Planing the future (a.k.a. what can I do for research as an undergraduate)

[Snoq]

Hello,

I am studying Electrical and Computer Engineering, in a not well-known university, in Europe and I will graduate in three years (one more term cause of some problems I had). After my graduation I am thinking of going for a PhD, and I would like to get in one of the best universities like MIT/Stanford/Berkeley or in another top university like CMU/Cornell/Princeton/UIUC/Caltech. So, I have some questions (that I think will help other students as well) about what to do to have a chance on being accepted to one of the MIT/Stanford/Berkeley and being surely accepted to one of CMU/Cornell/Princeton/UIUC/Caltech cause I am not seeing myself graduating with 3.9 GPA or more (I will succeed though to get at least 3.7 GPA and I hope a little more – and I think more than 3.8 in major). Also I don’t know the specific area that I want to study (I like though control systems/robotics, artificial intelligence (/machine learning), algorithms and theory, computer architecture).

I have joined a software engineering team in my school where PhD students are members too and I will ask them if I can do research with them in machine learning/data mining (cause that’s their fields of study, and also trading agents) and I want to go for a summer internship in European Space Agency during my last year’s summer.

Apart from that I will ask another professor about research in computer architecture and another one for robotics. But I don’t know what else to do cause my university doesn’t have that much research so my only chance is to go for internship research at summers. Another thing I would like to do is to participate in Google Summer of Code this year or next year. But I don’t know if that will count enough for those universities, or should I spend my time in something else (do some more research myself, study a little more for better grades or find a research internship position somewhere).

So, my questions are:

• Should I apply to Google Summer of Code this or next year, or do something else? (Also I have exams from 11 to 30 June and that will be a kind of problem)
  
• Do you know any summer research internship (Europe or US - preferred EU) for ECE (not a specific area)? Because I am trying to find anything but I don’t get much results.
  
• Does anyone know if I can go (in any way) to any good university (EU or US) for the summer to do research, or to study there? (for example is there any way to go to CMU for research in robotics?)
  
• Any other way to do research as an undergraduate?
  
• Do you have any other ideas about how to spend my little free time?
  
• Should I contact any professor from another university to ask him about how to do research? (I am not in the mood of doing this right now, cause I don't know how he will see that)
  
  And some questions that are not for now but I want to know how things are:
  • After finishing my studies, if I won’t get accepted to any of those universities listed above can I do something to strengthen my application (in terms of research/work experience) and reapply next year?
    
  • If I go first for MS (at one of those universities or any good EU university), cause I think is a little bit easier to get accepted, will I have better chances to get in one better university for PhD?
    
  I also need to study English a little more because I am not fluent enough.
  I didn’t knew where to post is (Engineering or Compute Science).
  Please move this thread if it is in the wrong place and sorry for my English.
  I am not expecting for anyone who applies to answer me all questions, but your opinion in any of my problems/questions will be appreciated and helpful. Thank you!

[jyyhope]

I have an offer of cs PHD, but not from the top schools you listed. I applied PHD directly in my 4th year undergraduate. It is hard. I cannot answer that much questions. But about applying PHD, I have three suggestions.

1. trying to know what is the research of a certain field actually do, and most importantly, whether you like it (both the field and the research life itself). It helps you find your research interest early, and begin to accumulate knowledge of it. You can trying to attend some class, like AI. After knowing the basics from the class, go to a lab's website, reading papers. You may find different labs doing different aspect of, for example AI research. Papers can help you get some ideas of what is research, but not the whole thing. Attend a research lab and doing some research, even write a paper yourself may surly help you figure out whether PHD is a suitable choice for you.

2. maintain great GPA, and other stuff. PHD application is quite competitive. I see you mentioned google intern. Company experience helps you in many ways, like coding, which is important to cs research. But sometime, industrial experience is different to research. And I think no one will assure you that if you do something, then you can get a top school PHD offer. Application results are affected by too many things, even the profs' funding. Great GPA, language score, recommendation, research experience, even top papers can only give you plus, not assurance. Of course, if you can do well in most of these aspects, then you get a high chance.

3.about MS. it is easier to get into a top school's MS. If someone do well in MS, s/he get familiar with research of certain field and may have top papers. That will help. But if this person do not make great progress in MS, or even have low grade, it will hurt.

That is only my opinion. But knowing more about field you interested (class+research) is always a good thing to do. Only imagining what field is interesting or research is cool is not enough. Many of my friend who claimed to apply PHD change their ideas after truly get into a lab and doing research, because they find out that research is not exactly as they thought and just not suitable for them.

Edited March 31, 2012 by jyyhope

[j3doucet]

Research is pretty important. You should volunteer with a lab. Any lab, doesn't have to be absolutely the thing you want to do. Practical research experience opens a lot of doors...

Many professors are happy to take you on as unpaid help in your undergrad. Initially, you might have to do grunt work - data entry, routine coding. While you're doing this, spend as much time as you can talking to the other lab members. Get a desk in the lab if you can. Once you know the basics about the area, start reading papers, and soon you'll know enough to get a real research project.

[jjsakurai]

Be aware that admission into CS at CMU or theory at Princeton is going to be as hard as admission into MIT/Stanford/Berkeley.

[Snoq]

Be aware that admission into CS at CMU or theory at Princeton is going to be as hard as admission into MIT/Stanford/Berkeley.

