Dual Degree Advice

[kjgruber47]

In an attempt to not be boxed in by the academic job market, I will likely be obtaining a dual degree (JD/MPA). My lifelong goal has been to teach; however, the horror stories I hear about the academia job market have made me consider a dual degree. Further, I am also interested in administrative law. I'm looking for advice on the programs I am considering and general advice on pursuing a dual degree.

Programs:

University at Buffalo -- Cheap. Quality program, however, the program isn't exactly what I am looking for. Close to home.

Syracuse -- Top tier program. The exact program I am looking for. Really expensive. 3 hours from home. Not a great place to live.

Albany -- Cheap. Top tier public affairs program but underwhelming law school. The exact program I am looking for. A lot of internship and job opportunities.

GWU -- Favorite program. Really expensive. Great place to live. Most prestigious. Far from home.

If I am already obtaining a dual degree, does school matter? I eventually plan to obtain a Ph.D. too.

Will I be able to work while pursuing two degrees? full time? part-time?

Social life?

My family is well off, so money isn't my main concern. I would like to work while in school but it is not a requirement.

I'll take any advice. This decision is stressful. Further, there is not a lot of information about pursuing a dual degree. I tried to keep this brief. I would love to hear your experiences. 

[GradSchoolGrad]

6 hours ago, kjgruber47 said:

In an attempt to not be boxed in by the academic job market, I will likely be obtaining a dual degree (JD/MPA). My lifelong goal has been to teach; however, the horror stories I hear about the academia job market have made me consider a dual degree. Further, I am also interested in administrative law. I'm looking for advice on the programs I am considering and general advice on pursuing a dual degree.

Programs:

University at Buffalo -- Cheap. Quality program, however, the program isn't exactly what I am looking for. Close to home.

Syracuse -- Top tier program. The exact program I am looking for. Really expensive. 3 hours from home. Not a great place to live.

Albany -- Cheap. Top tier public affairs program but underwhelming law school. The exact program I am looking for. A lot of internship and job opportunities.

GWU -- Favorite program. Really expensive. Great place to live. Most prestigious. Far from home.

If I am already obtaining a dual degree, does school matter? I eventually plan to obtain a Ph.D. too.

Will I be able to work while pursuing two degrees? full time? part-time?

Social life?

My family is well off, so money isn't my main concern. I would like to work while in school but it is not a requirement.

I'll take any advice. This decision is stressful. Further, there is not a lot of information about pursuing a dual degree. I tried to keep this brief. I would love to hear your experiences. 

So I will answer this one at a time. 

1. Where you should go (since you say money isn't a main concern) - GWU - hands down. You will get the most career options from GW Law school. Reality check is that the JD will be your meal ticket and your MPA might give you some minor credibility in certain niche factors.

2. Yes. You will be able to work during your MPA phase (potentially). However, you should focus on that for experience and not for pay. If you manage to make more than $30 an hour then you will have struck Gold. I HIGHLY discourage you from working during the Law School phase. No matter where you go for your career, (even Legal Aid), they will ask you for your class rank and grades.

3. You might even get a scholarship for the MPA portion of your education. That is something to consider.

4. You know you can teach without getting a PhD. In fact, I recommend that you teach as a J.D. as an adjunct Professor (as in a expert in the field adjunct not of those minimum wage adjuncts) or teach Law School down the line. It makes no since to get a J.D. and then a PhD. What you learn in a J.D. doesn't exactly have good transferability to PhD.

5. Also, I don't know what your grades and/or LSAT/GRE are, but you really are limiting yourself by your options. 

I would consider Penn and NYU. Also, I would recommend you think about JD / MPP programs. MPP and MPA are somewhat different degrees but honestly they compete for the same jobs. 

[kjgruber47]

On 7/13/2020 at 10:22 PM, GradSchoolGrad said:

So I will answer this one at a time. 

1. Where you should go (since you say money isn't a main concern) - GWU - hands down. You will get the most career options from GW Law school. Reality check is that the JD will be your meal ticket and your MPA might give you some minor credibility in certain niche factors.

