Toronto MA

[gughok]

I'm on track to graduate with my BA this coming spring, and I'm considering completing a preparatory MA instead of applying straight to a PhD program, to make sure I'm ready. Has anybody had any experience with the University of Toronto's master's program in philosophy? I've seen conflicting reports: some say, as I expect, that being a master's student in a grad program that offers PhDs results in a lot of marginalization and a difficult experience. Others say that while it's intense, if you proverbially get your foot in the door of your professors, you'll do fine. I feel like this is something I should know about before entering the program so I'm hoping someone can enlighten me with further explanation.

[ianfaircloud]

Why are you considering Toronto?  It's certainly not the best place to do the MA as a stepping stone to the PhD.  But maybe you have reasons in favor of Toronto. What are you looking for in a master's program? What's important to you? Funding? Chance of admission to PhD? Chance of admission to strong PhD?

It sounds like readiness matters to you. In my view, if you make it to a top-PhD program, it's extremely unlikely that you weren't ready, in the important sense. But maybe you mean something else by readiness ("to make sure [you're] ready").

[gughok]

Why are you considering Toronto?  It's certainly not the best place to do the MA as a stepping stone to the PhD.  But maybe you have reasons in favor of Toronto. What are you looking for in a master's program? What's important to you? Funding? Chance of admission to PhD? Chance of admission to strong PhD?

It sounds like readiness matters to you. In my view, if you make it to a top-PhD program, it's extremely unlikely that you weren't ready, in the important sense. But maybe you mean something else by readiness ("to make sure [you're] ready").

Hm, thank you for this, you're raising important and interesting considerations for me.

Professors with whom I've consulted on the subject have called Toronto's program "terrific" and opined that I should have no difficulty being productive there. One, to whom I conceded that Tufts' terminal MA is ranked better (top, I know), disagreed that "it may be the ranked best among terminal MAs, but once you bring in MAs within PhD-granting programs it might not hold up so well". So I guess I've been riding on their advice that Toronto would be a good intermediate step? At the same time, at least one has encouraged me to apply simultaneously to my top choice PhDs since the application materials would be similar - the implication I received being that I might have a chance as-is.

Other than that, I have strong financial reasons in favour of Toronto - they're one of few strong MAs to offer full funding to all admitted student, not to mention a sizeable stipend, and I really don't want to be in debt before I even start a PhD. Being Canadian, too, means it's bureaucratically convenient and improves my chances of admission (at least for the MA). It's also just close to home.

But when it comes what I'm looking for in a master's program: the only reason I'd want to do an MA is so that I can get to my ideal PhD programs - which, I realize, are very tough programs. I don't want to do an MA when I could be doing my ideal PhD, and I don't think I'd choose to do an MA (at least not next year) if it would not help my chances at a strong PhD.

Which brings me to your "readiness" question: I do not mean "ready" as in "I feel like I'm at the right point in my life to be doing this"; I've already decided I want to study philosophy as much as I can. I mean it rather in terms of ability: could I get into the sort of program I'd want to attend if I applied right now? And if not, I suppose the assumption in my original post was that "going to an MA would prepare me in terms of competitiveness in applications", whether by direct virtue of looking good, or indirectly by giving me the environment I need to improve writing samples, get to know potential referees, et cetera.

So those would be my general answers to your prompts. Thank you, again, for the shrewd inquiries! I'd give you a +1 but I'm all out today.

Edited October 27, 2015 by gughok
typo, embarassing!

[ianfaircloud]

Quick thought on this. A lot of people believe that terminal MAs are the best place to study philosophy on the way to the PhD. Programs that offer both the terminal MA and the PhD, the thought goes, cannot devote as much attention to the MA students as would be devoted to them in a program without PhD students. That's the thought. It sounds right to me, and a lot of smart people (Brian Leiter) think so, too. Based on what I heard from you, I recommend that you prioritize the MA programs that don't offer the PhD.