High Ambitions

[JLM107]

Hey Everyone,

I'm getting an early start on my grad school prep, and wondering if anyone could help me here. I'm almost a year into my undergrad with a 3.8 GPA. My main research interests are Sociology of Culture and Urban Sociology,with some interest also in Sociology of Education.

I have alot of places I want to apply. I'll group them:

Ivy's: Princeton, Harvard

Safeties: Temple, Rutgers New Brunswick

Everywhere else(ranked in order of preference):U Wisconsin Madison, NYU, U Chicago, U Virginia

I plan to get ahead start on undergrad research, and I've already developed relationships with someof the professors in my department (good LORs). Not sure what to say about GRE's, as I'll be under the new scoring system that starts this fall, but I plan to score the equivalent of 600 or above on all sections with adequate preparation.

Where I stand right now: Won't kill me if I don't get into the Ivy's, but I'd really like to go to one of my non-safety, non-Ivy schools. If I keep my GPA between 3.7 and 3.8, and achieve these GREambitions,do I stand a fair chance?

Thanks,

JLM

[wtncffts]

Wait, are you saying you're just finishing your first year of undergrad? While I guess it's a good thing that you have such ambitions (though I'm skeptical), it's in any case way too early to be thinking about grad school, especially in such particularity. I'm almost certain that your interests will change, as will you as a person. You really don't need to be making lists of schools now, and you'll be taking the GRE, what, three years from now? Of course it's good to be prepared but there is such a thing as over-preparation.

[JLM107]

Wait, are you saying you're just finishing your first year of undergrad? While I guess it's a good thing that you have such ambitions (though I'm skeptical), it's in any case way too early to be thinking about grad school, especially in such particularity. I'm almost certain that your interests will change, as will you as a person. You really don't need to be making lists of schools now, and you'll be taking the GRE, what, three years from now? Of course it's good to be prepared but there is such a thing as over-preparation.

Fair enough. In my defense, I do know at least that I want to go into Sociology post-baccalaureate. I've read various materialsand also had a great intro course to develop my interests. I'll be taking the GRE at least twice before Fall '13.

[joops]

You are making a huge mistake in thinking that Rutgers is a safety school. Guess what their acceptance rate is to their sociology PhD program.

Less than ten percent.

Cast your net widely.

[Roll Right]

Yeah, Rutgers has a very strict acceptance policy. Look into schools not based on prestige, but based on how well you fit, etc. Did you know that NC State is harder to get into than Duke? Be careful about picking safety schools. They may not be so safe.

[jamart24]

I don't even know if I would use the term "Safety School" anymore for graduate school. Every program is looking for someone different and even somewhat lower-tier programs will reject students with excellent qualifications. It's great that you want to go to graduate school, but if you're only a year into undergrad, your opinion might change on where to apply. I think it's way too early to be getting advice on your application profile right now. Your GPA could change dramatically. Right now I would focus on the now and work hard in your courses, gain research experience, and study for the GRE in the coming years.

[direshark]

Only thing I can say is get involved with academic opportunities. You don't want to be caught realizing at the first quarter of your senior year that you don't have any research experience. But that's STILL like a junior year endeavor.

Make sure to keep an open mind about the college process. I will freely admit I shuffled majors quite a bit until I realized sociology drew me like a magnet, and even then, wasn't sure about grad school until this time last year (I was dead set on law school until then).

Oh, and I don't know how everyone else on this forum feels about double majoring - a lot of sociology undergrads double major simply because they can - but it doesn't seem to matter at all, from what I've gleaned from the process. Of course, if you double major in something like political science, and then decide you want a PhD in polisci, then that could matter, though not substantially.

Otherwise, get good grades and enjoy the college experience. It'll be time to get serious about the process around late junior year - I don't think you can really study for the GRE for three years, you'll be best off if you just make sure to read for recreation every once in awhile and keep the vocab updated.

[taiwanadian]

Hey Everyone,

I'm getting an early start on my grad school prep, and wondering if anyone could help me here. I'm almost a year into my undergrad with a 3.8 GPA. My main research interests are Sociology of Culture and Urban Sociology,with some interest also in Sociology of Education.

I have alot of places I want to apply. I'll group them:

Ivy's: Princeton, Harvard

Safeties: Temple, Rutgers New Brunswick

Everywhere else(ranked in order of preference):U Wisconsin Madison, NYU, U Chicago, U Virginia

I plan to get ahead start on undergrad research, and I've already developed relationships with someof the professors in my department (good LORs). Not sure what to say about GRE's, as I'll be under the new scoring system that starts this fall, but I plan to score the equivalent of 600 or above on all sections with adequate preparation.

Where I stand right now: Won't kill me if I don't get into the Ivy's, but I'd really like to go to one of my non-safety, non-Ivy schools. If I keep my GPA between 3.7 and 3.8, and achieve these GREambitions,do I stand a fair chance?

