[Ithaca, NY]

I can't tell you much about religious life, but I doubt it would be very difficult to find or access whatever churches etc. exist in Ithaca, given how small the city is. The campus community is very large and diverse so I would imagine it would not be any harder to find any religious groups on campus than you would at any other school. 

 

As for climate -- it can be harsh in winter (snow falls a lot and it can get very cold -- between 5-10 degrees colder than NYC; you will need a thicker winter coat than you'd otherwise use elsewhere in most of the US) but very pleasant in summer, as it rarely gets too hot. The fall colors are really incredible.

[Results]

From my understanding and experience: generally, but not always. I didn't have an interview with Washington, but I did my MA there and the faculty already knew me or knew people who knew me. I've also known people who were admitted to programs without formal interviews, but usually they had arranged to talk informally with a POI prior to or during the application process. I've also been told by people working in admissions that some professors will take students based off prior work and recommendations (usually by close colleagues) alone. So like everything in this process, it's arbitrary and unpredictable.

 

Er, I don't know of many programs that require discussions with POIs before admission, either formally or informally, and most programs don't conduct interviews. 

 

I severely doubt there's anywhere where you'd be categorically out of the running because you didn't speak to anyone there beforehand.

[Fall 2014 Applicants]

What's the deal with Cornell? Seems like they're onsie twosie POI admits, but do we think this is the wave and that's it or will they continue to trickle?

 

We're a small program (usually admit around 13 or so), so it's possible those are all that will go up on gradcafe, although it's possible some POIs haven't reached out (I don't know...maybe they've been busy/abroad/on leave/it's not their style?) and some applicants will be informed by email or letter instead. I remember I didn't get official notification for awhile after my POI called. 

 

For the record I haven't heard anything about admits since the faculty met about admissions two weeks ago, so I'm not sure if everything's set in stone yet. 

[Results]

What a long, strange application process this has been.

 

Applied to five programs for 20th c. American: Princeton, Stanford, Penn, Michigan, UVa.

 

Waitlisted by Princeton, rejected by all the others.

 

Nuts to this. I'm going to learn a programming language and get a real job.

 

I agree with the others who've urged you to stick it out for another cycle or two if you really would prefer to become a historian rather than a programmer. Last year, I was in a very similar situation as you and was even rejected by most of the same schools. The difference? I applied to more schools and was accepted by one. Your Princeton waitlist result is impressive (there were only five people on it last year) and probably means you have the right stuff for an acceptance somewhere (it was indicative for me), but just weren't a perfect fit due to various contingencies at any of the limited, highly-selective schools you applied to this year. If you weren't in touch with POIs this year, maybe do so next time and apply to either a wider pool or one where you have some confirmation not just that your interests are a lock, but that logistical circumstances would permit your admission that cycle. 

[Cornell 2014]

My summer stipend amount was also mentioned explicitly in my letter. Since the offer letter is effectively the legal contract you're bound to when you accept a school's offer, I'd clear up questions about whatever doesn't appear on there with your prospective DGS before April 15.

[Crucial Theory for Historians]

Unfortunately, it's like the dream in the movies. You wake up from it, relieved, only soon to discover you're still in it.

 

"We know there are known knowns; there are things we know that we know. There are known unknowns; that is to say, there are things that we now know we don't know. But there are also unknown unknowns – there are things we do not know we don't know." - Donald Rumsfeld, February 2002

[Cornell 2014]

Except in the humanities I think that's what we get before taxes.

[Fall 2014 Applicants]

FYI: Cornell has a four-day weekend, so sorry to say it might be an even longer wait for you if you applied here. 

[Results]

^ That's probably part of it. Many schools also know they have an advantage the earlier an applicant hears a result - because he or she starts planning some details re: attending the first school(s) he/she gets into, which makes it harder to switch to planning for anther school, all else being equal, later. 

[Ithaca, NY]

On 2/15/2014 at 6:02 PM, ReadingLisa said:

Thank you very much Czesc! It's reassuring to know that I don't need a car to get by up there. The more I read over this entire thread the more I'm enticed by the scenic beauty of the campus, which is definitely not something I can get in the city. In my department, though, (English) I think we're required to teach up to our fifth year so I don't think I could move after my third. 

