Missing Essay on Recommendation form

[whereiscarmen]

Hello,

Most of my schools require 3 recommendations.

2 of mine are doing them online, the other one did his by paper. (He's old-fashioned).

I found out recently one of my schools only required 2 recommendations.

My paper recommender finished all my recommendations pretty quickly. (I was very skeptical.)

I decided not to use his recommendation for my school that only requires 2 recommendations because I know that his is the weakest, and I wanted to know how he did them so fast (within a week).

So I looked at the one he wrote for my 2 recommendation school since I'm not going to mail to his anyway. To my surprise, the checkbox portion of the form were all very good. (you know, the top 5% checks).

However, he left the part about now write your paragraph here about the student empty.

Yikes.

Now, I'm a bit worried. I've already mailed in his paper recs to the other schools. I wonder if he did the same thing for my other schools too. I'll admit that on this school's form it was hard to see the question about writing a paragraph because they did not leave any room for it.

The other schools' form left a space to write in a recommendation...so I'm praying that he saw that and wrote something about me. It's not like he doesn't like me. I did/do very well in his classes, he's just slightly careless.

I wish that there was a way I could ask him if he did or not for my other schools. But I can't since I waived my right.

Do you think the schools will contact him asking him for the rest of the recommendation if he didn't write a paragraph? When schools say they have received a paper recommendation before my application has been submitted, does that mean they have opened the envelope and skimmed through it to see if everything is okay? Or does it just mean they got it in the mail without them looking at it?

Will this look bad on me?

Or are my chances at grad school still okay, if...

If my other 2 lor online are strong (with everything filled out) and since this 3rd paper one had good check marks on the checkboxes (despite missing a written rec), do you think it will be okay?

Worse case scenario, I'm hoping I'm getting into this school that only wanted 2 recommendations. But I hate feeling like I'm wasting my time working on these essays for these other 4 schools.

I'm also adding another 6th school (a safety school I think) with an application due February 1st, but I'm scrabbling to find a different 3rd recommender. Hopefully, I'll find someone else in time and will atleast have my 2 "safety" schools applied to with full recommendations in case this incomplete one does mater.

Edited December 21, 2009 by whereiscarmen

[whereiscarmen]

I have emailed 2 potentials to be my 3rd recommender. I'm going to give them a week to reply since the holidays are coming up. If they don't reply, I want to email one of my professors from last semester who I did well in her class and I'm also taking her again this spring. However, she is not in the same department as the program I am applying to like the other recommenders. Do you think this will be okay?

[jacib]

Ask WIDELY, say something like, "One of my recommenders isn't responding, though I emailed him a month ago. If he doesn't reply soon, could you write my recommendation?" I had to do that... he ended up coming through, but one guy wrote back immediately, one guy wrote back in two weeks so... especially over the holidays, at least know who is available. I'd ask at least two people if you're working on a deadline (though Feb 1st will probably be okay).

Generally I think it's okay to have a recommender outside of the field you're applying for, if they can attest to your ability to relevant work: an English professor might not be the best reference for a neuroscience program, but a history professor would probably be alright for a sociology program. In the last scenario, obviously three excellent references from sociologists would be ideal, three excellent references from social scientists would be second best, but an excellent reference from a historian or English professor would probably be better than a tepid one from a sociologist. If you are a hard science, it's probably different, but in the social science and the humanities i think a great recommendation always tops a good one.

Also, I think graduate programs usually don't hold things against you that are out of your control. Even if your recommender didn't write an essay on any of them, as long as your other two did (and they're positive) I don't think it will be a problem. But I don't think getting them finished in a week indicates he half-assed them. Especially after you already know what you're going to say, how long does it take to actually fill in one of those sheets? Like 15 minutes? Think of how long and fast our GRE essays were and we didn't even know the questions to start with... My favorite professor who is very on top of his shit and did all of his stuff in a week and I know he wrote me an excellent reco, (he told me things like: "I'm so delighted that you're applying for a PhD" and "Don't apologize for the inconvenience, I think you are precisely the kind of person who should get a PhD and that's precisely what I'm going to say in my recommendation").

[whereiscarmen]

Nice, thanks.

Yup, my last hopeful recommender is in art history, and I'm applying to social sciences.

I might email her today, since the other 2 haven't responded yet. I think all of the teachers here went on vacation every since Friday came. lol

[ridgey]

Does your writer know you have read his recommendation?