Thanks,

JLM

Hey JLM, I'll have to agree with everybody. And just a few words of advice.. I was dead set on psychology when I started my undergrad, and when I was a senior, I took a sociology course and it blew my mind. I fell off track after years of research experience, volunteer experience, and work experience in psychology.. my mind decides to change itself and become interested in sociology. With absolutely no experience to show for my newfound interest in sociology, i applied to a bunch of PhD programs for fall 2010 and got rejected across the board. My GPA was good, my LORs strong, my GRE decent, and i've gotten quite a bit of positive feedback about my SOP.. so what i'm trying to say is.. it's great to have a goal, and by all means, pursue it, but don't limit yourself. Give yourself a little room for potential change (and failure, in some instances). You really can't have a strict plan for the future, especially this early in the game. After my rejection, I moved back to Canada and now i'm starting the masters program in the fall (and applying for PhD either next fall or the year after) and I'm more clear than ever about how much i enjoy sociology and about the topics i want to pursue. It's something you really need to be flexible with, and I feel that's what the undergrad experience is supposed to provide you with.. an introduction to a number of fields so you can make an informed decision of what you really want to pursue.

Regardless, if you do end up pursuing sociology.. like one of the posters above said.. there really is no such thing as a safety school. Grad schools are highly selective by fit. Make sure your interests fit with the professors and don't go by school rankings.

Also.. remember, don't aim low. PhD is a huge commitment. My sister says it's like a marriage, you don't want to settle. You're going to spend at least 5 years of your life there, you don't want to end up going somewhere you're only okay with. Find somewhere you'll really enjoy with professors who can mentor you in your field of interest.

Either way, sorry for the ramble. Good luck

[hoobers]

The three best things you can study in undergrad to prepare yourself for academic research are:

(1) Statistics

(2) Computer science

(3) Other mathematics

This isn't to say that quantitative skills will necessarily be useful for your future career as a researcher: plenty of social scientists do purely qualitative research. However, quantitative skills are both more broadly useful than anything else you could spend your time learning, and also the most difficult to pick up on the spot if you haven't had the proper preparation. It's a shame that most soc BA programs don't require a year of stats and a year of computer programming. Soc undergrads would have a much easier time getting jobs out there in the world if they did.

[Doctor Jimmy]

I'll sort-of disagree with everyone. There is certainly nothing wrong with thinking you know what you want to do this early. Just keep an open mind and know that you may change your mind (I was a Marketing major... then a Pre-Med student... then a Pre-Law student... then a Psyc major... then a Soci major).

You can never really start getting involved with faculty research too early though. So go ahead and stat working with faculty on their research (faculty that do work in your interests). This will also absolutely be the best way to see if sociology as a career is what you want to do.

One quick point: Wisconsin, NYU, and Chicago will all be about as hard to get into as Princeton & Harvard. They are all extraordinarily competitive. And as mentioned earlier: Rutgers is deceptively hard to get into.

Hey Everyone,

I'm getting an early start on my grad school prep, and wondering if anyone could help me here. I'm almost a year into my undergrad with a 3.8 GPA. My main research interests are Sociology of Culture and Urban Sociology,with some interest also in Sociology of Education.

Thanks,

JLM

[jacib]

I would just say that I started thinking about grad school heavily by my sophomore year of college, and I think it left me well placed to apply later on. I already knew the scene decently well. That said... I had originally planned to apply in Religion and only two, three years out of college did I end up considering Sociology. But that said, graduate school was always in my mind and I familiarized myself with the processes of graduate school, the norms of the fields, and attended those conferences and lectures that I could. But seriously, just by knowing what gets published in ASJ/ASR you'll have an advantage over many of your fellow graduate students because you can couch whatever you want to say in that vocabulary. I'd say to best prepare for graduate schools, read journal articles for fun (I used to read "fun" journal drunk pretty often, because I actually enjoyed them. They're what I wanted to do after a party).

Realize what skills are expected of you. In Religion, this was primarily languages, so I am able conduct research in three languages in addition to English. This is definitely not that important now that I'm doing Sociology (in top Religion journals, articles will frequently have untranslated phrases and sentences in French and German because, hey, everyone speaks those languages, right?). If I were to do things differently in college, I would definitely have learned more statistics (as one of the posters above recommended). Extensive statistical knowledge is not required, but it is recommended. Basic statistics literacy is required, of course, even if you're studying something touchy-feely like Sociology of Religion and even if you want to

I think people on this board generally overemphasize undergraduate "research experience". If you write a senior thesis using generally the methods you plan to use in your PhD, that should be more than adequate. Most of my colleagues in graduate school do not have extensive research experience. I don't think anyone has publications in a sociological journal. Most people weren't even sociology majors. Research is great, do it if you can, it will make you look good probably, but it's not required at all. I think what's underemphasized here is that the creativity and brilliance of your ideas are actually important to a lot of schools (especially if you're doing qualitative work, but even if you're doing quantitative work--low hanging fruit has been picked off, how can you tease our what you want from existing data?). A creative idea "bridging" two fields will always get you bonus points (for example, if you research was about the health of prison inmate you'd be bridging criminology and medical sociology). My own work definitely is squarely between religion and the state.

My own personal advice is unless you want to be a doctor or a school teacher, never go to graduate directly after undergraduate in any discipline. Seriously, even though I've known for about seven years I wanted to go into academia, my first year here in graduate school would have been very difficult if I didn't know what my other options were. Get a job that might look decent/justifiable for graduate school (think tank, community center, policy advocacy group, teaching abroad, whatever), but I would seriously recommend taking time off between undergraduate and graduate school. Take at least a year off. Maybe three.