Students with Family Obligations

[Guest QUantas]

I'm an international. I will need to place my daughter in a public school. How does one go about selecting the school? I've heard that in the US one goes to school where they live. Does that mean that we have no say in the school of choice? If there are several schools in one's district, can we chose the one to go to or does it have to be assigned to us?? Does that mean that if we like a particular school we have to make sure to live right next to it? I really don't understand the idea of public schools in the US. :?

[cahaba]

Hi all,

Good topic.

I am a single parent considering moving cross-country with my 6 y.o., 5 y.o., and cat! Undergrad was pretty easy for me since I had the support of my parents. I don't know what grad school will be like (which is why I'm starting out as MA), but at least the kids are old enough to be in school now.

I haven't yet quite figured out the public school system myself. I think that rules vary from state to state. Where I will be moving, children are assigned schools based on where they live, so I have to try to figure out which schools are good before I decide which apartment to rent. If you know what county you will be moving to, you can research the school district online. Many online apartment guides will tell you which schools your children would go to (at least they do for the area I am considering).

[Guest Quantas]

Wow cahaba, that's brave! Are you getting funding from your school?

From the apartment guide I can see that there are several schools in the area. I particularly like one of them since they mention that it excels academically. My question: out of the several schools in the area, will one be arbitrarily assigned or can I say I"I prefer school xyz"?

[Guest Guest]

Warning, this hits on my undergrad thesis topic, so I tend to get a bit wordy :wink:

Regarding public schools in the U.S.:

It does, indeed, vary by state. In most states and school districts, you will have no choice on where your children attend public school. They will be assigned to one school based on your geographic location, and there will be no alternative. However, in many school districts (especially large cities), there are various programs that have been added recently with the intent of giving parents more options. Some districts allow you to put your name on a waiting list to be in another public school in your district, although there is no guarantee that you will get in. Some districts provide a lottery for "vouchers", which pay part or all of the cost for your child to attend a local private school instead of the public school. Some districts provide a lottery for entrance to "charter" schools, which are small, specialized public schools that have some "experimental" rules. Examples of charter schools are schools with a particular academic focus (such as science and technology, languages and cultures, or fine and performing arts), schools with extremely small class sizes, schools with longer hours and more time devoted to academics, etc. The research on the benefits of these schools is still ambiguous (I won't bore you with the details), but in general the kids in these schools tend to have parents who are more encouraging of education, and the kids tend to do better in school.

I know a fair amount about public education throughout the U.S., so I'm happy to provide information about any particular area. Let me know what city (or general region) you will be living in and the age of your kid(s), and I can probably give you a pretty good rundown of the schooling options in that area.

You may also want to ask the admissions office at your school, or ask if there is a group on campus for graduate students with kids.

[Guest Quantas]

Thanks, I'm thinking of Durham, NC I hear that the schools there can really be BAD (just what I hear). I've been checking out the stats on several schools and I kinda like Hillandale Elementary School (my y/o is six). If I get a place in that area, can I get my y/o into that school automatically be living around that area? At the moment she's in private school and doing well beut I doubt I could afford private school in the US :cry:

[Bianca]

I don't have a kid (yet), but reading your posts I was wondering how much private elementary schools cost in the US? and what about those charter schools? any other way to get in except the lottery?

[Guest Debating]

Quantas,

I know it's too early to think about this, but although I have no experience with public elementary schools in Durham, they do have on the best public high school in the country (North Carolina School of Science and Math). With Duke and UNC Chapel Hill so close, I would imagine they would have good elementary schools as well for the graduate students' kids.

[Guest guest]

Hi Quantas,

In Durham, your daughter would be assigned to a school based only on geographic location unless you choose to enter a lottery for a charter school. However, the charter schools in Durham are relatively new and have not had a chance to really establish good academic records just yet. I'd recommend looking for a good non-charter public school. You might find these two websites helpful:

"Report Cards" for North Carolina Schools - you can search by district, and look for schools with the two highest achievement grades ("Honor Schools of Excellence" and "Schools of Excellence"). When you click on the school name in the search results, you'll be able to look at performance on standardized tests, teacher/student ratio, etc. I'm guessing that your daughter will place into second grade? That would be the traditional grade for students her age. If she's advanced, they may place her in third grade.

http://www.ncreportcards.org/src/advSearch.jsp?pYear=2004-2005&aSearch=1

"Attendance Zone Maps" for Durham schools - once you've determined which school(s) might be best for your daughter, you can use this interactive map to determine where to live in order for her to attend that school.

Good luck!

[Guest guest]

Whoops! I left out the url for the attendance zone maps. Sorry:

http://www.dpsnc.net/index.php?option=com_wrapper&Itemid=860/assignmentmaps/index.php?

[Guest guest]

Bianca,

As far as I know, there is no way to get into a charter school except by lottery. Since they are still considered "public" schools, the district tries to be fair to all parents by running the lottery. Some big cities, though, have schools (especially high schools) that kids can get into only if they pass an entrance exam. These are usually known as "exam" schools. I know that Boston and New York have these. I'm not sure about other places in the U.S.

