PhD poli sci chances

[Pennington]

I'm a Junior in college majoring in Political Science and minoring in Political Economy at a top 10 liberal arts college. My major gpa is a 3.4 and my overall gpa is a 3.1 I have taken 13 poli sci classes since my freshman year and half of them have been 300 level (senior level courses). I am primarily interested in Political Theory (Nietzsche and Plato) and IR theory related to state-building. I have done one fellowship and two internships related to my major. What schools should I look at given my gpa, major gpa, and my academic interests?

[Aunuwyn]

Not any in the top 30 since your GPA is too low.

[fouler657]

It really depends. What did you score on the GRE? Have you been to any conferences? How strong are your letters of recommendation going to be? Sometimes you can make up for a lower GPA with strengths in these areas.

[Zahar Berkut]

If for some reason you have reason to believe your GPA is holding you back later in the application process (it might not, depending, as mentioned above, on the other parts of your application), you can always do an M.A. (MAPPS might be particularly good for you with your theory/IR interests-- though I'm afraid you'll need a more coherent set of research interests than Plato/Nietzsche and state-building).

But yes, the low GPA will create some difficulties. I'm reluctant to give specific schools-- you'll need to do some research to find a decent fit-- but you'll have some trouble with even top 30 programs.

[foosh]

Not any in the top 30 since your GPA is too low.

I can't emphasize how wrong this post is. I had well below a 2.7 and got into two top-25 schools both with fellowships and guaranteed funding for 5 years. Your personal statements and GRE scores go a long way in compensating for a bad GPA.

Edited May 4, 2011 by foosh

[Aunuwyn]

I can't emphasize how wrong this post is. I had well below a 2.7 and got into two top-25 schools both with fellowships and guaranteed funding for 5 years. Your personal statements and GRE scores go a long way in compensating for a bad GPA.

You are an exception, not the rule. There must have been something else on your application that was very impressive, but at most of these places you wouldn't make the first cut. If the OP applied to every top 30 school they might get into 3. That is a terrible hit rate, and an expensive strategy. They should be realistic in their options and target mostly top 40 schools, and then try to transfer up later.

[GopherGrad]

You are an exception, not the rule. There must have been something else on your application that was very impressive, but at most of these places you wouldn't make the first cut. If the OP applied to every top 30 school they might get into 3. That is a terrible hit rate, and an expensive strategy. They should be realistic in their options and target mostly top 40 schools, and then try to transfer up later.

You wouldn't spend three thousand dollars to get into three T30 schools?

I would cut that check this fucking second.

Edited May 5, 2011 by GopherGrad

[Aunuwyn]

You wouldn't spend three thousand dollars to get into three T30 schools?

I would cut that check this fucking second.

No.

[GopherGrad]

That seems remarkably short-sighted.

Three grand really isn't much money especially considering what's on the line, how much you've already invested and how much more you'd plan to invest.

[Aunuwyn]

1. Being a marginal admit to one of these programs you probably wouldn't get funding, or at least not a full award. 2. It's unnecessary to waste more than 3k applying to each of the programs and instead focus on the back 5, since your chances of getting in the better ones would be astronomically low. 3. Not everyone has a substantial sum of money to throw into applications, I didn't. 4. You are not guaranteed that your investment will ever payoff in an academic job as the market is extremely tough.

[The Lorax]

I' with Aunuwyn on this one. That is a terribly expensive strategy. But look at the 20-40 range, with a couple for aspiration's sake in the top 20, and make EVERY OTHER PART of your package top notch. DOn't let anything else slip. Be passionate, and have laser beam like focus. Know exactly what you want to study, who you want to study under, present it clearly in your personal statement, and make the extra effort to contact your POI's BEFORE you even apply. You'll get in somewhere decent. Remember: If you go to a top 30 school but you never publish, you won't get hired. If you got to a top tier research institution with a mediocre rating and you publish like crazy...you'll get hired.

[GopherGrad]

1. Being a marginal admit to one of these programs you probably wouldn't get funding, or at least not a full award. 2. It's unnecessary to waste more than 3k applying to each of the programs and instead focus on the back 5, since your chances of getting in the better ones would be astronomically low. 3. Not everyone has a substantial sum of money to throw into applications, I didn't. 4. You are not guaranteed that your investment will ever payoff in an academic job as the market is extremely tough.

These are all fair points, but they mostly suggest you shouldn't bother majoring in political science in the first place.

This guy has dropped four years and untold thousands for the love of the game already, and hopes to forgo employment opportunity for another six for a shot at teaching. I guess the additional $2K in application fees really tips the scales, though.

Maybe I'm saying this because I'm old, but three thousand dollars for the chance to see where you stand in terms of chasing your dream is, in the long run, a pretty good deal and not even close to the largest risk you're likely to take.

Pennington,

You strategy should be to define your interests and use your professors to find schools with an excellent match to your interests. Examine the schools individually to assess whether they offer you a decent chance at teaching (or whatever you want to do) and apply everywhere the answer is yes. Put together your best application and let yourself dream a little. Don't apply blindly to the top 30, but don't let low statistical chances of success dissuade you, per se. Most people from the last admissions cycle, even the people that got into Harvard, will tell you that they has a low batting average.

I knew a kid in law school who dreamed of attending my alma mater, but after a good academic career, dropped a deuce on the LSAT. He literally set fire to his application in frustration. When the smoke cleared, he asked what he really had to lose, applied anyway and was admitted. How much time do you really want to spend wondering if what stood between and your dream school was another $80? Is money really the issue? Don't let it be. You're a junior. If you really, really want this, get a second job this summer, skip some nights at the bar and bank an extra thousand bucks toward applications.

Your grades make things tough. Your shot at top schools is limited and your future from lower-ranked schools is uncertain. You are likely to be forced to make some hard decisions that balance your goals with reality. But absolutely no one on this site, especially the students, really understand what it takes to get in. We can't rate your intangibles, so don't let us limit how high you aim.

Edited May 8, 2011 by GopherGrad

[Tufnel]

I will also add that it behooves you to think long and hard about why you want a PhD. If you want to do a PhD in order to teach at a research university or top LAC, truth be told, you don't want to do a PhD at a school outside the top ten or so as a theorist.

Frankly, the theory market sucks, at least theory as traditionally defined (formal theory, on the other hand, isn't bad at all). Even theorists from the very top universities struggle to earn a placement at a top school, many settling for simply any academic job.

The academic market is brutal. It just is. And theory is significantly harder than the other subfields. In addition, theorists have few skills that are valued in the broader marketplace. Someone who does political economy may find work in industry or government. But Nietzsche? I love Zarathustra but it won't take you far in a non-academic job.

Summarily, it behooves you to determine your desired ends and to then discern whether or not they align with the means to which you have access.

If you truly want it badly, then I suggest that you take the GRE and own it. 1550+. Then talk to your closest professors and ask which schools they think are reasonable fits. This will help you determine the strength of your letters. Apply to a range of schools but do not apply to schools that will not yield the type of job you seek. If you decide that a masters degree is a feasible option, also apply to MA programs that will make you a stronger candidate.

Be warned: It takes theorists a long time to finish. The decision to do a terminal masters degree adds time to a PhD that is already unusually time intensive when compared to other subfields.

Good luck!

Edited May 9, 2011 by Tufnel