MFA Photography: Do I even have the slightest chance...? :(

[Nacht]

So I love photography and have done a lot of art photography on my own, and I'm thinking of applying to an MFA program. However, there's the thing: I majored in something completely unrelated to art as an undergraduate, never took an art class (not to say photography), never had any formal training, never had any art-related professional experience, never had anything. I was tyring to prepare for another career but decided to pursue art instead, so that's why all my previous experiences (even internships and jobs) are completely irrelevant. Therefore, I have nobody to write me a recommendation letter. Well, basically I have nothing but my portfolio...Umm, given this highly disavantaged background, should I even bother applying? Do people like me actually have a 1% chance of getting in? I feel like I would never be able to get in unless they think I have the talents of a real genius, which is of course unlikely...Would really appreciate your opinions. Thanks!

[michaelwebster]

You might have a chance at a some of the least prestigious schools, but why would you want an MFA when you have no professional experience? You will improve much more if you spend time showing your work, trying to do some residencies, and getting feedback from others artists before applying to an MFA program, because you will know what you actually want from an MFA program. Going now, if you could get in, wouldn't be time or money well spent.

I would advise taking classes or getting a second bachelors at your nearest art dept, because you will get the feedback and awareness of art programs to know more about MFAs.

[caitlingm]

I think michaelwebster is right. The art world is a strange a ferocious one, if you have zero experience you will be eaten up. Take a few classes at a community college to at least get the terminology down and some critique experience. Talk to everyone you can who is a formally trained artist. Get real criticism on your work. You have to at least get your feet wet. Let me tell you, applying to grad school, and "making it" in the art world is arduous and emotionally-taxing even for someone who has gotten the proper training. Or if you really really want to go to grad school (as opposed to going on residency, or taking some time to focus on your work in general) you should apply to a new program that is looking for artists to get them started, or look to a program that is not prestigious but simply will give you studio space and instructors.

[lady rainicorn]

I would definitely wait. There's no rush! When you enter an MFA program, your work should be at the cusp of being at a very professional level. The way I look at it, everyone drops to the same level again once they enter an MFA program, whether your 23 or 30. So you should really enter with a good amount of preparation and insight about yourself so that you can get the most out of the experience. I don't know how far out of undergrad you are, but I really want to emphasize that there isn't any rush. And I think your non-art-experience in the long run could help you, so don't see that as a weakness. I actually doubled in painting and a physical science and I think my time and research in another field has helped me a lot in shaping how I think about the world and my work. But you need to make sure you're fully caught up in art history, some critical theory, and the everyday language of art. If you've never been torn apart in a group critique, I recommend experiencing that before getting to grad school.

There are also a lot of philosophies out there for grad schools. Some tear down students and then build them back up. Others intensely challenge what you want to do as an artist, and you in turn have to defend what you're doing. But I think, no matter the philosophy, you should have a good sense of self and what you desire as an artist. Otherwise you may end up floundering for 2 or 3 years.

Take some classes, read, and look at as many images as you can - all of it, paintings, photos, prints, throughout history, West and East, anything related to visual culture. The more you have stored in your brain, the more informed your work will be, and the better you'll understand what you're doing relative to a very large and rich history of images.

Best of luck!!!

[michaelwebster]

Community college classes probably won't challenge you as much as a post bac or second bachelor's could. What do you see as the benefit of an MFA if non-degree classes or residencies are a delay? MFA programs aren't usually worth it if youre looking for higher paying jobs, so why not get a post-bac, which is only a 1 year commitment, and see where it goes from there? Lastly, academic records don't really matter in regards to fellowships for MFA students, what really matters is portfolio and interview. Reading through past years of discussions here could give you an idea of the expectations for applicants. Also, if you're up to posting a link to your work up here, it could help. I was a little invovled with the photo dept while at school and so if you want feedback give me a PM.

[lady rainicorn]

Yeah, definitely avoid community college classes if you can. If you have access, I would try and take adult/continuing education classes at an art school or a decent university/college. You'll be exposed to people who are art majors and those who see art as more than just a passing hobby.

If you are serious about going into art, I wouldn't think too much about the issue of "delying" real life (the artist's life doesn't really fit into the normal mold anyway, yay!). Residencies can be wildly helpful and you don't always have to pay. You get to meet people at all stages of their careers and some have visiting artists that conduct studio visits. I was at a residency this past May, and I was able to collect information on all the schools I'm interested in, b/c there were graduates of all the programs I'm considering and some of the visiting artists were actually current faculty at these schools as well.

And if you're really really serious about making art, full-time job or not, you have to train yourself to find energy. We've all been there. Get creative with your schedule. When I was doing full time lab research I would paint at night. When I taught abroad, I got up at 5am to draw before I had to teach my classes. You just have to do what you gotta do to get the work done.

If you have any questions on residencies and the such, shoot me a pm!

[Nacht]

Wow thank you so much guys!! I really appreciate your wonderful advice. For now I'm thinking that a post-bac program would probably be most appropriate, because aren't residencies for more experienced artists?? I have the impression that you have to already be an artist in order to do a residency (especially a funded one). In any case, the only problem is that post-bac is not cheap (though of course much cheaper than MFA), and I have to bite the bullet and use up my limited savings instead of taking up a job to earn more. But I guess if I really want to do this I've got to make some sacrifice...My greatest fear is that I might not have enough talents no matter how hard I try.

[lady rainicorn]

From the words of Jerry Saltz:

http://blogs.artinfo.com/artintheair/2012/09/21/10-pieces-of-advice-for-artists-from-jerry-saltzs-keynote-speech-at-expo-chicago/

1. Go to an art school that doesn’t cost too much. Those who go to Yale and Columbia might get a nine-month career bump right after graduation, but you’ll all be back on the same level in a year, and you won’t be in as much debt.

2. Envy will eat you alive.

3. Stay up late with each other after all the professors go to sleep. Support one another.

4. You can’t think your way through an art problem. As John Cage said, “Work comes from work.”

5. Follow your obsessions. If you love the Cubs that much, maybe they need to be in your work.

6. Don’t take other people’s ideas of skill. Do brain surgery with an axe.

7. Don’t define success by money, but by time.

8. Do not let rejection define you.

9. Don’t worry about getting enough sleep. Worry about your work.

10. Be delusional. It’s okay to tell yourself you’re a genius sometimes.

[michaelwebster]

If you don't want a post-bac just see if you can take the advanced undergrad classes. The ones that include critiques.

[Nacht]

Thanks! Lady rainicorn the link you posted is really interesting and I like it, and michaelwebster that is certainly an option too. I think I should probably put up a link to my work so maybe people could give me some feedback/criticism (really like the other thread and I'm impressed by everybody's work), but unfortunately my website is under construction and the only thing I have right now is a deviantART profile, which is only accessible to DA users. Are people on DA? In any case I'm already feeling a bit clearer about where I should start looking. Thanks a lot!

[losemygrip]

Nacht, I don't think you have any idea what you're getting into. Have you worked in any medium besides photography?

I disagree with some of the others. The complete lack of formal training is a problem. I actually WOULD encourage beginning classes, particularly in design and drawing. You could take those at a community college or anywhere. Also, art appreciation and art history would be essential. Just because you've taken lots of photographs, that doesn't mean you're ready to be an artist. You probably don't even have the vocabulary to talk about your work with anyone.

Once you learn more about what "art" is really about, you can see if your photography fits in and if you really want to be a part of it.