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Nice. I couldn't agree more...but I also read things like this and (hopefully I'm not the only one), I can't help but wonder - fascinatedly! - how anyone ever gets accepted anywhere!  What would the voice of reason say to this sort of reaction?  Like, if I know that I've got some talent and that I could put together a decent application, yet I can't realistically imagine being accepted somewhere, what do you say?  All the correct things sound kind of lame in light of this tripartite reality check, don't they?  Or is that a lack of perspective? [As I write this, Two Espressos writes in with what is potentially an optimistic answer to this dilemma, but even so, I remain first of all persuaded by ComeBackZinc and second of all unpersuaded by Two Espressos, because here's the deal: Two Espressos (congratulations, by the way!) is this other person who got in...we all know that other people get in, we just don't know how to relate to those other people because we're not them, we don't know them, etc. - at best, we only hear about them, and we try to use that as a basis for rationalizing the process!]  I hope that I'm speaking for more than my own insular perspective, here. I'm not trying to fish for enouragement. Truly. I am genuinely perplexed as to how to think of what would appear to be an impossible process, and I genuinely mean this from what ComeBackZinc is calling an "emotionally detached" standpoint.  I am, weirdly and unemotionally, more amused or bewildered than I am scared or depressed or whatever.  Just as weirdly, it doesn't keep me from wanting to apply, and to apply ambitiously. I have no idea what to make of this, nor how to reconcile it, but the fact remains that the scenario of my future acceptance somewhere seems so at odds with...well, the odds...that, even though I know that ComeBackZinc's #1, with which Two Espressos disagrees, isn't exactly the same as "the process is pure randomness" (because it's obviously not), I nevertheless get the feeling that I might as well be playing a lottery. It's a problem to do with my imagination, I guess.  Having no interest in lotteries (on the same grounds; I am literally unable to imagine winning the lottery), wherefore my interest in my applications? Is there a part of myself that truly believes that some of my merit will count for something? If so, this is even more peculiar. It would suggest that a part of myself is wholly unaware of another part of myself. Or maybe another way of putting it: Hearing of Two Espressos acceptance is similar to seeing the random dude on the news who won the lottery.  My imagination makes no distinction. No offense, Two Espressos - like ComeBackZinc I'm in no way suggesting that you aren't fully deserving - but the difference between you and randomness simply doesn't compute in my brain that is all too aware of the odds.  I mean, someone has to get into these programs, just like someone has to win the lottery!  So what is wrong with my brain and/or my imagination?  Do tell!

I think that every generation/cohort thinks that the previous generation are doing something wrong, that things were better in the old days. And every generation thinks that the older generation is irrelevant and stuck in the old ways! This semester, a bunch of us who were TAing were mentioning how much undergrads these days want their TAs to just tell them the answer, and they get mad when we ask them questions in response to their questions. But if we're complaining about our undergrads now, I wonder what our TAs said about us ~4-5 years ago!

Easier said than done, but it seems ideal for the new generation to do as Sigaba says, and remember that the older generation gained a ton of experience getting to where they are now. At the same time, the new generation could be bringing in fresh ideas and it might not be a good idea to dismiss these thoughts simply because we don't have the experience. I am thinking more of the generation gap between current students and junior faculty members, but it could also apply to the gap between PhDs-about-to-graduate/postdocs and incoming grad students.