[whereiscarmen]

Does your writer know you have read his recommendation?

Well, I'm not turning that one in.

And he didn't write anything on it anyway.

The ones I turned in I didn't read.

[ridgey]

Well, I'm not turning that one in.

And he didn't write anything on it anyway.

The ones I turned in I didn't read.

That wasn't my question. It seems to me that the best way to find out what he did is to ask him. The reason you haven't is because you know you're in a questionable ethical zone in having read the letter and don't want to get caught.

[glasses]

I decided not to use his recommendation for my school that only requires 2 recommendations because I know that his is the weakest, and I wanted to know how he did them so fast (within a week).

So I looked at the one he wrote for my 2 recommendation school since I'm not going to mail to his anyway.

[ . . . ]

I wish that there was a way I could ask him if he did or not for my other schools. But I can't since I waived my right.

This is all kinds of unethical.

Edited December 23, 2009 by glasses

[modernity]

This is all kinds of unethical.

And is also an excellent example of why you shouldn't look at your letters if someone hasn't given you permission to do so, and hasn't had an open conversation with you about it. It's unethical and puts you in a state of worry that you won't be able to resolve without admitting it to your LOR.

[whereiscarmen]

Yea, I really regret checking and finding out that some of my applications may be in jeopardy and I may want to apply to some extra schools with a different recommender just in case I want to go to grad school.

[jacib]

Yea, I really regret checking and finding out that some of my applications may be in jeopardy and I may want to apply to some extra schools with a different recommender just in case I want to go to grad school.

1) While maybe not the the most moral choice, what's done is done, who cares. I don't think anyone needs to be on a high horse here. 2) It's not by it self going to ruin your chances. Don't kick yourself as if this will keep you out. Especially if the other letters are strong (you said this was your weakest), how can one positive recommendation (remember its still positive if not super detailed) hurt you? I don't think you need to find more schools to apply to. There is a reason most schools want three recommendations, and not fewer.

[modernity]

1) While maybe not the the most moral choice, what's done is done, who cares. I don't think anyone needs to be on a high horse here.

Who cares?

Well, something similar to this happened last year. It's always the same story - I know I shouldn't have opened my letter/I didn't think it would hurt anything, but I did and now I'm worried and stuck.(One time, the LOR didn't forget but actually said negative things about the student). So I'm hoping this serves as an example/warning for future people that browse this forum. I also say the same thing about not looking at your SOP once you've submitted it, but that doesn't have the ethical question attached to it.

You're right that with this individual, what's done is done (and I don't really want to make them feel any worse than they already do) - but there are other people that are going to read this post that might benefit from this person's mistake.

[whereiscarmen]

How was I on a high horse? Did you read some of those responses after your first one from the other posters? Focusing on insignificant details much? lol.

But thanks for ending with a positive note. Makes me hopeful.

But if you ask who cares about this post, why should we care about any post on this forum? To help others of course!

And I also will not look at my SOP once I submit it.

[jacib]

Who cares?

Well, something similar to this happened last year. It's always the same story - I know I shouldn't have opened my letter/I didn't think it would hurt anything, but I did and now I'm worried and stuck.(One time, the LOR didn't forget but actually said negative things about the student). So I'm hoping this serves as an example/warning for future people that browse this forum. I also say the same thing about not looking at your SOP once you've submitted it, but that doesn't have the ethical question attached to it.

You're right that with this individual, what's done is done (and I don't really want to make them feel any worse than they already do) - but there are other people that are going to read this post that might benefit from this person's mistake.

So, Modernity, the ethical lesson to be drawn by future readers is that recommendations should be read before rather than after submitting them?

Whereiscarmen: reread my comment careful, please. Perhaps I wasn't clear enough in whom I was addressing but I wasn't intending to imply that you were on a high horse, kid... Additionally, the "who cares" as in "oh poor little girl is crying" but instead a "who cares what Carmen did she did, and she asked for advice about the next appropriate course of action, not retrospective advice about she did in the past." Sorry to not make that crystal.

[modernity]

So, Modernity, the ethical lesson to be drawn by future readers is that recommendations should be read before rather than after submitting them?

