Need Some Advice

[ZenoTheStoic]

Hi guys,

 

Currently, I'm a master's History student at an Ivy, looking to hopefully change directions and get accepted into a classics Ph.D (specifically classical archaeology). But, in doing my due diligence, there is an issue that I want to rectify to give myself the best shot at acceptance.

 

Simply put, my languages are lacking. I have some basic UG in Latin and Greek, and some HS German, but looking over the requirements, I know that I'm severely lacking in these departments, but I'm committed enough to try to improve my weaknesses. 

 

My question is, are admissions officers from these top schools (Not saying I'll get in, but I have to shoot for it) looking for language proficiency, or are they looking for college-based language proficiency. What I mean by that is, if I go out and buy the Rosetta Stone Latin, and start working through it, or find a local class or tutor, will that change my interest as a candidate to schools, or do I need need something credit based? Even credit based wouldn't be terrible, but for obvious reasons, would require a much larger monetary commitment, something I wouldn't want to undertake unless I absolutely needed to.

 

Thanks in advance, and I appreciate all the info you guys have on the forum. It makes decisions and planning that much easier. 

[ἠφανισμένος]

Don't do Rosetta Stone for Latin.  Yes, classics admissions committees are looking for language work on the transcript.  Self-study can be beneficial, but it probably can't replace graded coursework.  What is sometimes possible, however, is to study the equivalent of one or two semesters of a language on your own, and then jump in to the next course in the sequence.  I studied Latin for a while independently and then, after talking with the instructor, walked into a fourth-semester Latin course.  Since I'd done the higher-level course, the absence of the lower-level courses didn't matter.

  

The good news is that language standards for archaeologists are generally lower than those for philologists.  How much Latin and Greek from undergrad do you actually have?  Do you have any chance to take Greek or Latin as part of your MA?

 

Hopefully an archaeologist will chime in.

[Melian4]

Dear Zeno,

 

It really depends on the kind of classical archaeology program you will be applying for. The top programs generally have much more stringent modern and ancient language requirements. They generally expect you to be able to read two modern languages (i.e. they expect you to be able to plough through an article or monograph in German and French or Italian with reasonable speed). As for the ancient languages, some programs will only require you to pass a big Latin or Greek exam (or both), while others will require you to take a certain number of graduate-level classes with the philologists. 

 

The rule of thumb for archaeology is that you should be proficient in at least one modern language and have done at least three years in your strong ancient language and two in your weak one. If you don't meet these requirements, you would be better to invest in credit-based classes, as programs will not take into account self-study Rosetta stone practice.

 

Could you take grad-level ancient language classes at your MA institution? It would be the best way to demonstrate your ability and motivation while bringing up your translation skills to speed.  

Edited April 2, 2015 by Melian4

[ciistai]

Hello, classical archaeologist here! You'll definitely need a bit of both Latin and Greek for the top programs, and having some modern languages under your belt would also be an advantage. Wouldn't worry as much about your German and much so about Latin and Greek - I agree with Petros that it's not so much about the credit totals but the competence you can demonstrate by having done some upper level courses. Personal statements are a great opportunity to explain why you might not have lower-level credits for Latin, but if you can do well with advanced courses then they might be satisfied. For most major programs, though, you will also need some Greek - probably 2 years at minimum. You should try to improve your German too but I think that's far easier to do outside of courses, whereas with the ancient languages it's a bit trickier.

 

I should also note that language requirements for classical archaeologists in the UK are MUCH lower than in North America. I'm currently at Oxford doing my MPhil and none of us have had language reqs - I've taken classes here and there to improve German and Italian but I've had no language exams (unlike the ancient historians), and I don't think the DPhils have rigorous language reqs the way PhD students in N America do. I believe the rest of the UK is probably much the same. I'm not saying to apply to DPhil/PhD in the UK and you'll be a shoo-in, because language experience can be a huge asset - my supervisor (who was DGS when I was admitted) told me that my language experience is what made my application stand out - but it's not a solid requirement. 

 

Edit: I've basically repeated almost everything that Melian said But I suppose reinforcing the point is always good.

Edited April 2, 2015 by ciistai

[Melian4]

Hello, classical archaeologist here! You'll definitely need a bit of both Latin and Greek for the top programs, and having some modern languages under your belt would also be an advantage. Wouldn't worry as much about your German and much so about Latin and Greek - I agree with Petros that it's not so much about the credit totals but the competence you can demonstrate by having done some upper level courses. Personal statements are a great opportunity to explain why you might not have lower-level credits for Latin, but if you can do well with advanced courses then they might be satisfied. For most major programs, though, you will also need some Greek - probably 2 years at minimum. You should try to improve your German too but I think that's far easier to do outside of courses, whereas with the ancient languages it's a bit trickier.

 

I should also note that language requirements for classical archaeologists in the UK are MUCH lower than in North America. I'm currently at Oxford doing my MPhil and none of us have had language reqs - I've taken classes here and there to improve German and Italian but I've had no language exams (unlike the ancient historians), and I don't think the DPhils have rigorous language reqs the way PhD students in N America do. I believe the rest of the UK is probably much the same. I'm not saying to apply to DPhil/PhD in the UK and you'll be a shoo-in, because language experience can be a huge asset - my supervisor (who was DGS when I was admitted) told me that my language experience is what made my application stand out - but it's not a solid requirement. 

 

Edit: I've basically repeated almost everything that Melian said But I suppose reinforcing the point is always good.

Really good point about Oxford and UK schools in general Ciistai!  When I was doing my MSt at Ox in classical archaeology, I was shocked to learn that some grad students (albeit in Roman archaeology) could not even read the Greek alphabet, let alone translate a full sentence. 

I would add that although it is possible to get into a DPhil program in the UK without having studied much Greek or Latin, it is not a good idea to do so. Picking both languages up as you go will be difficult and extremely time consuming. It's always good to be as well-rounded as possible, as early as possible!  

[heliogabalus]

It's a shame your Ivy would charge you for language training. I'm guessing this is Columbia's MA program?

[Anonclassics]

From a practical standpoint, you are not going to have time to pick up the basics of Greek or Latin when you start a PHD program. That's why programs require students have taken 2-3 years, if not more for philologists. You need to be able to hit the ground running and start tackling that reading list, as a fair number of archaeology programs will require you to pass a reading exam in one of the ancient languages as well as in the modern languages. You will also have a zillion other things to do because you're studying archaeology. For your own sake and health, you do not want to be behind in the languages.

By the way, you want to go to a program that requires archaeologists to have some training in the languages. Good luck getting a job in a Classics department without that.