Good publications but BAD defense/thesis

[Aristoddler1]

I’m at the end of my PhD, and I’m trying to figure out what happened/what matters. I’m in molecular bio. I ended up working in one of those labs where the PI has a reputation for being an extreme combination of the following: screaming toddler/sadist-terrorist/helicopter parent/abusive slave owner. The kind of lab where other grad students always ask you if you are ok and make Ooooooh noises when you identify yourself as a member of said lab. I’m not going to get into how I ended up in said lab (different story). Anyway, I’m at the end of my PhD. I defended and my thesis is approved. However I’m very conflicted right now. I did a ridiculous amount of good work judging by the number of publications I got. I have 2 first author research papers, both in leading journals (one impact factor 22 and the other is 8), and an invited review at a journal with an impact factor of 5. For my corner of molecular bio, that’s pretty high. I also got a postdoc lined up with a super star pi in the field who has a ton of money and likes me. I actually had many offers for postdoc jobs (3 interviews all with offers). I should be “happy”, yet this whole thing feels like a failure. Here’s why: My defense presentation to the department looked great but the closed exam once everyone left was BAD. I got in trouble for not having a proper intro and discussion in my thesis. My committee didn’t want to hear or believe the truth: my advisor gave me exactly 3 days to write my entire thesis... this is because he had me doing experiments all along. Both before my defense and after my defense. Also, while I have great papers and know the work I did really well, I don’t really have a good grasp of the literature because my advisor demanded that we do bench work 16hrs days every day. If you sat at your desk too long, he would come and ask you why you weren’t at the bench doing stuff. Finally I was sleep deprived from “writing” a thesis in 3 days... 200 page document in 3 days, as if it was possible. So I end up passing my exam but getting told I barely passed and maybe I shouldn’t have passed after all. My committee now thinks I’m stupid and my advisor thinks I’m a disaster. Nobody cares that it’s impossible to write a thesis in 3 days (I’m not exaggerating my labmate got the same amount of time for hers). Nobody understands that after 6 yrs of being worked to death under the constant threat of “having my career ended” by the Prof that you know maybe I’m just too brain dead to function like a normal human being. I know my work well but I don’t know the literature well. All my research chapters in my thesis (sandwich thesis) are really really good (because I actually had time to write those papers) but my intro and discussion of the actual thesis documents are horrible and weak. So now at the end of my PhD I have amazing papers, a top postdoc lined up, good reputation with everyone who saw my public defense talk BUT my committee who did the private part of the exam and my advisor think I’m a total idiot and a disaster. I’m just not sure what to make of this. Is this a good PhD? Is this a bad PhD? I just don’t know what to think. I’m just full of doubt now. I know I did good work, but I did it in an environment that ruined my ability to function as a normal human being, where working until you made yourself sick was the norm. A place where you kill yourself to do good work but you are so brain dead at the end that you can’t function. Am I a fraud? I just want to hear some perspectives because I’m about to start at my new postdoc and I don’t know whether to laugh or cry. 

[maxhgns]

The only thing about your PhD that matters is that it's done and was approved. Virtually nobody will bother to look at it again, especially when they could just go and read the chapters you've published instead. You will need letters from your supervisor (and maybe your external), but (1) if they're going to be negative, it sounds like they would have been negative anyway, (2) they're more likely to talk about the quality of your work and the importance of your results than your defense (besides: it looks awful for them if they tell the world you suck and shouldn't have passed, but they passed you anyway), and (3) you'll have the postdoc PI letter too, and (ideally) letters from people not affiliated to you and your success. So: forget about it. It's over.

 

That said, FWIW I don't really understand this part:

13 hours ago, Aristoddler1 said:

My committee didn’t want to hear or believe the truth: my advisor gave me exactly 3 days to write my entire thesis... this is because he had me doing experiments all along. Both before my defense and after my defense. 

Why did you wait until the very end of the process before writing things up? It seems to me--and bear in mind that I obviously don't know the details of your situation!--this is all work that you could have done beforehand (and you did, for at least some chapters), without your advisor's say-so. He'd have had to look it over before submission, of course, but I don't see why it was necessary to wait until three days before the defense (how can you even defend without submitting? Different university/discipline and process, I guess).

(Also: it can't have been literally impossible, since you did it! It just wasn't pleasant or desirable.)

 

EDIT: Also, what about corrections? Normally, after you defend, there's a period of a few months before you have to submit your final draft. Can't you use that time to improve the parts that seem rushed? I'd expect that if they expressed such serious reservations about your writing, they'd have given you a pass with corrections anyway...

Edited November 20, 2018 by maxhgns

[Hope.for.the.best]

On 11/20/2018 at 8:35 PM, Aristoddler1 said:

Is this a good PhD? Is this a bad PhD? I just don’t know what to think. I’m just full of doubt now. I know I did good work, but I did it in an environment that ruined my ability to function as a normal human being, where working until you made yourself sick was the norm. A place where you kill yourself to do good work but you are so brain dead at the end that you can’t function. Am I a fraud? I just want to hear some perspectives because I’m about to start at my new postdoc and I don’t know whether to laugh or cry. 

You are not alone! I finished my PhD not long ago and I was in a similar situation, especially the toxic advisor bit. If you read my other posts, then you would have known that I got a lot of anxiety from two demanding advisors, which I named as *Andy and *Cecilia. They didn't go to that extreme to get me worked for 16 hours every day, but they got me to do so many experiments (some even irrelevant to my project) that I had to spend my whole Christmas holiday to write the literature review of my thesis! They even threatened to not let me submit my thesis unless I finished a big experiment, which turned out to be technically impossible to do. My defense went very well though and I passed with minor corrections, but they were reluctant to approve my corrections and let me confer. I was fortunate enough to have another advisor (now my boss), who has been extremely supportive and navigated me through this situation. Like you, my current boss is a super star pi in the field who has a ton of money and likes me.

Anyway, back to your questions, I would say your PhD is excellent, because you have got high impact papers published from your work. An impact factor of 22 is very high in science. The fact that you are offered multiple postdoctoral positions demonstrates that you have a strong research profile. Publication record is what matters in any academic jobs. As said above, the most important thing is to have your PhD approved (which you have). Whether you barely passed or passed with flying colours does not matter. 

If I were you, I would be happy that I can finally say goodbye to such a toxic advisor, and embrace the opportunity to work with a renowned researcher in your field. It did take me a while to let go of the mishap in PhD. Now I am enjoying my life as a postdoc with a great boss. I am pretty sure you will too!