Not sure where you're even drawing that conclusion from (although I get the sense you're trying to be smart), but if it's unclear somehow... let me reiterate: The lesson is, don't read things about your submitted application that you are not going to be able to change - your LORs, your SOP, etc. If you think your LORs are going to be iffy, or you just feel the need to know- then ask if you can see the letters before they submit them. In the event that your LORs don't want to share that info, you don't want to ask, you waive your rights, etc. do not open the letter. There is a reason they're supposed to be sent in signed/sealed envelopes, and why it's customary to waive your rights. People can't write honest accounts of a student if they have to worry about someone looking over their shoulder. Besides being unethical, it's a bit of your insult to your letter writers to say "I trust you completely, but only until I have an extra letter in my hand and I can't resist the temptation." It's a human reaction to want to know what someone said about you, but you knew the rules when you decided to apply (although, since there are people that don't understand the "waive your rights" portion I suppose it's possible that people do not understand this either - all the more reason I hope they come across posts like this one).

All of those ethical and social issues aside... It will be very stressful for someone to know there is a mistake on their application that they cannot fix. It'll keep you up nights and make you fret your little head off, and in the end there's no point because there's nothing you can do now. This process is stressful enough. It's better if you just don't look - at least not until you've heard back from schools.

I'm not attempting to scold anyone, I'm saying don't get yourself in these sticky situations because you're the one that's going to suffer from it. During the waiting period, as it relates to this sort of thing, ignorance is bliss.

[jacib]

Not sure where you're even drawing that conclusion from (although I get the sense you're trying to be smart), but if it's unclear somehow... let me reiterate: The lesson is, don't read things about your submitted application that you are not going to be able to change - your LORs, your SOP, etc. If you think your LORs are going to be iffy, or you just feel the need to know- then ask if you can see the letters before they submit them. In the event that your LORs don't want to share that info, you don't want to ask, you waive your rights, etc. do not open the letter. There is a reason they're supposed to be sent in signed/sealed envelopes, and why it's customary to waive your rights. People can't write honest accounts of a student if they have to worry about someone looking over their shoulder. Besides being unethical, it's a bit of your insult to your letter writers to say "I trust you completely, but only until I have an extra letter in my hand and I can't resist the temptation." It's a human reaction to want to know what someone said about you, but you knew the rules when you decided to apply (although, since there are people that don't understand the "waive your rights" portion I suppose it's possible that people do not understand this either - all the more reason I hope they come across posts like this one).

All of those ethical and social issues aside... It will be very stressful for someone to know there is a mistake on their application that they cannot fix. It'll keep you up nights and make you fret your little head off, and in the end there's no point because there's nothing you can do now. This process is stressful enough. It's better if you just don't look - at least not until you've heard back from schools.

I'm not attempting to scold anyone, I'm saying don't get yourself in these sticky situations because you're the one that's going to suffer from it. During the waiting period, as it relates to this sort of thing, ignorance is bliss.

Yeah sorry I was kind of being a jackass.

Anyway, what you aid reminds me of my high school English teacher, who once actually asked a particularly thick girl, "Tell me, Kristen, is ignorance bliss?" He also had a potted plant in his room that he called the Tree of Knowledge; whenever we made a particularly ignorant or idiotic comment, he'd walk over a yank a leaf off the thing. One of the best teachers I've ever had.

[modernity]

Yeah sorry I was kind of being a jackass.

Anyway, what you aid reminds me of my high school English teacher, who once actually asked a particularly thick girl, "Tell me, Kristen, is ignorance bliss?" He also had a potted plant in his room that he called the Tree of Knowledge; whenever we made a particularly ignorant or idiotic comment, he'd walk over a yank a leaf off the thing. One of the best teachers I've ever had.

High school English teachers are always the most interesting.

[jacib]

High school English teachers are always the most interesting.

He always explained grading policy really clearly on the first day of class. He drew this giant pie chart, and wrote: "Test, quizes, class participation, homework, essays, all other graded work...5%" and then drew the corresponding small slice of the pie chart. "How much I like you...95%" "Okay are there any questions about grading policy?" It's harder to do that as a University instructor, unfortunately.

[LateAntique]

I have no desire to read any of my letters of recommendation (though one of my professors asked me to read his first draft to give him some clues as to what I wanted him to stress). This is because when I asked my professors if they would write me letters I asked, "Would you be willing to write me a strong letter of recommendation for graduate studies?" They were all extremely excited and said yes. I don't have anything to worry about. I cannot imagine anyone would ask a professor for a strong recommendation only to get an entirely negative review (unless the professor is just insanely malicious).