Dropped the ball on Quant section

[Tolman's Rat]

I wrote the GRE last week, and my unofficial scores after test came up as:

152 Q

162 V

Looking at the approximation charts on the ETS website, this means 52nd percentile for quantitative and 89th percentile for verbal. I feel my analytical writing section went fairly well, but I didn't really study for it, so I can't say for sure.

My average is very solid, at least by my estimation. I am a Canadian student, overall average of 84% and major average of 88%. I have just one B in my major, and five Bs overall. All other grades are As. Just posted in the IHOG forum and I have been reassured that my GPA is pretty strong.

My recommenders have told me that they are writing very strong, complimentary letters. I have worked with all of them in a research scenario, and one of them both in research and in coursework strongly related to my field of interest. This latter faculty member is very well-known in his field (Sid Segalowitz - editor-in-chief of Brain and Cognition journal) and should be able to provide a pretty influential letter.

They have also told me that my statements are very strong.

I have worked as a TA for a few years now - for two years as a stats TA (beginning in my third year of undergraduate study) and this year as a TA for intro psych. I have done very well in all of my stats courses and anything quant related, so I feel that my quant score on the GRE is an aberration on my quant history.

I had a terrible, terrible day on the day of the GRE (basically culminated in losing my passport on the streets and having my identity questioned by the testers - kind of an amusing story now that I would be glad to share if anyone wants a laugh ) The high-school type math tested on the GRE is just not intuitive to me like verbal reasoning is, and I was not in the frame of mind to really focus in on it like I needed to.

I am applying to Psych PhD programs at UCSD, Berkeley, and Stanford and the CogSci PhD program at UCSD. Do I have any chance? Will a poor GRE score absolutely ruin me? I plan on really honing in on my stats background in my statements to demonstrate that my GRE score is just an aberration, but I am not sure if it will matter much. I have been told over and over again that a GRE score won't make or break an application, but I want to get as much input as possible.

PS. I am still above any cutoffs for GRE scores.

[midnight]

You're applying to top schools and highly competitive programs, so I definitely think you should study hard and retake.

I think UCSD's acceptance numbers and applicant averages tell you all you need to know--

How many applicants do you accept to the program each year?

Every year varies, but here are some statistics from the Fall 11 entering class:

• 12 students admitted from 133 applications
  
• 3.6 GPA average
  
• 680/760/5.25 GRE Average for Verbal/Quant/Analytical respectively
  
• Majors included such varied fields as: Chemistry, Computer Science, Cognitive Science, Electrical Engineering and Linguistics
  

152 on the GRE likely isn't going to cut it. You should probably be aiming for 160+.

Cliffnotes Math Review for Standardized Tests is a cheap and comprehensive math refresher. (Many people here swear by Manhattan for math; I've never used it, but you may want to check into it.) I highly suggest The Princeton Review's Cracking the GRE for general test tips and tricks as GRE quant isn't always straightforward even if you know all the concepts and Barron's Six Practice Tests along with ETS's Powerprep for solid practice as well. Practice A LOT.

Good luck!

Edited November 16, 2012 by midnight streetlight

[Tolman's Rat]

Thanks for the advice. I did pick up the Manhattan tests, but didn't use them to their maximum potential. I did find that, though I was familiar with most of the concepts tested, I wasn't prepared for the tricks of the GRE, so I might grab the Princeton next time around.

At this point, I am in too deep and it is just too late to re-take by the deadlines. I am going to apply and give it everything I can in the meantime. My GPA, by my own calculations, is well above the average GPA of admitted students. I have very strong letters, very strong statements (as I have been told by my recommenders), strong research experience, and valuable TAing experience in stats.

I don't know that I'll get in. Optimistic but sort of expecting the worst. Everyone that I have been in contact with from those programs, though, has told me that the rest of my background looks strong and to apply because the application is considered holistically. A GRE score is not going to make or break my application.

I guess I am hoping that A. the rest of my application is so far above the average, that a quant GRE score isn't going to pull me down, B. my stats background demonstrates my quant GRE score to be an aberration, and C. the GRE isn't as highly valued as it once was and faculty would rather focus on aspects of an application that, you know, actually matter

Again, thanks for the advice, and it's sort of what I was expecting. I am fully prepared to give it another try next year if this application cycle doesn't work out for me. I know that I can do well on the GRE, it's just about putting the work in.

Edited November 16, 2012 by Tolman's Rat

[808bella123]

Sorry to learn about your experience and thank you for sharing. I am curious; was the math markedly harder than the examples and practice tests provided by ETS or was it comparable? With respect to the verbal section, did you find a plethora of difficult words, especially on the second verbal considering you did really well on verbal.

Thank you in advance for any insight you may offer.

[Tolman's Rat]

Sorry to learn about your experience and thank you for sharing. I am curious; was the math markedly harder than the examples and practice tests provided by ETS or was it comparable? With respect to the verbal section, did you find a plethora of difficult words, especially on the second verbal considering you did really well on verbal.

