Grad School/Interning with a family

[Nico Corr]

I applied to two schools for the Fall of 2018 application period and got accepted by one program, still waiting to hear back from the other. What financial aid I will be offered will determine whether I take my offers (or attend grad school at all). My biggest concerns with grad school are my particular financial responsibilities and whether they are compatible with going to grad school. I live with my girlfriend and our daughter in a fairly expensive area. I have a full-time job with benefits (that's not related to my desired field) that helps pay rent, utilities, cell phone and what undergrad bills I have. I am actively looking for a position related to my desired field (international relations) but it's hard without a grad degree.

I realize I'm going to have to leave my current job at some point in order to pursue at least temporary jobs within my desired field/internships, but I am not sure how I can balance this out and maintain at least some semblance of normality for my family. Moving to a cheaper area is not an option. Moving in with 3-5 other roommates is not an option for me. Eating Ramen every night is not an option. Doing unpaid internships isn't an option for me either I don't think. Finances are really the only thing that make me think twice about pursuing a degree. Has anyone else faced similar difficulties while obtaining their Masters? How did you do it?

[16381776]

Nico,

 

Been meaning to respond to your posts, but been on vacation. I can't speak to attending grad school with a family since I do not have one. I think the bigger question you need to ask yourself is why grad school and what do you want out of it. Sounds simple but it requires a lot of soul searching. You say you want to work in foreign policy, but that is a huge field. narrow it down and really think about where you want to be in 5 years from now. It is like people saying they want to work in intelligence or security or public policy. Huge fields with different career paths and outcomes.

As far as living standards, it is going to suck since you have a family. Something is going to give and it may not be pretty. There will have to be sacrifice. I went to grad school with bills and I had to cut out social life and eat PBJs for a year to save money. I did a paid internship and was very lucky that it lead to a full time job in the field I wanted.

Now for the veteran thing. It does not make a difference. I am a veteran and was unemployed 9 months when I graduated from undergrad. I majored in economics and poli sci and had the full clearance thing plus 10 years of military experience. Yet no job after undergrad. The same can happen and does happen to veterans who attend grad school thinking that all those experiences translate into tangible job skills. Guess what it does always work that way. One of my classmates graduated with a dual degree JD and MPA and still cannot get a job. Yet I am working with a lady straight from undergrad with no military experience and no clearance. She landed a govt position. One of my buddies has 10+ years military intel experience and can not get a govt job. Luck of the draw.

I read that you applied to two graduate programs. Both are very expensive and may not offer sufficient aid. Again, ask yourself what you want to do after graduate school. I know of people who graduate from the top ten schools but carried lots of debt. They now work for the government. The government does not care where you went to school or what you studied. All they want to see is that you have a degree. any type of degree. This includes intel. I work with people who have a BA in theology, BA in English, MA in History, MA in Human Resources, MA in Fine Arts. The govt did not care where they went to school or what they studied. It has not influence on promotion. All that is based on what you have accomplished, not where you went to school.

This brings me to another point about these degrees, MA IR, MA IA, MA Security Studies, etc. The programs do not prepare you or train you for a job in the security or foreign policy fields. None of them will teach you how to write an IIR or conduct a interview for someone applying for a visa or teach you how to plan for joint operations. The only place to receive such training is through the military war colleges, NIU, or military schools. No one who I work with uses IR theory to analyze anything. Mostly everything was learned on the job and the government paid for training.

You mention joining the national guard or reserve. If you are serious about working in the intel field or security, then yes you should do it to increase your chances and network. Networking is very important when it comes to contracting jobs. Contractors do not want to pay for training. They expect their workers to be trained and ready to work on day one. The guard and reserve can give you a leg up if you decide to go down the MI field. Plus there are education benefits too. Nothing wrong with joining for those reasons. Lots of people do it. Joining the military is not guaranteed to get you a civilian or government job. There are plenty of unemployed and underemployed vets to illustrate this. If you are really serious about this option, then PM me.

There are other opportunities that can pay for grad school. Robertson Fellowship and Rangel come to mind, but they are competitive. Only you can answer if now is the time to attend grad school.

 

[Nico Corr]

11 hours ago, 16381776 said:

Nico,

 

Been meaning to respond to your posts, but been on vacation. I can't speak to attending grad school with a family since I do not have one. I think the bigger question you need to ask yourself is why grad school and what do you want out of it. Sounds simple but it requires a lot of soul searching. You say you want to work in foreign policy, but that is a huge field. narrow it down and really think about where you want to be in 5 years from now. It is like people saying they want to work in intelligence or security or public policy. Huge fields with different career paths and outcomes.

As far as living standards, it is going to suck since you have a family. Something is going to give and it may not be pretty. There will have to be sacrifice. I went to grad school with bills and I had to cut out social life and eat PBJs for a year to save money. I did a paid internship and was very lucky that it lead to a full time job in the field I wanted.

