International Postdoc-ing

[lrlrlrlrlr]

You know, tons of non-US PhDs come to the US to do their postdoctoral training, and there is tons of information and resources out there on making this kind of career move. Yet it seems like NOBODY talks about the reverse - American PhDs doing their postdoctoral training abroad!

 

It's so biased - at many career development events, International students coming to the US is often given considerable discussion yet the reverse is completely ignored.

 

Why?

[TakeruK]

Well, these career development events are often hosted by US institutions and so these institutions know a lot about non-US graduates doing postdocs at US schools, but they would not know very much about US students going abroad! I think this is something that would generally be the responsibility of the foreign schools to send information to inform/recruit US graduates to their programs!

 

I agree that this would be a useful resource to have on campus though. Students at my school are currently trying to reach out to our alumni network to have recent graduates come tell current students about their paths (whether it's a US postdoc, international postdoc, US industry job, international industry job, government organization, NGO, etc.) so that we can learn from their experience. Unfortunately, for logistical reasons, getting our alumni that went abroad after graduation is the hardest since they are so far away! 

 

I agree with you that it is a "bias" but I think it's a bias due to the circumstances above, not a deliberate attempt to hide information from US students thinking of doing a postdoc in another country! I would recommend that if you want to know more, you can find other like-minded students and try to get a discussion panel or some kind of event with this information for you! Maybe at the next career event, or just a standalone event. If you have problems finding alumni who are still abroad, maybe you can find some young/new faculty who recently did a postdoc abroad. Good luck!

[fuzzylogician]

In addition to the above, it also depends on your goals for the postdoc and where you want to go. If you want a job in the US, it's often advisable to stay in the US and not move to another country. If you want a job in Europe, on the other hand, it's probably a good idea to find a postdoc there so you can solidify connections and be more visible (and of course, the same goes for the Far East, Australia, the UK, etc.). That said, I think that depending on your field, there are probably a few great schools in Canada that would allow you to remain visible and competitive for US jobs, and probably also some European schools like that as well. For my field, for example, I could easily list 4-5 good places for a postdoc in Europe that would certainly look good on your CV if you want a job in the US (or Europe for that matter) and also 2-3 good programs in Canada. However, this is very field specific and therefore probably difficult for a career center to advise on. It's something you would want to consult with your advisors about, taking your career plans and subfield into account.

[lrlrlrlrlr]

In addition to the above, it also depends on your goals for the postdoc and where you want to go. If you want a job in the US, it's often advisable to stay in the US and not move to another country. If you want a job in Europe, on the other hand, it's probably a good idea to find a postdoc there so you can solidify connections and be more visible (and of course, the same goes for the Far East, Australia, the UK, etc.). That said, I think that depending on your field, there are probably a few great schools in Canada that would allow you to remain visible and competitive for US jobs, and probably also some European schools like that as well. For my field, for example, I could easily list 4-5 good places for a postdoc in Europe that would certainly look good on your CV if you want a job in the US (or Europe for that matter) and also 2-3 good programs in Canada. However, this is very field specific and therefore probably difficult for a career center to advise on. It's something you would want to consult with your advisors about, taking your career plans and subfield into account.

 

Well, these career development events are often hosted by US institutions and so these institutions know a lot about non-US graduates doing postdocs at US schools, but they would not know very much about US students going abroad! I think this is something that would generally be the responsibility of the foreign schools to send information to inform/recruit US graduates to their programs!

 

I agree that this would be a useful resource to have on campus though. Students at my school are currently trying to reach out to our alumni network to have recent graduates come tell current students about their paths (whether it's a US postdoc, international postdoc, US industry job, international industry job, government organization, NGO, etc.) so that we can learn from their experience. Unfortunately, for logistical reasons, getting our alumni that went abroad after graduation is the hardest since they are so far away! 

 

I agree with you that it is a "bias" but I think it's a bias due to the circumstances above, not a deliberate attempt to hide information from US students thinking of doing a postdoc in another country! I would recommend that if you want to know more, you can find other like-minded students and try to get a discussion panel or some kind of event with this information for you! Maybe at the next career event, or just a standalone event. If you have problems finding alumni who are still abroad, maybe you can find some young/new faculty who recently did a postdoc abroad. Good luck!

 

Unfortunately, I don't know a single person who is American and went to another country to do their postdoc or settle in their career =/ As well, most of the researchers in my institution are foreigners who came to the US to do research. So, settling up a panel discussion with Americans who worked outside the US probably won't happen.

 

I would like a postdoc in Canada, for personal reasons (my husband does not want to stay/live in the US) he is European, and Europe is a bit too far from my family so we compromised on Canada; he's lived there and likes it there too. I just don't have any idea what the job market is like there for biomedical researchers, and if I should worry. We talked about me finding a permanent position there after a postdoc too, but like I said I have no idea of the level of competition there is for an American moving there as well as the funding for sciences. I think I would be happy career wise teaching biological/medical sciences to undergrads at a small liberal arts college, and maintaining a small research program mentoring those kinds of students. 

 

Takeruk, you are Canadian, do you know of any resources for me to look into for establishing a career there? I know of the Fulbright fellowship, but I'm sure there are more I don't know about. You can PM me if you want 

[eeee1923]

My goals include completing a postdoc in Europe (either in the UK or Germany) since a lot of the companies I want to work for have their HQ's in these countries. Not my only reason but I feel that having some more international scientific exposure will positively impact my career (I did some of my early schooling in the Middle East & Europe)

[TakeruK]

pastina:

 

The Canadian Government has some postdoc fellowships that international people are eligible for. NSERC (our equivalent to your NSF) funds people at all levels (undergrads, grads, postdocs, faculty) and for postdocs and beyond, there are some awards with no citizenship requirements. The goal of this program is not just to spend money on Canadians, it's also to attract smart foreign people like you to our country

 

Note: You are not eligible for the standard NSERC Postdoctoral Fellowship ($45k/year) but you are eligible for the prestigious Banting Postdoctoral Fellowship ($70k/year): http://www.nserc-crsng.gc.ca/Students-Etudiants/PD-NP/Banting-Banting_eng.asp(yeah, these are very prestigious and hard to get, but so are the Fulbright!)

 

For all other NSERC postdoc programs, see: http://www.nserc-crsng.gc.ca/Students-Etudiants/PD-NP/index_eng.asp

 

There are also field-specific postdoc fellowships that are open to international people. Maybe you can check your field's national society in Canada for awards, and you can also check your field's major institutions in Canada to see if they offer any program. For example, the Canadian Institute for Theoretical Astrophysics (in Toronto) offers a number of postdoc awards tenable at U. Toronto and other Canadian schools (several of my US friends are receiving these next year!). These opportunities are often advertised along with jobs in your field's main job register (the Canadian fellowships in my field do show up in the American Astronomical Society's job register, so maybe yours will have them too).

 

I hope that is helpful and answers your question! Please feel free to PM me for more personal questions (or just reply here). Or please clarify if this is not what you meant I can also answer questions about Canadian schools/living in Canada etc.