Spring admission to UK MAs?

[czesc]

Hi all - so I am pretty convinced the PhD admission process is going terribly for me and am looking into UK MAs that have late deadlines as a backup. Does anyone have experience applying to rolling admission programs like these in the spring re: chances of admission? Would it be a horrible idea to contact my recommenders about it before results are out for all my PhD application schools (if I don't, the turnaround might have to be very tight on the recs, and my chances of getting into a rolling program even further diminished). Thanks!

 

Programs I am looking into at the moment (not all history, but any general advice or advice from people who know these other fields appreciated):

• LSE - MScs in Political Theory, Comparative Politics, History of Int'l Relations, Empires/Globalization
• SOAS - MA History
• UCL/Queen Mary - MA Political Thought and Intellectual History
• Cambridge - MPhil Historical Studies, MPhil Modern European History

[Canator]

Well since you've only been rejected for three out of your ten schools (and all of them happen to be elite universities that reject a lot of very good applicants) I would sit tight and wait a little bit longer. Maybe go and talk to your primary adviser and hear what she/he has to say. Have you figured out why your applications are going "terribly"?  It may help to try making contact with your confirmed rejections and asking what recommendations they would have for improving your application. Truly though, I think the best thing to do is to wait and maybe have a short chat with your adviser.

 

Just remember that you still have SEVEN schools to go and that getting rejected from top of the line universities like Berkeley, Columbia, and Princeton doesn't mean you won't get in anywhere. Hopefully you applied to some non-Ivy / par-Ivy schools?

[czesc]

Thanks for your advice, Canator. I definitely didn't apply to all Ivy schools, although maybe I still aimed too high. I haven't gotten interviews at several other places that have offered them, and I was a better fit for the schools that seem to have rejected me than for many that haven't gotten back yet. I know this doesn't mean certain doom, but none of the signs are pointing in any good direction. I'm definitely planning to see what my adviser says at some point, but that person works at one of the schools I'm waiting on official word from, and I don't want to jump the gun or awaken doubts.

 

That said, I want to take this empty time to plan contingencies so that I have everything in place if/when the PhD process doesn't come off, hence this thread.

Edited February 8, 2013 by czesc

[jogatoronto]

Theory and History of IR at LSE has no core course.  You will have to make your own friends.  Queen Mary campus is in Mile End (last stop in zone 2 on the central line going east).  It's much further from central London than the other schools you are considering (except Cambridge).

[czesc]

Thanks, joga. I hardly mind not being right in central London -- I just need to be in a program!

[Sio68]

Do you have an MA czesc?

 

Also think you shouldn't write off this year yet, but I do understand that you're trying to prepare just in case.

 

Have you thought about outside London/South England? There are loads of great schools in the UK with excellent reputations. They're also cheaper than London and geographically very well connected (both to the rest of the UK, Europe and abroad.) I don't know how well you know the UK but it's so small that you're never far from anywhere.

 

If you really want to plan ahead just in case, think about Universities like Manchester, York, Edinburgh (though I'm not sure they do stand alone MAs), Cardiff, Bristol and Birmingham. I don't know all of these programmes but it's worth you looking into their faculty to see if they'd work for you. If you feel that you will need an MA to be competitive (and again, this is assuming you get all rejections) these could provide very good MAs and the US schools will know their names.

 

Furthermore, all of the above (perhaps with the exception of York) are very vibrant cities with a lot going on.

[This is my Screen Name]

czesc, I feel for you, man.  I’m in a comparable situation to you.  I put all my eggs in one basket, so to speak.  I don’t know why anyone would ever put eggs in a basket, that seems dangerous and/or messy, but that’s another story.  Anyway, I’m pretty much PhD or bust, and I would describe this past year as living in limbo.  I’m working for a temp agency.  I’m living with one of my parents.  I’ve been turned down from several jobs because I stupidly mentioned in the interviews that I may be going away to school next year (I promise I won’t do it anymore!).  I thought if I explained to them that it was a real long shot that I’d get in they wouldn’t care, but they aren’t familiar with the process so that explanation had, in effect, no effect.

 

Someone much wiser than me told me to approach this as a three year process.  It’s not exactly a crapshoot but there are so many qualified applicants that if you’re not the cream of the crop a lot of things have to go your way to get in somewhere.  For someone as impatient as me with no other prospects or job skills (unlike you who is a lawyer!) that’s very difficult to accept.  But I want a PhD in history, so I have to accept it.  And I think you want a PhD in history too.  I don’t think you want to move to England to do an MA program.  There’s nothing wrong with a backup plan, or getting an MA, but don’t do it on a whim because you are severely limiting your options.

    

Don’t jump off the cliff yet.  There's still time (to both jump off the cliff or get into a program)!  You’re going to kill yourself trying to analyze every part of this process, listing presumed rejections and such.  It's all out of our control now.  Just have to let it happen.

Edited February 11, 2013 by This is my Screen Name

[annieca]

I second the recommendation to look outside of the London area. I've heard great things about Edinburgh's History program. St Andrews as well. I would recommend my study abroad university but only if you're Library Science or InterPol. Since you're neither, I wouldn't suggest Aberystwyth.

