Be careful how you talk to you references

[Ampere]

It suddenly came up last week that I was short a reference on two letters, so I went down to the next professor on my list. She had previously offered to write me a letter, but I had declined since I already had enough references (or at least I thought I did) and she was comp sci and I was applying to math programs. Anyway, I sent her an email asking if she would still be willing to write me a letter and if she thought she would have enough to say about me in the context of the programs I was applying to. I waited a week with no response (I did try to see her in person in the meantime, but she was not in during her posted office hours) and then tried emailing her again. This time she replied with a very terse email telling me to look elsewhere for a reference. Apparently she took my suggestion that she might not have enough to say about my mathematical aptitude as some kind of personal slight against her letter-writing ability and was deeply offended by it. I doubt she would have bothered to reply at all if I had not followed up.

So that's my story, which I was going to give as advice to be careful what you say to your references. In reality, I guess it turned out to just be a vent, but it was a much needed one. In hindsight, if she didn't think that the mismatch in departments was a legitimate concern, she probably wouldn't have written me a very good letter anyway. Hopefully I can find someone better to take her place.

[emmm]

Maybe you upset her the first time the topic of letter writing came up and you turned her down . . . .

Good luck finding your third letter writer. Applying is such a stressful process.

Edited November 1, 2011 by emmm

[Ampere]

Nah, she was fine at the time, and I've talked to her several times since then, so it was definitely something about the new request.

Also, I contacted the next person on my list a couple hours ago and already got a positive response, so all is well!

[Eigen]

If she offered and you declined, then got back to her later, it definitely comes across that she's second choice, but better than nothing. She probably wasn't offended when you said you had other reference writers who you thought would fit your choice of schools better- but then coming back to her was a bit much, especially if you didn't do it very carefully.

That's not generally an impression you want to give anyone, much less someone you're asking to write you a recommendation.

As to the mismatch between programs and your allusion that if she couldn't see it, she wouldn't write a good letter.... One of my best letters came from a Math professor (I'm in Chemistry). You would (supposedly) already have several writers talking about your math aptitude, not to mention your transcript. Your fitness for graduate study is something that someone in a closely related field can well attest to.

I'm glad the next person down your list was able to help you.

To expand on the point you were making: be careful how you talk to *everyone*. You never know who you might need help from in the future.

Edited November 1, 2011 by Eigen

[Ampere]

As to the mismatch between programs and your allusion that if she couldn't see it, she wouldn't write a good letter.... One of my best letters came from a Math professor (I'm in Chemistry). You would (supposedly) already have several writers talking about your math aptitude, not to mention your transcript. Your fitness for graduate study is something that someone in a closely related field can well attest to.

Sorry, my point there relied on background that you wouldn't know. She is a very new professor at a small school that doesn't have many students going on to graduate study, and I get the impression that she thinks a recommendation should just be a very general "X is a good student, he performs well in my classes, etc." So if she disregards my concerns about what the content of the letter should be, then I can't really rely on her to get a meaningful letter. The reference that she would have been replacing for two of my applications is also a computer science professor and he wanted to actively discuss the best way to tailor his letter to math programs, so the contrast is pretty striking.

As for coming back to her later, she specifically told me that if I wound up needing another letter I should let her know, but I guess that may have just been a bit of empty politeness.

[Eigen]

Ah, yeah, those points make a lot more sense.

My guess is that between the first request and now (since you mention she's very new) she's gotten snowed under with her classes, etc. and doesn't have the time anymore.

[Ampere]

My guess is that between the first request and now (since you mention she's very new) she's gotten snowed under with her classes, etc. and doesn't have the time anymore.

I'm sure you're right. My current annoyance with her is probably just putting everything in the worst possible light. Thanks for helping me see the situation a little more clearly.

[eco_env]

I would accept any offers for rec letters- as long as the school allows extra references. I needed an extra letter for some schools, so I asked 1 professor to send letters just to those schools. Eventually s/he found out that i was applying to other schools and didn't ask for rec. letters for those. It was a little awkward, but hopefully s/he recognized that there were other people more familiar with my ecology-related work.

[InquilineKea]

Wait - is it bad if a professor thinks they're second choice?

For the ones who don't know me as well - I simply tell them that I haven't had as much interaction with them as some others. For me, I simply equate quantity with quality, and don't make any mention of quality. That's all.