CUNY vs. Fordham, PhD English/Medieval

[lapelosa]

My number one concern when choosing a program is that I finish on time, with a good dissertation, and be in a good position for the job market.

I just came from visiting both programs in NYC, and now my mind is all atwirl and I am agonizing and stuff. Fordham faculty were absolutely wonderful to me, and they are offering a fellowship of just above $25,000, plus teaching one course per term after the first year. I saw much less of CUNY faculty -- the timing was bad, it was a Friday -- and they are offering a fellowship of around $18,000, plus teaching two courses per term after the first year. So financially Fordham is clearly the better offer. But.... I seem to be more on the theory side of things than the historicisit side, and CUNY is academically a much better fit for me. To work with Steve Kruger would be a _dream_, no pun intended.

I don't know. I don't know. I don't know.

[Stately Plump]

Don't take my advice, because I don't have a clear sense of what you should do at all.

If I had been accepted at CUNY, I would almost certainly have gone there. The faculty are amazing and, from what I can tell, they have a fantastic program. This doesn't mean you should go; all I mean is that I would have gone if I had gotten in.

The teaching load is something to consider. While teaching is wildly important, especially for getting a job, too much teaching can be detrimental to your own work. I just met a professor who was able to complete his MA/PhD program in 5 years because he got a dissertation year fellowship and had less teaching responsibilities (1/1 course load) throughout his time there. This made him a really competitive job applicant because it suggested to schools that he was really dedicated, organized, and responsible; to finish your PhD coursework, orals and comps, foreign language, and dissertation in 4 years after the MA is a major accomplishment, and in the end it helped him get a job.

Just food for thought. Like I said, I would probably be at CUNY next year if I'd gotten in. But Fordham's financial package sounds tough to turn down.

How bout this: I'll make your decision easier if you make mine easier

[jma310]

Fordham's best subfield is medieval so that's nothing to sneeze at! I'd probably choose Fordham. Money + a 1/1 is also a huge deal. You can't imagine how much work even teaching one class can be at times until you're doing it, so more than one while doing coursework/exams/diss is less than ideal.

[lapelosa]

How bout this: I'll make your decision easier if you make mine easier

Haha! What's the agonizing decision that _you_ need to make? I wish that I could whittle it down to which school is in a place with more hotties (quality of life, hey), but both are already in NYC.

[portlandfioretti]

Don't take my advice, because I don't have a clear sense of what you should do at all.

If I had been accepted at CUNY, I would almost certainly have gone there. The faculty are amazing and, from what I can tell, they have a fantastic program. This doesn't mean you should go; all I mean is that I would have gone if I had gotten in.

The teaching load is something to consider. While teaching is wildly important, especially for getting a job, too much teaching can be detrimental to your own work. I just met a professor who was able to complete his MA/PhD program in 5 years because he got a dissertation year fellowship and had less teaching responsibilities (1/1 course load) throughout his time there. This made him a really competitive job applicant because it suggested to schools that he was really dedicated, organized, and responsible; to finish your PhD coursework, orals and comps, foreign language, and dissertation in 4 years after the MA is a major accomplishment, and in the end it helped him get a job.

Just food for thought. Like I said, I would probably be at CUNY next year if I'd gotten in. But Fordham's financial package sounds tough to turn down.

How bout this: I'll make your decision easier if you make mine easier

Stately! I would like to trade you a BU spot for a CUNY spot! Not sure that it works that way sadly...

[Stately Plump]

Haha! What's the agonizing decision that _you_ need to make? I wish that I could whittle it down to which school is in a place with more hotties (quality of life, hey), but both are already in NYC.

I'm deciding between two programs and I'm still waiting to hear back from Fulbright. The Fulbright thing is killing me; I just want to move on a make a decision!

Stately! I would like to trade you a BU spot for a CUNY spot! Not sure that it works that way sadly...

I'm actually really, really excited about BU at this point. I probably wouldn't trade you... Though if I had gotten into CUNY straight out, I don't know what might have happened . I hope you get in off the wait-list! It would be cool to meet you in person!

[ComeBackZinc]

All I can say is that, as someone struggling to live on a grad stipend right now, $7,000 per annum is a huge difference, and you should give it a lot of weight as you make the decision.

[Jbarks]

I agree with others who have mentioned the money factor. In NYC, $25,000 will not go a super long way, but it will make your life easier than $18,000 will. Another thing to consider is the teaching load. I’m assuming CUNY is a 2-2, right? Fordham is definitely cutting you a better deal; they’re paying you more to teach less. However, CUNY is stronger in terms of theory. On the other hand, Fordham does have an incredibly strong group of medievalists. You’ll receive great training there. Even though it’s not (arbitrarily) ranked as high as CUNY, Fordham has a great reputation. A few other things to consider are placement rates, professional support, and the happiness of the current grad students. Beaten down grad students are a sign of not good times within the program. If you had (or have) a chance to hang out with the grad students, which group seemed happier and more productive? I know CUNY is a better academic fit for you, but is it a good personality fit, as well? I know academic fit is more important, but what program jives more with your personality? It may seem like a silly thought, but it can make a huge difference in long term happiness and productivity. Speaking of long term, which program has a faster completion time and higher completion rate?

You have an incredibly difficult decision ahead of you, but, in a way, it’s a good thing, because you’ve been accepted to two competitive and fantastic programs. I wish you the best of luck!! Let us know what you decide!

[hiphopanonymous]

Another point that you're probably well aware of, lapelosa: both CUNY and Fordham are part of the doctoral consortium (along with NYU, Columbia, Princeton, Rutgers, and maybe some others I'm forgetting). You should check the program's regulations about taking courses on other campuses, of course, but it may be very easy for you to register for a course or two at CUNY while enrolled at Fordham. That way you could take the theory you want there, but breathe a little easier with Fordham's better (-sounding) teaching/funding package.