Private schools range in price quite a bit. Religious based schools (mostly Catholic in the U.S.) are often cheaper, but religious instruction is a mandatory part of the curriculum. Many non-Catholic parents don't mind this, and allow their children to attend Catholic schools anyway because they are sometimes the best alternative to bad public school systems. Secular private schools are usually very expensive - not the sort of thing that one could afford on a graduate student's salary. The exact amount depends on the cost of living in the area.

[tripax]

This article talks about comparing private and public elementary schools and talks about the costs of private school

http://www.greatschools.net/cgi-bin/showarticle/ca/197

Those prices seem really high to me; for example, here is the costs at the most prestigious private k-12 in my town.

http://www.brownell.edu/aspx/ad_costs.aspx

I think that a lot of inner city and Catholic private schools offer need-based scholarships to offset some of those costs. At least in my dioscene, this is true.

In my expirience there is no difference between the quality of education at many private and public institutions. I went to inner city public schools in the midwest and came out having more classes in foriegn languages, math, and computer science than any of my friends in the honors program at the large state college. Many public schools use magnet schools and honors programs to give gifted students private school level classes, while having general education classes with a much more diverse group than the private school offers. /end opinion

[cahaba]

Quantas, you are very brave as well - moving to another country with two young kids! Best of luck to you!

I will have a $14,000 TA and told that I could pick up another $1000 as an RA in the summer. However, I will be in Reno where the cost of living seems to be pretty high (at least compared to the South).

[Guest Quantas]

Boy am I grateful for all the advice I am getting, the great links and all. I have now moved from being completely ignorant to "better informed"!

[Guest roguejin]

Hi - Just found this site today.

But this is the exact topic that concerns me.

I have re-entered school after a ten year hiatus. During that hiatus, I got married, purchased a home, and have a two year old son. I'm now 9 credit hours and one thesis shy of my MA in Communications. By the way, the wife works and I watch my son all day, then take my courses at night, and study/write from midnight to three am. Its worked well so far.

I'm planning on moving on to a PhD program next spring. The metropolis I live in has a large University with a PhD Communications program, but if I don't get into that one, I don't know what I'll do. Or on a positive note - what if I get accepted to a dream school/top program somewhere across the country?

Think its a delimma trying to schlep a dog and a bedroom set to a new locale - try selling a home, wife leaving her job, then finding a new place for three - all on a generous $12,000 stipend.

International students are brave - but I'd be giving up alot.

I'll have to see how bad I actually want it (degree). :shock:

[Guest L again]

I hear you. I'm not at all concerned about furniture (thrift stores, anyone?) but I'm having to work out how to deal with my husband not leaving his job back home and of course we have a house too. I compromised on which school I chose so that I could finish sooner (with transfer hours from my MA) and to get to my dissertation faster so I can commute and live mostly at home after the first year. Since you will have an MA, maybe you can find a similar situation. My biggest worry now is getting a job afterward back in our area...my husband would prefer to stay there long-term, and academic jobs are hard to come by, let alone limiting myself to one location. Good luck with your decision!

[DespSeekPhd]

It's nice to hear people who won't look at me like I have three heads when I tell them I'm in grad school AND have children...

1) We have two kids - 9 (almost 10) and 3. Husband is entering medical residency in Kentucky, so that narrowed my choices of grad programs considerably. I decided to do my MA while in Kentucky and then do my PhD after when we can move wherever. We are actually going to have more kids, but our last will be at least a year old when I start my PhD. Since I juggled full time undergrad, full time work, and a toddler as a single mom, I'm not too stressed about the whole thing.

2) I'm not sure about the seriousness of your relationship, Bianca, but in Massachusetts you and your partner can be married. I'm not sure, but I would think that a "civil union" like you can get in Vermont would work the same.

3) Schools - what a headache. The thing is, when you look at schools, they all use different criteria for determining rank, and not all goive you equal information. One state will list according to their state test, one will give you information on national tests, and some use a combination of criteria. Upon moving to Kentucky, we were told this certain district was one of teh best in the state, and one list bore that out. But then I looked up the data on individual schools based on a national test, and I found out that a couple schools in the district were skewing teh data pretty heavily - and some of the schools in the district just downright sucked. So be careful. Also look at what the school offers - is it just math and reading, all day all the time? If they don't offer at least some of these: enrichment for gifted students, foreign languages, wide range of extracurriculars, field trips, etc., it's not a good school. It's teaching to the test to get high scores, but it wil probably make your child hate school. The best place to get information is the department of education in each state (look at their website). They list score information and rankings. Ignore anything about awwards the school has received - most are meaningless. There are tons of "Blue Ribbon Schools" (through the US department of education) that are actually failing schools by the same criteria, so I don't know what the awards are for. use your graduate student ability to analyze data, and be vigilant. Some states, like Texas, have notoriously troubled schools throughout the state, some states like Massachusetts or New York are pretty safe bets no matter where you go. My advice would be to find the good schools nearby, then look for housing within those areas.

[Guest Quantas]

I wonder if any of the married with children grad students have informed or plan on informing their departments of their status. Is it something that should be done or do you just go about your work until someone notices the ring on your finger or the baby goo on your shoulder. My point is: is it any of their business to know your status?

