History&Religion - thoughts please

[Guest inneedofhelp]

Okay, so...here's the situtation (chime in please): 2 admission offers that i'm really considering - one to a top 10 history program to work with a top top guy who may not stay (there's no one else there in my specific field if he leaves), another to a poorly ranked religious studies program which probably has the highest concentration of people in my specific field of anywhere (they're also very well thought of). oh, also, advisor at history program is very hands off (though supposedly all his students get jobs) and advisor(s) at religious studies program are incredibly involved (not in an overbearing way) and extraordinarily nice.

[Guest Guest]

I'm interested in Philosophy and Religion and trying to figure out which school to attend too. My ultimate goal is to get my PhD and teach Philosophy. My current interests are is in comparative philosophy (east/west) and I'm not sure which program to accept. U of Hawaii - great program, not well ranked, no funding; U of Chicago-Divinity - strong program, well ranked, 50% tuition scholarship but "Divinity" stigma when I apply for PhD programs in Philosophy?; Claremont Graduate Univ. - strong program, can get double MA in Philosophy and an MA in Religion (at the same time), not well known (I don't think), low funding. So confused.

[Guest inneedofhelp.]

go to chicago. an MA is going to show that you can do grad work - and chicago is well enough known that there will be NO "div" stigma - particulary if you can show papers in philosophy and letters from profs in philosophy. also, my advisors in undergrad said very strongly to not pay for your MA if you wanted to go on to aphd program - it's going to be too too long until you can pay that back.

thoughts for me? :-D

[Guest Guest]

Thanks for the response.

Given that the history guy may leave (any time frame on when he might leave?) I don't think I'd chance attending. The religion program would be what I would accept. I'm not one to take too many chances and having a professor(s) involved and helpful is important. If the history guy does leave where does that leave you?? No professor to mentor you, no one doing what you're interested in - how would this be helpful in the end? BTW - Which religion program/history program are you speaking about?

[Guest Guest]

As for the history/religious studies dilema: You might want to consider the fact that many advisors take their students with them when they leave a program. If you are a great students, and your advisor gets a job elsewhere, it is not uncommon for your advisor to make your acceptance into the new PhD program a condition of accepting the job. If everyone gets jobs out of the history program, that is a factor which can never be weighed too heavily given the current academic job market.

As for the other post, Hawaii is the top ranked program for comparative philosophy period. However, that being said, I would never consider comparative philosophy as my specialty, unless I could not imagine doing anything else. There are virtually no jobs out there in philosophy departments for comparative philosophy. If you have to comparative, however, then Hawaii is your department hands down. I would be very cautious about going to Chicago divinity if you want to go on to a philosophy PhD. I am currently getting my M.A. in philosophy in a top 10 program, and I can assure you that Analytic philosophy programs do not look favorably on divinity/religious studies degrees. Any philosophy you do at Chicago Divinity is most likely going to be Continental. Perhaps you can get into a Continental philosophy program coming out of Chicago Divinity, but look at the job market for people who do Continental philosophy----it's horrible. Claremont: good religious studies program, crappy philosophy program. Claremont and Chicago if you want to do religious studies, but they are not for philosophy. Not that I think this is a virtue of the philosophy world, but it is very elitist about what it does. Religious studies/Divinity is seen as unrigorous and flaky compared to analytic philosophy of religion. And Analytic philosophy is the name of the game in philosophy.

[Guest waiting234]

i know that in the scienes advisors take students with them - but does this really happen in the humanities?

[Guest Guest]

Of course it happens in the humanities that advisors take their students with them when they change programs. It's not as though your research and dissertation are somehow less important or require less advising than in the hard sciences.

My advice for the above poster would also be Chicago Divinity. If you can take courses in the philosophy department at Chicago, there are some top-notch analytic philosophers at in that department who could write you letters of recommendation.

[Guest waiting234]

um, okay, of course my dissertation wouldn't require less advising etc. however, the advice in the humanities when applying is to make sure to apply to programs where there's more than one person in your field in case someone leaves. which implies that that person would not take you with them. I finished a master's last year and none of the people in know - in masters programs or phd programs in the humanities know of anyone who was taken along by a prof who moved - hence my concern. do you actually know people who have done this?

[Guest historyandreligionaslo]

I'm trying to choose between a highly ranked history program and a lower (though not really that badly) ranked rel. studies program also! Out of curiosity, if you would feel comfortable saying, what religious studies program are you looking at? Mine is a lower ranked program at a prestigious school, but the advisor I would be working with studies exactly what I want to study. On the other hand, the history program has better placement rates, and is better established. Have you been given any advice on which is a better field to enter in terms of later job prospects?

[Guest inneedofhelp]

i'm a bit uncomfortable giving names but i can tell you that neither is private. i have been given advice about job prospects in the fields in general...i was told (by a religoius studies prof who really does intellectual history) that history is definitely a larger field in general, but that given my particular interest (islam) religious studies probably offer more job opportunities at the moment (since everyone is hiring/creating positions for people doing islam).

[Guest inneedofhelp]

waht are you studying? i'm glad someone else is stuck in this mess - it's hard given that so many religious studies programs are well-ranked (or so it seems) largely on the basis of their N.T. people...which doesn't help me ton. of the 40 programs or so grant the most religious studies phds in the country only half of them even have someone focusing on islamic things...and in most cases even those people don't fit my interests :-/

[Guest Guest]

I have heard of several philosophy professors taking grad students with them to a new department. I grant that if you are not at something like a top-20 program, then this is not likely. However, if you are working with a super-star, then his or her name behind your dissertation counts for a lot. The super-star is very aware of this, and if you have impressed him or her, then that individual may very well demand that you be allowed to come with them. Plus if your advisor is a super-star and has attracted very talented students, then the new program is going to be very happy to have the top-notch students that this super-star brings. It builds the reputation of a program to have brilliant, successful graduates coming out of it.