 

Thank you again for offering your help.

 

Glad to be of help. I'd make sure about that teaching requirement. I know that in history we can teach during each of the last four/five years we're supported, but it's not at all required for the PhD -- just the way you keep receiving your stipend in the absence of any external grant. And we definitely have one year of automatic departmental support for dissertation writing that's teaching-free. I would be surprised if this varied that significantly across the humanities.

[Ithaca, NY]

Hey Lisa,

 

I'm from NYC too (and before that lived in Boston), and I hated the idea of moving here. As someone who understands the environment you're coming from, though, let me tell you: it's really not so bad once you get used to it. I don't own a car and walk or take public transportation virtually everywhere, which is pretty easy thanks to where in town I've chosen to live, and I would say there are a great portion of other grad students (and even professors) who also do this. Now that I've settled in, I feel like living here (at least in the urban portions of Ithaca) almost reminds me more of living in certain parts of Boston or DC than living in a rural hamlet. 

 

And there are added benefits: the scenery is beautiful, for example, and you have access to things like waterfalls and wineries that don't exist in extremely close proximity to the city. There are fewer distractions from your work (which would take up most of your time wherever you went) and living on a grad stipend is very, very easy here compared to larger cities. Keep in mind, also -- even if you dislike it completely, it's really only around three years max (not counting breaks) until you're ABD and can move wherever to work on your dissertation. And it's possible to go back to NY on weekends as well -- I do this all the time.

 

Feel free to PM me if you have any other specific questions/concerns.

[Cornell 2014]

How does Zipcar work? Do I have to pay per mile? Would be awesome not having to buy a car. I want to use a bike when possible anyways. Will be a good workout with all those hills

 

 

It's Ithaca Carshare, and it's like Zipcar but is not Zipcar (which is its own company that does not have cars in Ithaca). I just got Ithaca Carshare myself. Cornell pays your annual fee, and you pay $7.95 per hour, plus a small mileage fee (I think 30 cents per mile?) though you don't always pay that much...the cars are reservable in 15-minute increments. The hourly fee is also heavily reduced after a certain time (I think 11pm). And you never have to pay for gas; there's a card in the cars to pay for it when it runs low. In terms of how it works, you put in your reservation online -- there's also a smartphone app if you're on the go. They issue you a card that you then wave over the car to unlock it. When you're done, you need to return it to the same parking spot where it was before.

 

It's good for short trips, especially stocking up on groceries. Because rental cars here are also cheap, though, carshare doesn't really make financial sense if you need a car for more than about 4 hours or so. You can sometimes rent cars at Enterprise in town for as low as $29/day.

 

All that said, the bus system is actually pretty good, there are taxis around if necessary, and I find that enough people have cars that I wind up riding with them often as well, so there's lots of options if you don't want a car.

[Ithaca, NY]

I am sorry but I would strongly disagree with a lot of this.  Not that I think that the solomon west is an amazing location but there are buses to and from central campus and heading into downtown twice every hour and you will be living very close to the ithaca mall and triphammar mall.  The location is not that bad but if you want to live downtown then it is not the thing.  In summer - you can bike to Cornell in 20 minutes from that location so it's not far out and Suburban Ithaca is actually kinda neat and is not "suburbia" proper.  And living there will not affect your social life if you want one. 

 

Of course, it's not as if it's impossible to live there. Ithaca suburbia is far away from, say, living in suburban NYC relative to Manhattan, meaning you have some kind of hours long commute. I just think it's inconvenient compared to other places in town. A 20 minute bike ride to campus in summer is awesome. What's not so awesome is that most of the academic year here is freezing, and waiting for a long time outside for a bus stuck in traffic and/or having to worry about waiting even longer because you've missed the only one for the next 40 minutes is annoying. And sure, you're closer to the malls...but those aren't really very walkable environments anyway. 

 

There's a reason apartments in that area are priced more cheaply for what you get than those in the city proper.

 

 

Has any of you guys lived in Berkeley (only college town I've been). If so, or even if not so, I'd love to hear your thoughts on how Ithaca compare in terms of:

 

- bike-ability

- availability/price of groceries (I cook my own meals, mostly; don't eat out much)

- availability of "study cafes" (e.g. not the neigborhood Starbucks with the AC and music cranked up rendering you progressively deafer and dumber)

- natural scenery

 

Given the above factors as desirables, which neighborhoods/sides of campus (north, south, east, west) would you recommend? I enjoy biking so distance from campus is not a big deal as long as it's bikeable within 20 mins.

