more than the work relationship they have. I'm oversimplifying the complex nature of advisors (after all, they are human too!) by only using these two categories of course!

 

I think that if you are lucky, you will get professors that are of the mentoring kind. After that, you know to seek out future supervisors that are also the mentoring kind. This is what happened to me, I think. 

 

I think that while ideally, these personal relationships should form naturally out of shared common interests, it doesn't always have to be that way. Sometimes the best help you can get requires you to go out and seek it. Some professors are not natural mentors (after all, they get no such training, and they might not have had mentor-type supervisors themselves) and some of them might even be very willing and happy to help you, but they don't even know you need/want it unless you ask. 

 

In addition, in academia, I really think we should not be so afraid to take "interested" actions. I would consider it just part of strategizing. For example, I am forming my thesis committee right now, and I am purposely inviting certain professors that will serve my own interests. I don't want to write too many personal details, but one common thing most grad students have to worry about is finding 3 good LORs at time of graduation for application to post-doc jobs. So, finding committee members to collaborate and work with is one good way to get that.

 

Other examples of "interested" actions are purposely seeking out people working on the same topic as me at conferences to form new working relationships (not necessarily collaborating, but knowing about each other so we can talk about each other's work, or send pre-prints of papers etc.). 

 

So, I don't think seeking out a professor with the goal of getting application help is that much different than what academics regularly do. A good personal/working relationship still requires the ideal mutual interests thing, but you don't have wait for it to naturally happen. There's nothing wrong with trying to spark a relationship by seeking help and taking other "interested" actions. And especially in academia, where some people might be more used to working alone, or professors being too busy to worry/think about all of their students, such initial actions might be necessary and the only thing in the way of a very rewarding mentorship for both parties! 

 

After all, there are probably many people out there that would be really happy to help you, but only if you ask for it/let them know you need it. (e.g. look at all the responses this thread got because you asked!)

[letstalkshop]

For me, it was being encouraged to apply to top programs by my MA advisors, and being told I had a really good chance (with the caveat that it may be a crapshoot anyway). I have pretty strong GREs (V165, Q162, AW 5.5), and at the time I had an under review publication (which has since been rejected). I have a just fine GPA from a good small liberal arts school (3.6), but a 4.0 from my MA in sociology (but I don't know whether they care about this much or not, since it's for some reason really easy to get great grades in soc grad classes). I have strong LORs, 2/3 from well known people, and pretty solid research experience with two well known profs. I also had some extra disposable income, which might sound ridiculous to say, but helps explain my willingness to apply to so many competitive schools despite the fact that I know they're so hard to get into. I was seriously considering applying to schools that aren't top 20 but was also STRONGLY discouraged from attending anything but a top school, since it allegedly wouldn't be worth spending 5 years at a not-so-great program given your eventual job market appeal.

 

I do think it's likely that people who are really aggressive about applying to competitive schools are also more likely to aggressively post on a forum like this, but that could be too simplistic of an assessment.  I also think, honestly, why not aim high?

[theoryoftheories]

I also think, honestly, why not aim high?

 

My thoughts exactly.

[busybeinganxious]

I suspect quite a few people aim high because if they don't they'll wonder for years what would have happened if they had.  

[anonymous_soc]

I suspect quite a few people aim high because if they don't they'll wonder for years what would have happened if they had.

Exactly this. Pretty much exactly what one of my professors (and LOR writer) told me. Don't want to have to look back and wonder what could have been.