I know that is very hard to get accepted to those two universities cause they are really the best in their fields.

I another question though. Am I applying to a specific department (f.e. Compute Science), to a specific area (f.e. Theory) or to a specific lab/project? And if I want to apply to more areas is an other application or can be mentioned in the same?

I am asking to know how specific should I be about what I want to do for PhD.

Also I know that maybe I don't like research and thats why I want to do research, to see how it is.

[tkulk]

Different people have different strategies. For all my applications, I was precise on what I wanted to do. Treat the SOP like a mini-research proposal. The most important thing would be your LORs, statement and research exp. Everything else is secondary.

Edited April 1, 2012 by tkulk

[Pauli]

My first advice is to never choose a computer science program based on its department prestige/rankings unless you really have no clue what field you want to specialize in and want to have plenty of options available to you. That's because you're automatically pigeon-holing yourself to a limited range of subfields. For example, if you wanted to do robotics, you're neglecting amazing university programs in the states of California and Texas where they do much better in some robotics subfields like you mentioned. You also mentioned computer architecture, and you didn't even mention programs such as Wisconsin, which does much better in that field than in Yale or MIT.

Pick a field you're interested in first, THEN pick the university. Then work your way up from there.

[jjsakurai]

I know that is very hard to get accepted to those two universities cause they are really the best in their fields.

I another question though. Am I applying to a specific department (f.e. Compute Science), to a specific area (f.e. Theory) or to a specific lab/project? And if I want to apply to more areas is an other application or can be mentioned in the same?

I am asking to know how specific should I be about what I want to do for PhD.

Also I know that maybe I don't like research and thats why I want to do research, to see how it is.

You'll probably be applying to a department like the CS department. If you're an absolute top student, then you'll get in no matter your research interests. If you're an very good (but not absolute top) candidate, then your admission will depend quite a bit on your background and your interests, whether the profs interested in you have money to fund you, etc. In that case, while you'll officially be applying to the department, in many ways your admission will depend on your interests/background/lab you want to work in, etc.

So bottom line - if you want to do say Theory at Princeton, then if you're a top candidate, you'll be admitted. If you're not a top candidate and your interest is in theory, then you'll be competing with other theory applicants to Princeton so it will be as tough as CS admission at MIT/Berkeley/Stanford/CMU

There are exceptions - for instance for U. of Melbourne (Australia) you apply to work on a specific project with a specific mentor. I think things are similar at some European universities. US/Canada don't officially have such a system but sometimes a prof might want you for a specific project which would amount to the same thing. The advantage with the US/Canada system is that you've a lot of freedom in terms of choosing an advisor and working on what a project you want to work on.

Edited April 2, 2012 by jjsakurai

[Snoq]

So bottom line - if you want to do say Theory at Princeton, then if you're a top candidate, you'll be admitted. If you're not a top candidate and your interest is in theory, then you'll be competing with other theory applicants to Princeton so it will be as tough as CS admission at MIT/Berkeley/Stanford/CMU

But can I apply for general CS at Princeton and then find a Theory advisor to do a PhD? or change advisors after getting admited. Or get in for an MS and try to do my best to impress advisors to ge me for a PhD. My problem is that at first year I didn't get good grades at a few courses (2.6/4 in physics, 3/4 at calculus I and Probability) so it may hurt my appliction.

For example, if you wanted to do robotics, you're neglecting amazing university programs in the states of California and Texas where they do much better in some robotics subfields like you mentioned. You also mentioned computer architecture, and you didn't even mention programs such as Wisconsin, which does much better in that field than in Yale or MIT.

I haven't done much research about lower ranked universities that are good in their fields. But I neither can't decide in what i am more interested, cause I really like all those fields I mentioned and I am really good at all of them. That's why I want to start doing research in those fields to see if like research in general and in wich field, but there aren't many oportunities in my country for research (I am trying to find though).

Can you mention some of those good universities in robotics and in which subfield are they good?

Edited April 7, 2012 by ChristN.

[jjsakurai]

But can I apply for general CS at Princeton and then find a Theory advisor to do a PhD? or change advisors after getting admited. Or get in for an MS and try to do my best to impress advisors to ge me for a PhD. My problem is that at first year I didn't get good grades at a few courses (2.6/4 in physics, 3/4 at calculus I and Probability) so it may hurt my appliction.

It's really hard to game things like that. First of all - Princeton has many more theory people as a percentage of their department so your prior odds of a non-theory prof recruiting you are not that high even though fewer non-theory students will apply to Princeton compared to the MIT/CMU/Stanford/UCB schools. Secondly, there will need to be a reason for a non-theory prof. to hire you - which means you will need to have done significant research in that area and have recs from people the adcom knows about. MS admissions are usually much easier but you usually have to pay too.

Honestly - you still have 3 years left! Get excellent grades in the next 3 years and your freshman grades will make little difference. Also do tons of research in the areas you like. Try to get a few papers published. You might try to find summer research opportunities with well known advisors. Even if you're from a school that's not that well known, you'll still have a decent shot at the top universities.

Btw, only the grades in your major (and specifically the subarea you're interested in matter). So your physics grades won't matter. Similarly if you're a theory applicant, then your Systems grades will not matter much either. A 3.8 is plenty enough.

Edited April 7, 2012 by jjsakurai