 

Thanks a lot (and if you have questions re Berkeley feel free to pm me!)

 

I haven't been to Berkeley but I think I can address some of these desirables in general. From the photos I've seen of B, I'd say Ithaca is comparable if not better in terms of natural beauty (there's no San Francisco to gaze out upon, of course, but there is a similar hill/vista toward a large body of water setup, plus four seasons, which keeps things varied and fresh...and a ton of gorges and waterfalls, something Berkeley does not have).

 

There are a bunch of supermarkets in town, but they generally cluster toward the southwest, far away from campus. There's no real supermarket within an easy walk of the school. And the southwestern grocery stores require a bus transfer to reach from campus as well (another reason why I find living downtown convenient - since the buses converge here, you don't really ever have to transfer, and there is at least a smallish supermarket downtown as well). If you have a car, any of the grocery stores are a fairly quick drive, though. Beyond larger grocery stores, there are plenty of mini-marts, convenience stores, bodegas, etc. all over, and a fairly cheap grocery delivery service called Rosie.

 

Grocery prices vary, but there's nothing spectacularly cheap. If you've spent time in the SF Bay area you're probably used to Trader Joe's, which is cheap and fairly decent quality. You can get good quality groceries in Ithaca, but prices at Wegmans and GreenStar (the local, somewhat smaller, more health-focused version of Whole Foods) aren't as good a value as at TJ's. 

 

In the warmer summer months there's a Farmer's Market that features a ton of affordable (and also a ton of not so affordable) food. It's an amazing experience, actually; it feels more like some kind of gourmet foodie festival than a rural farmer's market (though you can also get everything you'd normally get at a farmer's market there). The market is also fairly distant from campus by foot/bike/bus, but it's only open two days a week anyway, so it's kind of a special trip.

 

Study cafes - Ithaca has plenty of independent cafes but nearly all are small and don't feature much workspace, unfortunately (they're really more like coffee bars with a handful of tables). That said, if you manage to snag a table you can get work done at nearly all of them. Many people I know who like working at cafes swear by The Shop, which is downtown and sells Gimme Coffee (one of the highest ranked coffees in the country that happens to be locally based) but has slightly more space to sit than Gimme's own two cafes in town.

 

There's a cafe specializing in mate downtown on the Commons which has an amazing interior that feels somewhat like a rainforest. It's also run by a somewhat creepy cult and plays annoying elvish pipe music all the time; the place is also closed on Saturdays for the cult's day of rest, which can make it inconvenient. That said, it has maybe the most space to spread out with a coffee of anywhere in town.

 

Cycling - what ohgoodness said; the hill is something you have to consider. I see people struggling up it on bikes, but if you don't want to do this constantly, I would really consider what you want to be able to bike to most often and plan around that. Other than the hills, it seems like it would be fairly easy to bike all over here. There are not many large or heavily trafficked roads at all. 

[How important is a school's reputation for an MA program?]

Go to that school. Reputation for an MA program isn't very important. PhD is a different story

 

This is conventional wisdom around here and generally speaking it seems to be true (just look at bios of recently graduated PhDs or current grad students to see the array of random MAs they've done). That said, there are some dud MA programs compared to others, and I've known people who have been told by faculty at those MAs that they were better off going somewhere with better feeder potential.

[Cornell 2014]

Don't know about every department, but in history, we get an extra $5k for each summer, too (the stipend rates quoted in the link above are for the academic year --so September through May -- only) so the amount Cornell gives me is effectively over $28k. And that doesn't include opportunities for other grant funding both internal and external to the university.

 

I could probably live on less here, though. Not only are the prices dirt cheap in Ithaca, certain costs like transportation are radically subsidized -- Cornell students ride Ithaca buses for free their whole first year, after which a year's worth of bus rides only costs $200. And the annual membership fee for Ithaca Carshare, the local version of Zipcar, is paid by Cornell on behalf of its students as well.