Now for the veteran thing. It does not make a difference. I am a veteran and was unemployed 9 months when I graduated from undergrad. I majored in economics and poli sci and had the full clearance thing plus 10 years of military experience. Yet no job after undergrad. The same can happen and does happen to veterans who attend grad school thinking that all those experiences translate into tangible job skills. Guess what it does always work that way. One of my classmates graduated with a dual degree JD and MPA and still cannot get a job. Yet I am working with a lady straight from undergrad with no military experience and no clearance. She landed a govt position. One of my buddies has 10+ years military intel experience and can not get a govt job. Luck of the draw.

I read that you applied to two graduate programs. Both are very expensive and may not offer sufficient aid. Again, ask yourself what you want to do after graduate school. I know of people who graduate from the top ten schools but carried lots of debt. They now work for the government. The government does not care where you went to school or what you studied. All they want to see is that you have a degree. any type of degree. This includes intel. I work with people who have a BA in theology, BA in English, MA in History, MA in Human Resources, MA in Fine Arts. The govt did not care where they went to school or what they studied. It has not influence on promotion. All that is based on what you have accomplished, not where you went to school.

This brings me to another point about these degrees, MA IR, MA IA, MA Security Studies, etc. The programs do not prepare you or train you for a job in the security or foreign policy fields. None of them will teach you how to write an IIR or conduct a interview for someone applying for a visa or teach you how to plan for joint operations. The only place to receive such training is through the military war colleges, NIU, or military schools. No one who I work with uses IR theory to analyze anything. Mostly everything was learned on the job and the government paid for training.

You mention joining the national guard or reserve. If you are serious about working in the intel field or security, then yes you should do it to increase your chances and network. Networking is very important when it comes to contracting jobs. Contractors do not want to pay for training. They expect their workers to be trained and ready to work on day one. The guard and reserve can give you a leg up if you decide to go down the MI field. Plus there are education benefits too. Nothing wrong with joining for those reasons. Lots of people do it. Joining the military is not guaranteed to get you a civilian or government job. There are plenty of unemployed and underemployed vets to illustrate this. If you are really serious about this option, then PM me.

There are other opportunities that can pay for grad school. Robertson Fellowship and Rangel come to mind, but they are competitive. Only you can answer if now is the time to attend grad school.

 

Thanks for your reply 16381776. I'd like to eventually obtain a career in the intelligence community or as a foreign service officer with the State Department upon graduation. I realize competition for these sorts of positions is ferocious, but I have no other "in" to get one of these positions. My "plan B" is to get a job in the Private Sector or worse case get a job in local government until I can somehow get my foot in the door. 

My biggest concern more than anything as I mentioned maintaining a certain standard of living for my family which I am unwilling to compromise on. I'll get multiple part times job if need be to accomplish this. Many of these fellowships I only learned about fairly recently and have missed deadlines for their applications. 

 

[OldMan77]

Hi Nico,

I hope you have heard good things from your schools both on admissions and financial aid.  I was in a similar position of wanting to pivot to an IR career after being established in a solely domestic industry, and trying to figure out how to do it with a family.

While I strongly encourage you to pursue another degree to open up the new career paths, I regret to tell you sacrifices will almost certainly need to be made.  These programs are expensive (as you obviously know), and more time consuming than you might anticipate.  My classmates who kept their jobs either had to quit or significantly scale back their work commitments as the first semester progressed.  I came in ready to treat grad school like a 10-hour per day job, and quickly learned that was not enough time to complete the reading and accompanying work.

Like you, I couldn't have my family living in a hovel eating bread and water every meal, so we needed to figure out financing.  The only solution we arrived at was to delay and save.  Instead of starting in 2015 as I would have liked, we pushed it back to 2017 and saved like crazy to soften the blow.  Since we knew we were going to move (there are no decent programs in my home area), we prepared the kids for a smaller living space.  We also incorporated cheaper food like pasta and bean soup into our routine so the kids started liking them, and our grocery bill plummeted.  It's not filet, but it isn't Ramen either.  We ate out less, bought cheaper clothes, took cheaper vacations or skipped them entirely, etc...just overall minimized expenses.  And it sucked.  Often, a lot.  But now I'm in school pursuing my dream and my family is perfectly comfortable.  And next year, I'll be working again and we can return to our previous standard of living.

Obviously, everyone's situation is different, and I know what worked for me won't work for everyone, and vice versa.  However, when considering whether to sacrifice to pursue our goals, my wife and I realized that, although we were established in our careers and a regular paycheck is a nice security blanket, we still have over 25 years of working left.  Wouldn't we rather have a rough year or two followed by 25-30 years of a satisfying career instead of 27-32 years of a mildly comfortable life?  And since we have so much of a work life remaining, does it make much of a difference if we start one year vs. a year or two later?

So while I'm sorry to deliver some bad news, I hope this was at least somewhat helpful.  Best of luck!