I need your advice because I am facing a major transition

[Connolly]

Hello!

I was a fourth year PhD student in Counseling Psychology when my adviser decided I was not a good fit for the program. I was new to this state, new to marriage, and did not know anybody here. I had made a good connection with one faculty member who was going to advise me, and she quit when I arrived and moved away for another job.

My time in the Counseling department has been difficult; the adviser I was left with was the chair of the department and we had no similar interests. I tried to align more with him and proposed several ideas for dissertation that included concepts of interest to him, but unfortunately we never quite succeeded working together. I also made the mistake in second year of criticizing one of the books he had assigned for class; I missed the session where he told everybody that the book was written by his former mentor and best friend, and because I did not know this I did not word the reaction paper quite as tactfully as I should. He gave me a grade of Enough! on the paper, unfortunately, and although he and I never talked about it, he has never really brought me “into the fold” so to speak, as he has the other students in my cohort. Anyway, the other two faculty members are young and very new, and difficulties in working with my adviser also weakened my relationship with the other professors in the department.

I have finished all but one course in Counseling Psychology. It would be a year-long course I would have left to take (Counselor Supervision), but still, just one class. Of course, I would have still had to do a dissertation and a year-long internship, so technically I did have about two more years to go before I was finished with my degree.

The program was pretty intense and I had few supports here, and I also had some medical problems that plagued me over the past couple of years. I got a several incompletes but have completely caught up on and passed these classes for a while now, and I have completed all my Field Placement and Practicum hours, which have been quite a lot. Anyway, I have received positive reviews for my clinical practice hours and there have been no complaints of inappropriate conduct or boundary violation of any sort.

I had to re-take a class and had to wait a year for it to be offered again, and in the meantime, in order to fill expected hours, I took advantage of the new Graduate Certificate in Aging my university had recently started offering. I have always had an interest in aging and my Field Placement at a local Rehabilitation Hospital, where counseled primarily older patients, was very rewarding. My interest in Gerontology increased tremendously as a result of this experience and I find myself now two classes away from finishing the Graduate Certificate in Aging as well.

The silver lining here is that my adviser in Counseling Psychology has agreed to help me transfer to the Gerontology PhD program, if they will have me. He has even pledged to write a support letter attesting to my strengths, and said the only thing he will write about my leaving that program was that it simply wasn’t a good fit.

Here is where I need your help.

I have a meeting coming up with a professor in the Gerontology department to talk about the possible transfer. He not only taught one of the courses I took last year, but he had agreed to serve on my dissertation committee as the outside member. He will not be playing that role, however, I am seriously considering asking him to be my adviser in the Gerontology Program.

My experience in the Gerontology Department has been like the difference between night and day. The professors have been fabulous, compassionate, patient, and smart. I have done very well in all the Gero classes I have taken and connected well with the professors. I really, really hope to get in, not only to salvage my PhD degree, which I have worked four years for, but to get the honor to study under these wonderful folks.

I did well in the class with the professor I am going to meet with next week, but I didn’t do as phenomenally as I would have had I known there was a possibility I would appeal to him to this extent. The year was rough for me as it was because I was having medical issues and the difficulties with my previous adviser were becoming seriously worrisome. I had lost a lot of confidence and was ashamed for having done poorly in some classes the year before; one thing you should know is that I came with a 4.0 GPA in my Masters degree. I also have an MBA and a Graduate Certificate in Developmental Disabilities – if there was one area in which I had strong self-efficacy, it was in academics. The loss of confidence and the stress I was going through no doubt showed somewhat in class as well, however this professor has been incredibly kind and I want to do all I can to increase my chances of getting into the Gerontology PhD program.

At this point I do not know much at all about what it will take. My Counseling Psychology adviser urged me to try and get accepted by the Fall semester, however he did agree to let me stay enrolled in the program (although not in classes) a while longer if needed until I get into another department. He won’t keep me forever though and I too want to see the switch happen as soon as possible. I do not know how it will work or what the new department will ask me to do, however I do know it will not be a traditional application process given that they know I would like to transfer preferably by Fall. I doubt they will ask me to retake the GRE but I would not be surprised if I have to provide letters of recommendation and even a personal statement.

Where I need help is in how to approach this upcoming meeting and how to conduct myself to maximize my chances of getting in. Some of my more specific questions are as follows:

- What should I tell him about how things ended in the old department? How much detail should I share and how do I not badmouth anybody but also not sound like I am just saying “what you would expect.” If I just say it was a bad fit he will no doubt wonder why it wasn’t and whether there is anything about me that might make me difficult to work with.

- What kind of questions should I ask him? I want to ask him about how many classes I many need to take and how long it may take, but I’m not sure if I should ask about mentorship, the dissertation, and other topics.