Now, to "defend"/"explain" "my" cohort despite what I said above

1. I don't agree that Internet BBs are ONLY meant to be repositories of knowledge where someone with a question should try to find every single thread on the topic and read everything. Sure, this is exactly what we do for a literature review for our work, but discussing graduate school, while related to work, isn't work. I think this was the original intention now, but with more and more people growing up in an Internet dominated world, Internet technologies are changing fast. Here's why it makes sense for a new user to post a new question instead of digging up old ones:
a ) Internet rule of not reviving dead posts. On most BBs, it's poor etiquette to post in a thread that has been inactive for some period of time
b ) The user wants to interact with current, active members, not just passively read something -- maybe they already read some of the stuff and now want interaction
c ) Related to ( a ) and ( b ), posting in an old (dead) thread is not effective at getting the attention of current active members. If there is an existing thread 5 pages long, most people will not read the previous 5 pages and write responses taking into account all of the past posts in mind. Most people will either see that it's 5 pages long and not bother, or just write a response based on the new post and not consider the previous posts. In the former case, the OP doesn't get the interaction. In the latter case, there was no advantage to continuing a year-old thread since few people make use of the past -- it's more organized to start a new thread.
d ) It's more satisfying to ask your own question, in your own thread, where you can define the parameters of your question instead of a thread where a mood/tone might have already been developed. This point is more "frivolous" but still plays a factor I think.

My solution? I'm a new member of this community but I've been on other BBs for many years and see the same stuff get asked all the time. It might be more useful to link to a specific post that we think is helpful or just copy and paste something we've written before for the OP, if we think we are repeating ourself.

I think nowadays, a BB is more of a place for a person to announce something (e.g. I have a problem!) and then whoever is around and interested can gather and have a discussion. Although it has the capability to function like a library of knowledge, and there are many who do use it that way, I would say that the majority are drawn to BBs because of the ability to talk to active members, not read through past posts. But it's a good thing that BBs can function in both ways and allows users to choose how to use the BB.

2. Regarding the "sense of entitlement" of "our" cohort. I think this is partially due to the fact that the people entering graduate studies today are VERY different than the people running graduate studies (i.e. profs). It's clear that nowadays, more and more people are going to University and getting degrees -- it's the norm to go to college and I think this is spreading into grad school too. So, the demographics are different. I'm not sure if it's true but it sure feels like many programs expect graduate students to devote themselves to academia. I'm not saying this is the case for any particular person, but I feel that someone from a family who has had people in grad school before (so they understand us) and/or aren't from a "working poor" class would have a much easier time adjusting to graduate student life and doing well than others. Someone who wants to start a family, or needs to send money home to their parents, or wants to do other things than just academia will face more challenges in grad school. One can argue that grad school isn't for those in the above categories and aren't able to / willing to face the challenges, though -- but I don't think this is the right way to do things.

I don't know for sure what the job prospects were for our profs though. Maybe it was just as bad for them but they just toughed it out. I don't think it's a bad idea for our cohort to come with certain expectations and fight/push for changes for things that we want. We should have the ability to voice our opinions and shape the way our graduate program is run. Maybe when all of the new people entering college in the past decade reach faculty positions, graduate programs will be drastically different. Or maybe it won't, if the system ends up doing a good job of self-selecting like-minded people. But fighting for better working conditions or improving student life shouldn't be considered a sense of "entitlement". That is, graduate school shouldn't be a place of "conform or perish" -- the norms of the department should be set by all of its members, including students. If the issues are important enough, the students' voice could be strong enough to cause change.

I guess when it comes down to it, I feel this way because I believe that educational programs (at all levels, i.e. BSc, MSc, PhD) exist to serve the students and it should meet our needs. The faculty members with experience would know what kind of skills are important for academic success so they would build the degree program on this. But it's easy for people to think that "I suffered through this to get to where I am so the students have to as well". And the needs of students back in the day may not be the same as the needs now. So it's important for department to seek feedback from students and incorporate what we would like to get out of our degrees into our degree programs. Maybe this is the "sense of entitlement" that Sigaba is referring to, but I don't think it's unreasonable to want to have some say in our degree programs if we are going to spend 5-6 years of our life and potentially opportunity costs during our PhDs.

@Jeffster--

My conclusion is based upon using the search function for less than a minute and finding several threads that answer the questions asked in the OP. That is, in less time than it took the OP to type up the questions, the member could have found previously offered guidance.

I understand that many newer members of this BB would like to think that the challenges they face are new, that their questions are unique, and that their insights are novel. This attitude undermines the effectiveness of the BB because it encourages newer members to start new threads rather than to build upon existing ones.

