Duke vs UNC

[asadun]

Hey all. I got into the CS PhD program for Duke and UNC Chapel Hill. Both offers are fully funded. Duke offered a fellowship (much better), UNC offered a TA/RA position. People from Duke have been emailing like crazy, including a few really awesome people I would like to work with. However, UNC has a much bigger department than Duke, more profs have funding there, and they have the best Computer Graphics program in the US, and I would really love to work in Computer Graphics. But I hear that Duke's program is considered more 'established' than the one at UNC, and that Duke's name counts for a lot. How true is this? Can anyone offer any advice on which school I should be picking?

[jasorod]

Congrats on getting into both schools! Being familiar with the area, both schools are really good, and I'm not really sure if I would say that Duke is more "established" ... if anything, if you are intending to stay in the research-triangle area, both schools are going to carry some serious weight. Even if you plan on getting a job further north in the DC-beltway, you are again in a toss-up between the two, unless there is a specific sub-field that you are attempting to target, such as robotics, systems, graphics, etc. Plus the further north you go, you're going to run into a lot more people graduating from other schools in the mid-Atlantic and northeast such as MD, NY, NJ, PE, MA, etc. If you are planning on an academic route, I unfortunately can't help you there :-(

BTW, I'm not attempting to hi-jack the original question, but while we're on this topic, is there a de-facto resource for finding the rankings of graduate CS programs in the computer graphics speciality? For instance USNWR's speciality rankings do not include the graphics sub-category, yet I've seen Universities claim to be some X rank in the field. For instance, you mentioned that UNC is the top computer graphics program in the U.S., yet I would have thought that distinction would have gone to Stanford, considering the plethora of computer-graphics research that has been generated by them in the last five-to-ten years.

As far as a ranking generated from a school's research in the sub-domain of computer graphics for the last five years, the closest thing I could find is this:

http://academic.rese...5&continentid=2

Is there any other resource that is considered a more precise indicator of a graduate program's performance in the computer graphics specialty?

Edited March 27, 2012 by jasorod

[asadun]

This is from where I got the ranking:

http://www.cs.unc.edu/Events/News/USNews.html

Im sure its not a fabrication if they put it up on their website. Plus, I've been following the US News and World Report rankings, but I always take them with a grain of salt.

Much better source of rankings here: http://graduate-school.phds.org/rankings/computer-science

Also, I do intend to pursue an academic career, so if someone could help me out with this decision, maybe someone who's been to the two schools, that would be really awesome.

[jasorod]

Not saying the ranking was a fabrication, I just simply can't find a speciality in "Graphics, user interaction" in the USNWR.

Also the NRC ranking apparently have some problems as well:

http://chronicle.com/article/After-Years-of-Delay-NRC-D/65918/

[habanero]

I know a few grad students from those schools. The Duke students seem much more relaxed, while the UNC students seem fairly stressed. I got the impression that UNC's program is much more strict. Have you visited the schools?

[asadun]

No I havent visited the schools. Its just that UNC's research in Computer Graphics fascinates me a lot, but if I go to Duke, I'll probably be working in Theory or Computer Vision, both of which I am also very good at, but I dont like as much as Graphics. Plus, Duke is where one of my profs got his PhD from, and his advisor is calling me there, and he's really, really good in his field. Also, Duke offered a really good financial package.

Bottom Line: I dont know if Im willing to risk having a lesser passion for my research for extra money and so-called 'prestige', since everyone seems to know Duke, but arent sure about UNC (even though I am). And most of my faculty members and family want me to pick Duke, even though I keep telling them that UNC is the best in Computer Graphics.

[jasorod]

Well, in the end, you're the one who is going to have to work hard at graduate school, and on a PhD track, we're talking multiple years of hard work. With no disrespect to your family or friends, or any other people advising you, I think if your heart is not in the work you're doing, then you're really not doing yourself justice, nor are you doing justice to the people who'll be depending on you to-do good research and contribute to the overall process. You know yourself best, so trust what you know is right. It may take a little bit of contemplative reflection to really dig down to find what's inside of your heart, but you should be going to school for yourself, not for anyone else. This isn't being selfish ... this is really drilling down to the center of what motivates you, and what will get you to go that extra mile when the going gets tough, or when you want to achieve that extra measure of success.

[habanero]

No I havent visited the schools. Its just that UNC's research in Computer Graphics fascinates me a lot, but if I go to Duke, I'll probably be working in Theory or Computer Vision, both of which I am also very good at, but I dont like as much as Graphics. Plus, Duke is where one of my profs got his PhD from, and his advisor is calling me there, and he's really, really good in his field. Also, Duke offered a really good financial package.

Bottom Line: I dont know if Im willing to risk having a lesser passion for my research for extra money and so-called 'prestige', since everyone seems to know Duke, but arent sure about UNC (even though I am). And most of my faculty members and family want me to pick Duke, even though I keep telling them that UNC is the best in Computer Graphics.

Wow, UNC doesn't have prestige? Are any of your family members in academia/computer science? UNC is an AMAZING school with an AMAZING Comp Sci program.