- Should I ask if I may be able to get my Field Placement requirement for the Gerontology department waived because of my extensive client contact with geriatric patients in my Field Placement in the Counseling Psych program, or is it too early?

- Should I say I have some dissertation ideas or leave it open for now? I am coming in rather late in the game and I do not know if it would make them feel more reassured to take a chance on me if I have some dissertation ideas or whether it will make them more apprehensive. On one hand they may fear I will never find a good topic and on the other they may fear I am going to stubbornly insist on a topic they are not interested in. I know I can just say these ideas are open to revision or even replacement but I have difficulty approaching this with confidence because this kind of negotiation has been a nightmare in the Counseling Psychology department. I am compromised and I cannot tell what’s reasonable.

- Should I ask him about research assistantships? My scholarship has ended after four years here and as of next semester I would be charged full out-of-state tuition if I don’t have an RA position.

- How much should I share about my medical issues that have made my previous years difficult? The situation has been resolved but it was a rather personal situation and I am not very comfortable talking about it, especially with a younger guy, even if he is a professor. On one hand it may help him understand my difficulties in the past (prior incompletes and the class I took over), on the other it may make him feel uncomfortable too, and on the third, it may not be as consistent with the whole "not a good fit" component which I may want to emphasize.

- I am currently the president of a Psychology of gender student organization, a position I will hold for another year possibly until another president is voted in. This organization has primarily been housed in the Counseling Psychology department but the faculty mentor for this organization said it should be no problem if I continued to be president while in the Gero department. In a recent meeting, I mentioned my interest in a topic related to gender and senior housing, and several members of the organization expressed interest in potentially doing some research related to the topic over the next year. Should I say anything about this in the meeting and how should I go about talking about it? This professor and I had discussed how we would both like to see the two departments come closer together and collaborate more given the need for mental health services in the aging field and especially given that the new Graduate Certificate program would provide a way for more Counseling Psychology students to specialize in Aging. Coming in while president of an organization primarily made up of students in the Counseling department can be a way through which the departments establish more solid ties.

- Finally, I could use any tips for departing well with the previous department. It is sad what happened but it has not all been bad. I appreciate the opportunity they gave me and would like to keep good ties with the department as a whole.

As you can I see I have a lot to think about in preparation for this meeting. Please give me any advice and suggestions you see fit; I appreciate your time and thank you for any guidance.

[ponylevel]

- What should I tell him about how things ended in the old department? How much detail should I share and how do I not badmouth anybody but also not sound like I am just saying “what you would expect.” If I just say it was a bad fit he will no doubt wonder why it wasn’t and whether there is anything about me that might make me difficult to work with.

Be honest. But be firm in your reasons why you think this time around you'll succeed, and what you bring to the table for the new department.

- What kind of questions should I ask him? I want to ask him about how many classes I many need to take and how long it may take, but I’m not sure if I should ask about mentorship, the dissertation, and other topics.

Sure, I don't see a problem with asking those questions upfront. I wouldn't start with questions though, I'd feel out what he thinks about switching first.

- Should I ask if I may be able to get my Field Placement requirement for the Gerontology department waived because of my extensive client contact with geriatric patients in my Field Placement in the Counseling Psych program, or is it too early?

Sounds early.

- Should I say I have some dissertation ideas or leave it open for now? I am coming in rather late in the game and I do not know if it would make them feel more reassured to take a chance on me if I have some dissertation ideas or whether it will make them more apprehensive. On one hand they may fear I will never find a good topic and on the other they may fear I am going to stubbornly insist on a topic they are not interested in. I know I can just say these ideas are open to revision or even replacement but I have difficulty approaching this with confidence because this kind of negotiation has been a nightmare in the Counseling Psychology department. I am compromised and I cannot tell what’s reasonable.

If your ideas are good then sure. Maybe pitch them to some other grad students first? And try to fold it in with what the professor's interests are.

- Should I ask him about research assistantships? My scholarship has ended after four years here and as of next semester I would be charged full out-of-state tuition if I don’t have an RA position.

Sure.

- How much should I share about my medical issues that have made my previous years difficult? The situation has been resolved but it was a rather personal situation and I am not very comfortable talking about it, especially with a younger guy, even if he is a professor. On one hand it may help him understand my difficulties in the past (prior incompletes and the class I took over), on the other it may make him feel uncomfortable too, and on the third, it may not be as consistent with the whole "not a good fit" component which I may want to emphasize.

I wouldn't talk about them. If absolutely necessary, I'd mention it in passing and say it made things difficult in the past few years but now I'm past it because of X.