In regards to your characterization of my "hijacking" the thread, you have again demonstrated an inability to read carefully. The OP specifically asked for "age related' advice which my reply offered.

Do what you can to minimize the temptation to reinvent the wheel.
Do your level best to learn from those who have gone before you and have asked similar questions.
Consider the utility of incorporating your questions into ongoing discussions.
When assessing the guidance you've received, consider the background, the expertise and the experience of the person who offered it.







If I sound snarky it is because this BB is going through a phase in which newer members are repeating questions that have been addressed many, many times. While this trend provides opportunities to get great guidance from experienced graduate students such as jullietmercredi, it also provides opportunities to miss equally sound guidance from experienced graduate students such as jullietmercredi.

IMO, this trend represents a "lost opportunity" for many of you to start the transition from being undergraduates to being graduate students. As graduate students, you will often encounter an implicit expectation that you are doing the leg work to find the answers to your own questions, and from there generating additional questions and answers. (In some quarters, this leg work is called "research".)

Additionally, some of you who are in your twenties may be walking into a buzzsaw as new graduate students. Your cohort is developing a reputation for having attitudes of entitlement and self-absorption. (Consider how members of the generation of 1965 talk about the OWS and Tea Party movements) Regardless of the accuracy of this perception (Christopher Lasch had the same complaints back in 1978), perception is reality.

While it is your choice as to what questions you want to ask and how you want to ask them, do not be surprised if those who are most capable of helping you decide to tune you out. If you think this can't happen to you, ask yourself why you're asking strangers on the internet for guidance rather than going into a professor's office and getting mentored?

My $0.02.

I down voted myself too. It was fun, who knew. I must really suck.

Hey Gang, sorry for the Bolded Text in my letter to you. I wrote you that in a Google doc. and then when I copied it into the Reply Box, it just went bold, I could not turn it off (so funny that someone mentioned it), so I sent it as was.
 
The worst part of these comments are people who think my posts are too long (sad to see art historians who don't like reading). Have you ever been on any other Forums? What you write is actually meant for the Chat Section. Who wants to check in on a forum full of back-and-forth anxiety ridden one-liners? That's part of the reason I am leaving this thread. It's called "Fall 2013 Applicants" and people shoot one-liners all day long about getting in and not getting in. No one talks about their passions, why they applied, or what the PhD means for them, I tried and look what happened to me.
 
When you all get accepted to your dream programs you will be reading texts much longer and tougher than what I have written on this thread. Are you up for Benjamin, Foucault, Freud, Lacan, Marx, Kant, and Hegel? You might want to practice reading more than one line of text and posting cute animal photos.
 
For the record and just to kind of brag last minute--do keep an eye out on Amazon for a book in which I contributed called Theorizing Visual Studies: Writing Through the Discipline. I am 1 of 60 international graduate students chosen for the book, it was something I did while I was earning my second masters in education. It was a lot of fun! Maybe if you read it you'll learn my true identity, how wild and crazy would that be!
 
Lastly, if anyone wants to engage an open online dialogic community where we discuss our field, contemporary art, who is reading what, and why we want PhDs in the first place--I might start that thread topic some place if there happens to be interest. It might be fun to discuss these things while we wait for rejections and acceptances. Unlike some here, I'm an artist, art educator, and art historian with or without the PhD. It's what you love and learn, not what school, program, or degree you get.
 
Love you guys!
Hang in there.

Look, Hal (may I call you Hal?), I think I'll just be blunt here because a. this is the internet and b. we have no chance of being in the same cohort.
 
I want to think the best of people here on GradCafe, because I like this place and I've met some super people here. So I'm giving you the benefit of the doubt that you don't realize the tone that your posts convey. You keep getting downvotes, though, so maybe you have a clue.
 
Here it is: you're coming across like a condescending asshole and lecturing us like we're two year olds about things we already know. Please refrain.
 
Also, I realize we're in the humanities and not the social sciences, but your mom is a pretty shitty sample size.