[DespSeekPhd]

That's your decision. I didn't feel obligated in the least - as far as I'm concerned , it's not their business until I'm ready to mention it. At the same time, if you feel at any point you would like to share the information, given a particular coversation or professor, go for it. I mentioned it to my advisor, because it was ftting in that converstation. A general rule of thumb, I think, is to not give them something arbitrary to hold against you, but not keep it a closely guarded secret, either.

[Guest hydsnare]

I did not feel obligated to mention the fact that I'm married and have kids - but chose to do so. The reason was for practical reasons - my advisor was the sole contact I had in the school I am going to and I am international; only moving to the US in mid August - I needed some information regarding elem schools etc - and I must say everyone in the department was hugely supportive - with information on schools etc.

Am not sure how it could be held against you though? Naive perhaps - but please do let me know how this could happen.

[postpartum]

Is there anybody who knows the details of the procedures for the family policies for the international student couples? Any website or any experienced person will help a lot. The exact question is this: I have been admitted to a Sociology Program (PhD). My prospective husband (what do you call it, my fiance??) has applied but rejected from a different program at the same university. Actually I am curious if US universitites has a policy of protecting the family unity or something like that, that would be helpful for us to stay together in the States... We are both international students.. I guess that each state has a different policy for that, but I dont know where to look for the policies..

Thank you

[StudyMom]

roguejin:

I'll top you! Three kids, dog, cat, rabbitt, 2 hamsters and more than 10 years since I got my Master's! I know I'm nuts but it seemed the right choice to get the PhD, after all my youngest is 2 and I felt my brain was rotting in the 9 to 5.

My husband is supportive and will change jobs and we have our house on the market (which is crashing of course -- bad timing) and the older kids are part of the discussions we've had about moving. Having a family did make a difference as to where I applied because we did not want to move from a rural area to inner city with 2 pre-teen kids and a toddler. So that ruled out a lot of good programs (I'm in communications as well). We aren't too concerned about schools because we do a lot of at home learning with them in addition to school.

Leaving our friends and family behind will be hard but we feel it will be worth it in the end. Perhaps when I finish the PhD we'll come back to this area but we aren't planning beyond the next three years...

Good luck in your pursuits!

[smellie]

To mothers -

I'd be just starting my MA soon and plan on going into Ph.D later. Although my mother, who gave birth to me while she was doing her MA herself -, is strongly against having children until I settle down on my first job as a professor, I'd like to start a family before I turn 30 - my boyfriend/fiance has a great job that pays well, so the money wouldn't be a huge issue. But what were your experiences with having children while still in school? Is it something that you'd advise for/against? would be a good time to have children?

I

[adstatus]

Great forum topic! I am married and have two kids, 8 and 4. My wife is a full-time stay-at-home mom. I worked full-time + while completing my masters (also as a full-time student). I've applied for a doctoral program but haven't heard anything yet. We too are very concerned about how we'll make ends meet. I currently hold a Visiting Assistant Professor position with the school I've applied to (in a different department). I'm not sure if I'll be able to keep it if I get accepted, though. If not, I think we are going to have to borrow money out the wazoo to get through four years!

If anyone has any bright ideas on how to make it work my wife and I would love to know. Having been down this road for my Masters, my wife is VERY apprehensive about me starting school again. Is there a support group for spouses of grad students?

[smellie]

Great forum topic! I am married and have two kids, 8 and 4. My wife is a full-time stay-at-home mom. I worked full-time + while completing my masters (also as a full-time student). I've applied for a doctoral program but haven't heard anything yet. We too are very concerned about how we'll make ends meet. I currently hold a Visiting Assistant Professor position with the school I've applied to (in a different department). I'm not sure if I'll be able to keep it if I get accepted, though. If not, I think we are going to have to borrow money out the wazoo to get through four years!

If anyone has any bright ideas on how to make it work my wife and I would love to know. Having been down this road for my Masters, my wife is VERY apprehensive about me starting school again. Is there a support group for spouses of grad students?

I don't know what school you'll be going to, but my school has a support group for wives/kids of grad students. I think they have workshops, info sessions, language classes etc. It was run jointly by the Graduate students society and international students office, so check to see if they have similar program at your school.

[madcalicojack]

I'm married with an 8 month old son and 3 dogs. I'm fortunate in that my wife teaches for an online university. It's a part-time income, but she can do it from home, even if where "home" is changes. My financial awards and her teaching ought to just make ends meet, but it won't be that comfortable. I saw in another forum someone wondering how they could ever spend $30,000 as a grad student. How life changes once you've been in the "real world" for a couple of years.

An obvious idea for making ends meet: Public transportation in most cities is really good if you're travelling to or from a university, and in many places students ride free. Become a 1-car family. Losing the second car can save hundreds per month.

Another: If you have any financial awards that are paid in large chunks, put the chunks in relatively high-yield accounts. i.e. if you get a fellowship as one big yearly chunk, put half in a 6-month CD, or talk to a financial professional about how to get the best yield. Don't just toss it in your checking account.