Thank you in advance for any insight you may offer.

I found that there was more inference necessary in the math section. It was just not intuitive. A lot of hypothetical-type scenarios where you need to have specific principles and/or "Smart Numbers" in mind because you're not actually given numbers to work with. I didn't study with ETS so I can't comment on the similarity of the questions.

The verbal section was easy for me. I downloaded the Kaplans flash cards app on my Samsung and that helped a bit, but most of the vocabulary I had little difficulty with. I found that the multi-blank text completion were passages were difficult not for the vocabulary used, but for the ambiguity of the meaning of the passage. There were multiple options that would fit and you need to really read carefully and make sure you are choosing the set of words that fits best.

There is some obscure vocabulary though, so be sure to study your vocab at least a little bit. Kaplans has 500 words organized into three levels of difficulty. It doesn't take long to learn those and it's well worth the download.

Edited November 17, 2012 by Tolman's Rat

[kaykaykay]

Programs are looking at applications holistically but there are a lot of good applicants.This is a crapshoot process even if all your stats are stellar and it is even a bigger risk if someone can question your abilities (even at the last round of decisions). I would add a few lower ranked schools to your list just in case. (of course if you do no mind being out of school for a year if worst come to worst don't do it). In any case 4 schools are not very many and they might all have different issues(like a prof is leaving that you did not know, they want a certain class etc..). You can be just left out by sheer chance alone.

Edited November 17, 2012 by kaykaykay

[bamafan]

Optimistic but sort of expecting the worst. Everyone that I have been in contact with from those programs, though, has told me that the rest of my background looks strong and to apply because the application is considered holistically. A GRE score is not going to make or break my application.

If it's too late to retake the GRE, then go for it and take a shot at applications (though those fees do stack up!). It doesn't hurt to try!

Certainly, if the rest of your application is strong, an admissions committee may overlook an aberrant GRE score. However, I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but sometimes, the GRE is used as a sort of filter to automatically eliminate candidates before they even look at other parts of the app. So that's probably the main stumbling block.

[Tolman's Rat]

Programs are looking at applications holistically but there are a lot of good applicants.This is a crapshoot process even if all your stats are stellar and it is even a bigger risk if someone can question your abilities (even at the last round of decisions). I would add a few lower ranked schools to your list just in case. (of course if you do no mind being out of school for a year if worst come to worst don't do it). In any case 4 schools are not very many and they might all have different issues(like a prof is leaving that you did not know, they want a certain class etc..). You can be just left out by sheer chance alone.

I have awesome jobs and connections at my current institution, so I'm not too worried about sticking around if I absolutely have to. These are my dream schools, and honestly, there are not many other places where I would be happy long-term. I don't mind if I have to go through the process again next year, but I've come too far to let a crappy quant score get me down.

If it's too late to retake the GRE, then go for it and take a shot at applications (though those fees do stack up!). It doesn't hurt to try!

Certainly, if the rest of your application is strong, an admissions committee may overlook an aberrant GRE score. However, I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but sometimes, the GRE is used as a sort of filter to automatically eliminate candidates before they even look at other parts of the app. So that's probably the main stumbling block.

Yeah, if it wasn't too late I would just do it over again. I should have taken the advice of a faculty member I'm close with and taken it during the summer. If there is a next time, now I know and have learned from it. Your last point is what I am truly worried about - the GRE as a filter. I hope that my discourse with faculty will preclude that possibility - I have had very positive conversations with several persons of interest - and that their knowledge of my situation for the GRE and other background will give me an upper hand.

Also - I should mention that I am still above the cutoff for any programs that have a GRE cutoff. I would hope that those schools wouldn't automatically eliminate certain GRE schools, but I could be wrong.

Edited November 17, 2012 by Tolman's Rat

[midnight]

Also - I should mention that I am still above the cutoff for any programs that have a GRE cutoff. I would hope that those schools wouldn't automatically eliminate certain GRE schools, but I could be wrong.

If the schools bother to state cutoffs, I hope that means that they take the time to consider anyone who's above them. It sounds like your application is otherwise strong!

And as I mentioned above, I really, really recommend the Barron's practice tests. I found them on par with the actual GRE, and they make for great practice for both verbal and quant. (Princeton Review [aside from its tips and tricks] and Kaplan are too easy and also don't quite hit that specific ETS style.) If you don't make it through this round, you could start studying in earnest in early spring and have plenty of time to take the GRE as needed before next year's deadlines.

Best of luck!

[808bella123]

Thank you for responding to my inquiry. Every little bit of insight helps. I consider math to be my tenous area, particular under timed conditions. As have I a tendency to have "aha" moments after staring at the problem for a few moments which can seem like an eternity or outright too long. I will heed you advice.

Again thank you for taking the time. Have a pleasant day.

[Tolman's Rat]

OK...feeling a little better...analytical writing score came in and I got 5.0, 92nd percentile, so that quant score, I hope, is looking more and more like an aberration (if it wasn't already due to my extensive stats background)