How bright is my future?

[lenalenabobena]

I just received my official GRE scores in the mail today and I was surprised by my analytical results. Now, I find myself fretting about how it will look in my application. So I want to see what other people think.

I'm just going to list things about me. I attend Florida State University and am majoring in English Literature. I have a 4.0 GPA. I am involved with my school's speech and debate team and many honor societies. I am graduating early. I aid a professor with research. I am currently working on my undergraduate honors thesis. I work at my school's peer tutoring center.

Now for the down side... My GRE verbal and quantitative scores are good but not stellar: V - 660 Q - 610 and my analytical is a very low 4.5.

I am looking to apply to schools ranging from top 10 through top 40, with my favorite being the University of Washington.

How do my chances (of getting into UW primarily) look to you? Should I retake the GRE?

I am so nervous.

[circumfession]

What can help: 4.0 (one of your FSU peers, two years ago, got in everywhere and ended up in a top English Ph.D program). The research and the thesis (especially if it's very strong, and you use it as your writing sample) can definitely play in your favor.

What has absolutely no effect: speech, debate, honor society. (Graduate programs really don't care about extra-circular activities...at all). 610 Quant, 4.5 Analytic. Seriously, few schools take the AW scores seriously. They understand that writing for a literature program is absolutely unlike the AW format. I wouldn't sweat this, and DEFINITELY wouldn't retake the test simply for the AW score. I know students with your score (or even lower) who had offers from the Ivy's.

What might hurt: The verbal score. I scored a 650 the first time (and a maddeningly insane 800 quant)...and opted to retake it, so I can't say what my chances would have been like had I applied with that score. But many of the top programs do *prefer* (but have made many exceptions others) a 680 or 700 verbal. Those, from what I've seen, tend to be limited to the top 10 programs and the ivy's. Overall, the verbal score (which is really the only GRE score that counts, outside of the lit GRE) is a small factor in the admissions decision, but it is possible that it might make a difference at the highest ranked and most competitive programs. Every program looks at the GRE score slightly differently. Several programs (I can't name them, unfortunately and I have no idea if UW is among them) use it as a "cutting" score for the first step of the process: students with a certain GRE and/or GPA go in one pile to be read carefully, students who are borderline go into a middle pile to be skimmed, and students who are significantly below it go into "dump" pile (though there'll usually be one professor who sorts through that pile to rescue any especially promising applicants). In other words, the GRE can keep you out, but it won't get you in. 700 is generally considered a "safe" number for all schools...680 should suffice for all but the top 10 (and understand, those ranges are extremely approximate).

[lenalenabobena]

Thanks a lot! This was very helpful and informative!

[joeygiraldo]

Circumfession is right on the mark for the above points. One thing especially is breaking 700 verbal for those top 10 schools and ivy's.

The general rule is that you should break 600 verbal to apply to ANY English Ph.D. program--it doesn't matter if the school is in the top 20 or in the top 75. You have completed this goal, but I urge anyone else reading this to do the same. Trust me when I say this: the verbal is the most important GRE element (and I'm including the Subject) when applying for an English degree. Schools nowadays get so many applications that they are using unspoken benchmarks to weed out applications quickly. I took the GRE four times in an effort to break 600... I finally did and because I think my writing sample was immaculate, I got moderate success this past application season. I bombed the Subject test (read: 40 percentile! no joke!) and that's probably why I got some rejections, too, but the Subject exam is being taken less seriously by nearly everyone as of late (just check out Columbia English web page to read their hard-lined opinion on the matter).

But anyway, this is about you and your 660 verbal and I think you should be fine with that score for top 10-40 programs. If you honestly believe you can break 700 and have the time to prepare and retake it, then by all means do so, but I'd start concentrating on other aspects of your app.

Cheers,

JG

[circumfession]

I hope that this compliments rather than contradicts my advice. I have seen plenty of exceptions to the 700 rule for the ivys/top ten. Both my partner and I got into top ten programs with a 690, and I know of at least 2 applicants last year who got into Princeton (and a few other Ivys) with a considerably lower scores. What I'm saying, I suppose, is that you should seriously consider your time and resources. It's the writing sample and SoP that will get you in. If you have any doubt that either of those are less than absolutely stellar, prioritize those over a GRE re-take. When I re-took my GRE's, my writing sample had already gone through 4 months worth of revisions, and I still had another 6 months to continue tinkering with it (I was finished with undergrad by that point). If you're still taking classes/writing a thesis, and you've yet to take the lit GRE, and assuming that your writing sample hasn't been edited to perfection...I'd say focus on those elements rather than throw another $160 at the GRE.

Good luck!

[joeygiraldo]

It was meant to compliment, yes. I mean, the 600 verbal rule is pretty universal across-the-board. I applied to Master's programs two years ago and talked to, what I thought, was a large number of professors all over the Northeast. This year, applying to Doctoral programs, I talked to even more professors across the nation (in total, probably 20 schools) and I do not think you can get into a PhD program with a, say, 540 verbal... unless you are a published scholar already or a trained academic. Trust me on this.

The 700 rule, though, as you state, is definitely a tad bit more flexible. And there are many exceptions.

[circumfession]

Oops, what the above post is supposed to say that I hope MY second reply compliments my first. Apologies for the confusion.

I haven't heard about the 600 verbal rules, but I can definitely imagine how a score below 600 (especially if accompanied by a lower quant score) might be problematic just in terms of securing funding. The GRE's a bitch in that respect...it rarely really helps, especially at top programs, but it can definitely waylay your application.

[lenalenabobena]

Thank you both! I guess I will have to weigh my options. Regardless, I feel very relieved.

[Minnesotan]

Oops, what the above post is supposed to say that I hope MY second reply compliments my first. Apologies for the confusion.

If you're taking the GRE soon, make sure you learn the difference between compliment and complement.

[circumfession]

Hmmm. Minnesotan: is that comment genuinely meant to be helpful, or are you simply nitpicking my grammar? Let me point out the context of my advice:

I hope that this compliments rather than contradicts my advice. I have seen plenty of exceptions to the 700 rule for the ivys/top ten. Both my partner and I got into top ten programs with a 690

It looks as though I won't be retaking the GRE's any time soon.

[joeygiraldo]

I certainly meant "compliment" in my reply; circumfession gave good advice and I was the one congratulating there. But "complement" works, too, surprisingly.

[Minnesotan]

I stand by my advice.