[Ithaca, NY]

I went to Cornell for undergrad and I can absolutely recommend the Lansing West apartments. I lived there for a year and it was great:

 

http://www.solomonorg.com/Lansing-West-Apartments

 

 

I would absolutely never live out there without a car. The bus service is nowhere near as frequent as in Ithaca proper, and getting to many parts of town (e.g. to the all-important Wegmans) would require transfers as well. And even if you had a car, you'd still be dependent on less-than-frequent bus service to campus, since, as I've mentioned before, parking on campus is very limited/expensive (and parking off campus to be on campus can be impracticably distant).

 

Of course, everything depends on who you are. If you want a very nice apartment for little money and don't care about the fact that you're going to have to be very careful about making sure to catch one of the few buses to campus and home on time every day, these suburban apartment complexes can make sense. They also make more sense if you absolutely plan to have a car anyway. And if you don't plan to have much of a social life with fellow grads, who will inevitably cluster in Fall Creek/downtown, able to walk home from one another's apartments or bars.

 

Depending on where you are, these complexes might feel like they have more access to nature, but most don't. The one linked above is in the midst of some of Ithaca's worst suburban sprawl. If you're going to deal with the problems of living in Ithaca suburbia but at least want to be in a more scenic part of the area, I'd recommend Cayuga Heights.

[Ithaca, NY]

Fair enough, to each his/her own! I liked developing my calf muscles, but arriving all sweaty to class in the summers was never fun, and during winter, well, steep slopes and ice haven't been mixing well, in my mind. I've noticed somewhere between 25-50% of people do prefer the walk, though.

[Ithaca, NY]

Those streets on the hill (Buffalo, Seneca, etc.) can be nice, and they're isolated from noise. The only problem is that there's not really any transportation to speak of on this part of the hill...so you wind up having to walk up or down constantly to get either downtown or Cornell (and conversely, back down/up). Of course, you're only dealing with part of the hill at any one time, but that hill is nasty. It's probably the number one reason the buses are so popular (campus would be an easy walk from downtown/Fall Creek without the vertical distance the hill involves).

[Ithaca, NY]

Thank you to both of you! 

 

 

Thanks for bringing up the noise problem of the Commons. I only know Collegetown is a little annoying on this side and thought the Commons would be a better place.. Maybe not? I'm not a quite social person but I do appreciate convenient bus transportation and being close to the campus. So I probably will look for places similar to the ideal place in your mind.

 

 

 

I've heard all these about Fall Creek. Seems to be a grad-gathering, nice and quiet place. But I couldn't find many apartments complexes run by bigger companies, nor enough comments online to help me evaluate the condition/landlord (very important part)/neighborhood, etc. Do you know any reliable landlords/companies that rent apartments in this area? I'm looking for 1 or 2 bedrooms apartment for a couple. A little more privacy would be better. And I hope the renting would be a little lower than that of, say, Fairview. (How about Fairview anyway? Seems to be liked by some and hated by some others )

 

Thanks!

 

1. The noise problem on the Commons is annoying but only if you're directly on the Commons itself or one of the busier parts of the directly-adjacent commercial streets (like Aurora or Cayuga or the non-pedestrianized parts of State/MLK St). Even a block away it's much better. This isn't the case in Collegetown, because residential houses throughout that neighborhood are packed with undergrad students who hold house parties that spill onto porches and the street. Only really grad students and non-students live in downtown Ithaca, and the noisy people are typically Ithaca College students who are only there for the bars on the busier streets before they trudge back up their hill at the end of the night. 

 

2. You're not really going to find many big management companies running apartment complexes in Fall Creek; getting a place there usually involves negotiating with some smalltime landlord who may even live in the same house and will interrogate you about things like your politics or people in your department who have long since moved on from Cornell since the last time she went to some colloquium talk there in 1973. That said, the occasional house is run by a bigger company; maybe try looking at CSP Property Management's listings -- with a map handy. The boundaries between downtown and Fall Creek can be blurry, so some very Fall-Creek-y places are sometimes labeled as downtown buildings on these real estate websites. 

[Fall 2014 Applicants]

FYI: Cornell had a faculty meeting to discuss admissions this afternoon (I told you snow doesn't stop anything from happening here) so I would expect results soon. 