- I am currently the president of a Psychology of gender student organization, a position I will hold for another year possibly until another president is voted in. This organization has primarily been housed in the Counseling Psychology department but the faculty mentor for this organization said it should be no problem if I continued to be president while in the Gero department. In a recent meeting, I mentioned my interest in a topic related to gender and senior housing, and several members of the organization expressed interest in potentially doing some research related to the topic over the next year. Should I say anything about this in the meeting and how should I go about talking about it? This professor and I had discussed how we would both like to see the two departments come closer together and collaborate more given the need for mental health services in the aging field and especially given that the new Graduate Certificate program would provide a way for more Counseling Psychology students to specialize in Aging. Coming in while president of an organization primarily made up of students in the Counseling department can be a way through which the departments establish more solid ties.

I'd keep the first meeting focused on the transition between departments rather than the new dissertation topics.

- Finally, I could use any tips for departing well with the previous department. It is sad what happened but it has not all been bad. I appreciate the opportunity they gave me and would like to keep good ties with the department as a whole.

Thank you cards with genuine feeling to your adviser and anyone else that helped you indirectly.

[crazygirl2012]

- What should I tell him about how things ended in the old department? How much detail should I share and how do I not badmouth anybody but also not sound like I am just saying “what you would expect.” If I just say it was a bad fit he will no doubt wonder why it wasn’t and whether there is anything about me that might make me difficult to work with.

You have some very valid reasons for it not being a good fit. For one, research interests were not matched after your first advisor moved away. That's a very legitimate and common problem. Just try to keep things as impersonal as possible. You can say that with the change in circumstances, you and your professors formed a working relationship that was fine, but your interests have taken you in a different direction (gerontology).

- What kind of questions should I ask him? I want to ask him about how many classes I many need to take and how long it may take, but I’m not sure if I should ask about mentorship, the dissertation, and other topics.

You can definitely ask about the dissertation. Quals. Funding. How many current students are in the program. I'd advise asking the students about your potential advisor's mentorship style, rather than asking the professor himself.

- Should I ask if I may be able to get my Field Placement requirement for the Gerontology department waived because of my extensive client contact with geriatric patients in my Field Placement in the Counseling Psych program, or is it too early?

I don't see why not. On my interview days, students with master's degrees asked about getting some requirements waived. It wasn't weird. As long as your request isn't too much of a stretch, it should be fine.

- Should I say I have some dissertation ideas or leave it open for now? I am coming in rather late in the game and I do not know if it would make them feel more reassured to take a chance on me if I have some dissertation ideas or whether it will make them more apprehensive. On one hand they may fear I will never find a good topic and on the other they may fear I am going to stubbornly insist on a topic they are not interested in. I know I can just say these ideas are open to revision or even replacement but I have difficulty approaching this with confidence because this kind of negotiation has been a nightmare in the Counseling Psychology department. I am compromised and I cannot tell what’s reasonable.

I was directly asked for my ideas in interviews. It's good to have some prepared, but be vague. It is indeed a hard balance to strike. If they ask the question, of course you'll have to answer it. It might be uncomfortable. I struggle a lot with confidence and hate sharing my ideas, but it's important.

- Should I ask him about research assistantships? My scholarship has ended after four years here and as of next semester I would be charged full out-of-state tuition if I don’t have an RA position.

Yes.

- How much should I share about my medical issues that have made my previous years difficult? The situation has been resolved but it was a rather personal situation and I am not very comfortable talking about it, especially with a younger guy, even if he is a professor. On one hand it may help him understand my difficulties in the past (prior incompletes and the class I took over), on the other it may make him feel uncomfortable too, and on the third, it may not be as consistent with the whole "not a good fit" component which I may want to emphasize.

There's no need to share anything personal, especially if it will make you both uncomfortable. The amount of detail you shared with us-- not much-- is perfect. You got the point across without compromising your privacy. I would do the same.

- I am currently the president of a Psychology of gender student organization, a position I will hold for another year possibly until another president is voted in. This organization has primarily been housed in the Counseling Psychology department but the faculty mentor for this organization said it should be no problem if I continued to be president while in the Gero department. In a recent meeting, I mentioned my interest in a topic related to gender and senior housing, and several members of the organization expressed interest in potentially doing some research related to the topic over the next year. Should I say anything about this in the meeting and how should I go about talking about it? This professor and I had discussed how we would both like to see the two departments come closer together and collaborate more given the need for mental health services in the aging field and especially given that the new Graduate Certificate program would provide a way for more Counseling Psychology students to specialize in Aging. Coming in while president of an organization primarily made up of students in the Counseling department can be a way through which the departments establish more solid ties.

Sure! From what you wrote, it sounds like you already know what you'd like to say. I think that bringing it up is a good idea. It shouldn't be too difficult to work this topic into the conversation.

- Finally, I could use any tips for departing well with the previous department. It is sad what happened but it has not all been bad. I appreciate the opportunity they gave me and would like to keep good ties with the department as a whole.

A brief, individualized, sincere "thank you" to everyone would probably go a long way. When you're saying goodbye, try not to harp on how things didn't work out. Just thank them for their help in your career, recommendations, and support.