It does sound like Duke really wants you and is going to work hard to make it happen for you. Don't discount that. However, don't pick Duke because some of your family members think it is better.

If you do choose Duke, can't you work some graphics into your computer vision studies? Haha, I hope I don't sound like I'm gunning for you to go to Duke. I'm not. I just want you to choose the school that is the right fit, and it really seems as though Duke wants to give you everything good. General program fit can be more important than research, because your interests may change. Grad school is a long time.

I would try and make a visit to NC if you can. Duke and UNC are not so far from each other, and you could easily do the whole trip in a weekend. (EDIT, I just saw that you are from Pakistan)

Edited March 29, 2012 by habanero

[asadun]

Wow, UNC doesn't have prestige? Are any of your family members in academia/computer science? UNC is an AMAZING school with an AMAZING Comp Sci program.

It does sound like Duke really wants you and is going to work hard to make it happen for you. Don't discount that. However, don't pick Duke because some of your family members think it is better.

If you do choose Duke, can't you work some graphics into your computer vision studies? Haha, I hope I don't sound like I'm gunning for you to go to Duke. I'm not. I just want you to choose the school that is the right fit, and it really seems as though Duke wants to give you everything good. General program fit can be more important than research, because your interests may change. Grad school is a long time.

I would try and make a visit to NC if you can. Duke and UNC are not so far from each other, and you could easily do the whole trip in a weekend. (EDIT, I just saw that you are from Pakistan)

You're quite right in that my family is not from the academia. In fact, mostly they think Im crazy to want a PhD so early

But thanks for appreciating the problem. At this point I do feel that a visit would greatly help me in deciding, but its a little prohibitive at this point . But I cant visit, and so have to resort to external advice. All my work so far in undergrad research has been in Computer Vision and Geometry, but only because no one at my uni was doing Graphics, or I would have done it. But now I have the chance to go to a kick-ass graphics program, versus a kick-ass vision/geometry program, and im torn. Im really into both universities, but its just a matter that I like the research at UNC a little more than the research at Duke. But that aside, every other factor points me in Duke's direction - even my current faculty members are telling me to go to Duke. I really wish UNC had offered me a package like Duke did, but those are the breaks, I guess.

[jasorod]

BTW, UNC has a pretty good Computer Vision group as well, including adjunct faculty and researchers such as Lazebnik (UIUC), Frahm, Pollefeys (I believe he's now at ETH Zurich, but he's still listed as UNC faculty as well), and they have done a number of collaborative projects with the Univ. Washington and Microsoft Research, including researchers like Richard Szeliski.

You can see some of the work the UNC Computer Vision group has done here:

http://www.cs.unc.ed...hael_Frahm.html

I'm not as familiar with the Duke vision group, so they may have a more formidable collection of full-time faculty, researchers, and equipment, but don't assume that if you decide UNC is the best fit that you won't be able to also involve yourself in vision research. In other words it's not quite the "either-or" proposition that it may seem.

Edited March 29, 2012 by jasorod

[aricyo]

asadun - First off, congratulations!

I know nothing about your field and so cannot help you with any technical issues (ranking, career planning, etc).

But I do know a lot about Duke and UNC. I think Duke students can take any classes they like at UNC (not sure if vice versa true). And Duke and UNC are not far apart. Like 20 min drive. There is also free shuttle bus service between the two. So you don't have to worry about transportation, although eventually you will need a car to get around

Chapel Hill is a quaint but cute college town. There are some decent shops and restaurants, and in general there's a sort of liberal vibe in town. You will have a lot fun there. Durham, by contrast, is very boring. Students tend to hang @ Chapel Hill. But again, these two schools are very close to each other and you can always go back and forth. And you may want to live somewhere in between to take advantage of both schools. Also Raleigh - the bigger city in the RTP - is not bad. But I'm not sure how much time you'd have for non-academic stuff

Edited March 29, 2012 by arcyoung

[asadun]

asadun - First off, congratulations!

I know nothing about your field and so cannot help you with any technical issues (ranking, career planning, etc).

But I do know a lot about Duke and UNC. I think Duke students can take any classes they like at UNC (not sure if vice versa true). And Duke and UNC are not far apart. Like 20 min drive. There is also free shuttle bus service between the two. So you don't have to worry about transportation, although eventually you will need a car to get around

Chapel Hill is a quaint but cute college town. There are some decent shops and restaurants, and in general there's a sort of liberal vibe in town. You will have a lot fun there. Durham, by contrast, is very boring. Students tend to hang @ Chapel Hill. But again, these two schools are very close to each other and you can always go back and forth. And you may want to live somewhere in between to take advantage of both schools. Also Raleigh - the bigger city in the RTP - is not bad. But I'm not sure how much time you'd have for non-academic stuff

Thanks a lot!

And the vice versa is true, btw. I found it out.

[aricyo]

Thanks a lot!

And the vice versa is true, btw. I found it out.

yeah thats right i think no matter what - have fun in NC

[howpenghui]

Hi, just wondering, where did you choose in the end?