[Asking the uncomfortable questions (decision-making)]

On the funding issue, you don't even necessarily have to ask current grad students - you could find some of their CVs online and get a sense of what kind of funding they've been able to get, both internally and externally (in addition to lists of current grad students/placements on department websites, the AHA has a directory of all history PhDs by school that makes this easy). It's still a legitimate question for anyone, though, and I brought it up during my admitted students' weekend.

 

As for careers outside academia, that's trickier. Most academics are aware of what the job market's like and are sympathetic. I've found that, if I haven't brought up alternatives or Plan Bs, they have -- almost all of them, in fact. I'm not sure how those who didn't would have reacted if I had raised the subject, though. Your best bet here may also be googling former grad students until a faculty member broaches the subject him or herself. 

[Fall 2014 Applicants]

I was told that for Chicago it's about the same as Princeton - there are less than 10 people on the wait list, but they have only dipped into it in three of the last five years, and it's unranked, so your only chance is if somebody in the same specialty area drops out (totally out of your control). I'm not going to hold my breath on that one either ...

 

It's worth noting that there are actually multiple tracks for people who are neither accepted or rejected by Chicago - there's a straightforward, official waitlist; automatic admission to their Masters program in the humanities (which may or may not include an offer of partial funding, the amount of which has varied substantially among applicants), and what I think may be an unofficial waitlist of some kind...I was rejected very late in the season last year, after everyone had already received all their other Chicago results, which made me think such a list existed, although who knows -- they may have just misplaced my file.

[Fall 2014 Applicants]

Thank you czesc and thedig for the pep talk re. the PhD -- I do need it. This round (my second) isn't over yet, and I remain hopeful if not optimistic. If I bust out I do think I'm most likely going to start with the JD (the goal was always joint) and consider another shot at the PhD as I pursue it. There's no doubt law's easier to get in, not least because you usually have to pay, but full funding offers do exist. They're incredibly competitive but I've at least made it to the "please interview/write an essay/whatever to compete" stage which is further than I've made it with the PhD applications so far!

 

I would be careful here. My impression is that there are still some annoying profs who insist on not admitting people who are "pure" historians in some departments, and beyond these people law students may sometimes face the impression they're most interested in legal history, which could make you less of a "fit" at some schools than you would have been otherwise. All of which means that if you start the JD, PhD reapplications might be more difficult. 

 

On the other hand, although you'd have very limited time to do so during your 1L year, you could try engaging with your law school university's history department and/or legal historians at your law school in a way that might enhance your application. And at least at some universities (though by no means at all), current JD students will have a leg up in PhD admissions in that university's other departments.

 

So you'll have to weigh these things, and what you wind up doing may depend on the availability of other options (outside the law school that you would otherwise attend) to enhance your PhD app. The good news is that, unlike PhD programs, an accepted JD offer can be deferred for a year or sometimes even two. You might want to consider using this to your advantage. 

[Fall 2014 Applicants]

 

As someone posted a Princeton waitlist on the result board I'm going to repeat something I've said before.

 

The likelihood that Princeton will dip into their wait list is something on the order of a Brazillian medaling in cross country skiing.  Not impossible as Brazillian cross country skiers exist... but also very very unlikely.  Professors have openly told current grad students that they view the waitlist as a means of encouraging the applicant, saying that your project is good, but that is it.  For your own sanity treat it as a rejection.

 

^ And as a Princeton waitlistee last year, I'd just add that they don't hand those results out to a ton of people; there were only five people on that list in 2013. So basically, yeah, feel good about yourself...but don't get your hopes up about going to Princeton.

[Cornell 2014]

The thing you have to realize is that Cornell's campus is huge. And while many of the academic buildings are in the southwestern portion closest to central Ithaca, the rest of the campus spreads far to the east and north. So there are parts of campus that are actually more isolated from the academic buildings where you'll spend most of your time working than parts of Ithaca that are off-campus. You also have to factor in transportation. Buses from parts of Ithaca are more frequent than those that run to parts of the campus where grad student housing is located. And given the distances involved and the ferocity of winters in Ithaca, it's often more practicable to take a bus than to walk.

 

If you do decide to live off campus but don't want to be alone, you can always search for shared accommodations or a room in a house filled with other students on Craigslist. There are plenty of those setups in Ithaca.