2. Yes. You will be able to work during your MPA phase (potentially). However, you should focus on that for experience and not for pay. If you manage to make more than $30 an hour then you will have struck Gold. I HIGHLY discourage you from working during the Law School phase. No matter where you go for your career, (even Legal Aid), they will ask you for your class rank and grades.

3. You might even get a scholarship for the MPA portion of your education. That is something to consider.

4. You know you can teach without getting a PhD. In fact, I recommend that you teach as a J.D. as an adjunct Professor (as in a expert in the field adjunct not of those minimum wage adjuncts) or teach Law School down the line. It makes no since to get a J.D. and then a PhD. What you learn in a J.D. doesn't exactly have good transferability to PhD.

5. Also, I don't know what your grades and/or LSAT/GRE are, but you really are limiting yourself by your options. 

I would consider Penn and NYU. Also, I would recommend you think about JD / MPP programs. MPP and MPA are somewhat different degrees but honestly they compete for the same jobs. 

Thank you. I will definitely consider obtaining an MPP over an MPA. An MPP probably has more marketability too. I tried to limit my options because I have to apply to both programs for each school; however, there is other schools and routes I am considering. My LSAT and GRE scores are well above average. My GPA worries me though. I had a 1.5 after my sophomore year because I dropped out without dropping classes. Since I have returned, I have maintained a 4.0 and will graduate with around a 3.7.I'm hoping to use that experience to my advantage. However, I know that it will scare away a lot of schools.  I expect top tier schools to reject me based solely on my GPA, which is why I am applying to schools like Buffalo and Albany. Also, my dad is also a well-respected lawyer and has connections in Buffalo and Albany. Thank you for the advice. I have a lot to consider. 

[GradSchoolGrad]

17 minutes ago, kjgruber47 said:

Thank you. I will definitely consider obtaining an MPP over an MPA. An MPP probably has more marketability too. I tried to limit my options because I have to apply to both programs for each school; however, there is other schools and routes I am considering. My LSAT and GRE scores are well above average. My GPA worries me though. I had a 1.5 after my sophomore year because I dropped out without dropping classes. Since I have returned, I have maintained a 4.0 and will graduate with around a 3.7.I'm hoping to use that experience to my advantage. However, I know that it will scare away a lot of schools.  I expect top tier schools to reject me based solely on my GPA, which is why I am applying to schools like Buffalo and Albany. Also, my dad is also a well-respected lawyer and has connections in Buffalo and Albany. Thank you for the advice. I have a lot to consider. 

Honestly, final GPA is all that matters in the GPA realm. They give you room to justify any academic shortcomings you may have had on most applications. If you consider JD/MPP, your options improve significantly. I recommend that you apply to at least 2 T14 law schools. 

[kjgruber47]

25 minutes ago, GradSchoolGrad said:

Honestly, final GPA is all that matters in the GPA realm. They give you room to justify any academic shortcomings you may have had on most applications. If you consider JD/MPP, your options improve significantly. I recommend that you apply to at least 2 T14 law schools. 

Did you enjoy Georgetown? I have a minor in statistics and enjoy quantitative research. Further, I have a friend applying to their MPP program. I have debated GWU vs Georgetown. 

[GradSchoolGrad]

43 minutes ago, kjgruber47 said:

Did you enjoy Georgetown? I have a minor in statistics and enjoy quantitative research. Further, I have a friend applying to their MPP program. I have debated GWU vs Georgetown. 

Unless you want to focus your life on data analysis, work in Capital Hill, or do think tank stuff, I would not apply to Georgetown's MPP program. I also recommend that your friend post in this forum to ask about Georgetown MPP, so that she has better idea of what she is getting herself into.

GWU might not have as much brand recognition + is a less quantitative program, but assuming COVID-19 will have subsided by the time you start school, you have a lot more flexibility on how to execute your career goals.

Edited July 16, 2020 by GradSchoolGrad

[GradSchoolGrad]

2 other things to think about.

1. If you really want to be in DC, you can do a concurrent degree. So Harvard MPP and Georgetown Law - https://www.hks.harvard.edu/educational-programs/masters-programs/joint-concurrent-degrees/concurrent-degrees

2. You could to do JD/PHD straight off the bat and forget the MPP.