 

The UK process is seriously the most straightforward process I've ever seen. Depending on the university it is also remarkably quick. The only problem seems to be funding. UK PhDs are more likely to be funded than MA's, like in the US, but they decide funding really late. I won't know about funding at Aberystwyth until July and that goes the same for PhD candidates.

 

But don't panic for now. You've got time!

[czesc]

Thanks, all. Sio - no, I don't have a masters already, though I do have a law degree on top of my BA (which may have been more of a liability than any help). This is my Screen Name - thanks for your kind words. I'm definitely gunning for a PhD in the long term and am not trying to go for a consolation masters. Unfortunately, I'm not sure whether my lack of success so far is a product of the process being a crapshoot or some kind of deficiency in my application, but in case it's the latter I feel like I should probably do something to improve my chances the next time around...

 

I will definitely look into more schools outside London. One of the reasons I didn't mention any more is that I'm trying to narrow the amount of schools I apply to, in part because I'm really concerned about taxing my recommenders with more requests - especially if I get in to a PhD program and they become superfluous.

 

I see that most of the deadlines have passed for funding so I'm guessing I'll have to self-fund. This is actually another one of my motivations for doing a masters in the UK since even the non-EU student tuition rates seem around half those of US schools. Luckily I have savings that I have been putting away to help survive on a lean grad student stipend, and while I guess it'll mean being poorer if I ever actually do get into a PhD, it might be an investment worth making if it helps get me there.

 

Annieca, you say I have time - when do you think I need to set this process in motion by in order to get a place and not be beset with too much competition? There are some schools with deadlines in late March, others late June, others August and some with none at all.

[jogatoronto]

Apply to LSE, if you are going to, as soon as possible.  Programs will start closing by March.  

 

Consider King's College London, they've been poaching great profs from other schools around the UK.  

 

If you want a list of some good schools that are not in London consider the Russell Group.

 

How about continental Europe (in a country that your research interests are on)? Many solid universities teach in English.  They are also prob cheaper than the UK schools.

[czesc]

Thanks, joga. The website for LSE says it's rolling admissions - do you mean they'll fill up by March?

 

Any suggestions for continental Europe? I'd be concerned about going anywhere too far off the radar screen of US PhD programs. I've looked in Germany since I can speak the language there (though only at English programs) and didn't see anything especially useful.

[AKACaz]

Take a look at the Netherlands, perhaps, especially Leiden and Utrecht. They teach in English a lot, and many if not most Dutch people younger than 50 will speak English. 

 

Top Dutch universities according to Shanghai: http://www.shanghairanking.com/Country2012Main.jsp?param=Netherlands

[czesc]

Thanks! That was a good idea. Unfortunately, looks like Leiden is not really geared toward my interests and Utrecht's program is two years (making it a bit too long and expensive for what I'm looking for).

[jogatoronto]

LSE has rolling admissions but you'll see that by March many programs start filling up and by April it's pretty much impossible.  Netherlands is a great idea and so is Germany.  You want to be as close to your archives as possible.  

[annieca]

History wise... I've heard some good things about a few programs in Germany - Heidelberg is one of the oldest but I'm not entirely sure if they offer MAs/PhDs. Mainz, another one of the oldest ones - offers PhDs in History but again, it's all what you're looking for.

 

Timeline wise... I would get the ball rolling as quickly as possible. It's like what you did with any other universities you applied to - make a deadline calendar. I'm not sure about the bigger schools in the UK, but be prepared to submit your own letters of rec. (It's weird, I know.) That is, if the schools use UKPass (St Andrews doesn't) then you normally provide the recommendation letters. They want PDFs of the actual letter on letterhead. That can save your professors/recommenders some work. 

 

It's also a sneaky way to read what your recommenders have written about you since FERPA-waivers are now the norm. 

 

Anyway... I would say *definitely* apply before the end of April/beginning of June. Funding is usually decided in July so you want to have your application in and the decision for admission in your hand when they go for the funding decisions.

 

Also, I don't know how much you know about UK universities and how they award admissions. Nearly everyone coming straight from undergraduate or still in a program somewhere, is given conditional acceptance. For example, my admissions decision at Aberystwyth is conditional. I have to do three things - 1) actually graduate 2) keep a 2.2 (they're GPA is a little different there too) and 3) put in a 2,000 pound deposit since I'm international. Usually they give you a deadline in which to meet the conditions. Mine happens to be August.

 

Conditional isn't bad. Most people are offered conditional and then they're eventually changed to unconditional. 

 

If you have any other UK-specific questions, hit me up here or PM me. Always happen to help!

[arraytherocks]

It's definitely possible - I submitted my application for an MSc at University of Edinburgh in April of last year; because of problems with my documents, my application wasn't officially final until around the middle of May. I was accepted around the beginning of July, I think. Like you've said, the major problem is that the funding deadlines will most likely all have passed by the time you hear back officially from any departments, so you'll have to self-fund. 

 

For what it's worth, I've really been enjoying my course (Eighteenth Century Cultures) at Edinburgh -- my application process and first term were a little complicated, but I'd be happy to answer any questions you've got about the school, etc.