Using an MPP (Master's of Public Policy) to prepare for a polisci PhD application?

[MollyB]

Hi all, I've already posed this question to the Gov't Affairs board, but nobody there seemed to have any ideas (which is understandable because an MPP is a professional degree and not many MPP hopefuls are thinking about a PhD. I wasn't until a few months ago!). 

 

I applied to MPP (Master's of public policy) programs for a Fall 2013 start. If I like grad school, I'm thinking of pursuing a think tank research job down the line, and I might eventually need a PhD, maybe in polisci or econ. 

 

Since you're all experts in the polisci PhD process, can anyone tell me what I should look for in an MPP curriculum to make me a decent candidate for a polisci PhD? I have zero research experience from undergrad, so I'll be looking for things like getting to do a thesis or an independent research project with the supervision of a professor. What else should I be looking to do in my two years in an MPP? Anyone know of people who've gone the MPP-to-PhD route, maybe with some research assistant think tank experience in between or something? 

 

Any thoughts or tips (including books / websites to read) for an aspiring polisci PhD coming to the game sort of late, and who'll definitely be getting a Master's in public policy first, would be super appreciated! Thank you!

 

ETA: My B.A. is in polisci, but with really unimpressive grades as I never thought I'd ever pursue more school. My GRE was pretty good though.

Edited February 27, 2013 by MollyB

[upam]

Do you think you absolutely want to do the MPP? And how set are you on a PhD down the line?

[jcross9]

Your GREs are tremendous, so I wouldn't be too concerned about stats. And congrats on the Carnegie Mellon acceptance--very impressive program.

 

My advice would be this: try your hand in the think-tank world before you apply for PhD programs. If you feel like there really is a ceiling at your institution of interest, then go for the PhD after a few years. If not, then you have saved yourself a lot of time and energy in the application process, along with 6-7 years of your life in grad school.

[ThePope]

I'm interested in the answer to this question too. I've also applied for my MPP but would love the option to pursue my PhD down the line. For similar reasons as OP.

 

Would this really be that weird? I know the MPP is a professional degree and not research-oriented like a traditional Master's in Political Science. But in many ways, the MPP is the application of political science, as opposed to merely the research of it. Would that be enough to get into a PhD program?

[jcross9]

Thanks for the response, upam. I'm definitely set on the MPP, not sure about the PhD at all. I'm currently working in public policy, but I'd like to move to a more research oriented role instead of advocacy so I need better stats / econometrics skills. 

 

My thinking, and someone correct me if I'm wrong in it!, is that I'll be in grad school anyway, there's no harm in tailoring my MPP to make it competitive for PhD admission. 

 

 

 

 

@ jcross, that's great advice about the waiting to see if I hit a ceiling, thanks for the perspective. Mostly I kick myself now for my terrible undergrad academic showing b/c I thought then that I'd never go to grad school, so I'd like to avoid a repeat. 

 

Glad to help. I wouldn't kick yourself too much about undergrad GPA--you have an MPP GPA to make up for that! :-)

 

Also, though I'm not sure what your political persuasion is, let me just say this about think tanks: to date, I have interned in two and have gotten to know several scholars pretty well. Though some do indeed have PhDs, you'd be surprised at how many do not. Some don't even have master's degrees--let alone an MPP from a place like CMU. Yet these people have worked through the ranks of a think tank and have learned a lot of the econometrics and methods that many PhDs even struggle with. I don't see why someone couldn't follow the same path with an MPP. And anyway, it's rare for someone to just drop in as a resident scholar at a major think tank--might as well start your networking earlier, and then get the extra edu. only if you need it!

[upam]

Thanks for the response, upam. I'm definitely set on the MPP, not sure about the PhD at all. I'm currently working in public policy, but I'd like to move to a more research oriented role instead of advocacy so I need better stats / econometrics skills. 

 

My thinking, and someone correct me if I'm wrong in it!, is that I'll be in grad school anyway, there's no harm in tailoring my MPP to make it competitive for PhD admission. 

 

Ok, this makes sense. Would have had different advice if you were absolutely set on a PhD program.

 

Definitely see the utility in what you're doing - and I do already have an MPA (focused in public policy) and have been in a very research oriented job (some would argue it's very similar to a think tank) for a couple of years. What you focus on in your MPP to make you more competitive again technically depends on what type of PhD (quant, qual, certain program, etc) you actually want. However - generally I'd say having as much statistics/analytics/econometrics as possible (while earning a strong GPA) is absolutely a plus for many programs esp as these aspects become more important for programs. While earning your degree or working afterwards, publish what you can. The other benefit from this route (if you're already taking it) is the opportunity to build strong references.

 

Finally, if you can take a couple of grad poli sci classes and make them fit in the MPP, it could be worth it to prove your chops in the field generally later on.

 

And if you get a job you love and won't hit a career ceiling without a PhD - go be awesome without it!

[uflkel]

I got my B.A. from a small regional school in the Southeast. Wasn't sure what I wanted to do (grad school or public sector), so I went into an MPA program. I was very clear during with my advisor that I wanted to potentially pursue a Ph.D. We had elective credits that you could use for specialized training (city management, human resource management, etc.), but they allowed me to use mine to take graduate course work in Political Science. However, the school I attended did not have an M.A. or Ph.D. in PoliSci, so I had to work out classes with undergrad faculty. They set me up with directed studies that were meant to mirror the level of discussion and reading that one would encounter in a Ph.D. program. 

I am currently a first year Ph.D. student with no regrets. I'm happy I did the MPA and I am thankful that I had professors willing to work with me to get me prepared, understanding that my undergrad institution was not a prep school for advanced degrees. I was able to attend a small conference, SPSA, and MPSA, and I have a co-authored publication coming out later this year. 

Obviously, CMU will be different. But if you can get a good advisor and some professors willing to mentor you, you will be able to work toward both goals without shutting either door. 

And as jcross9 stated, if you really like policy and you are still unsure about the Ph.D., work at a think-tank. Also, the market for Ph.D.'s is terrible, so if you do pursue a Ph.D., you'll have the MPP to fall back on (that's my backup plan at least) if you can't get your dream job. 

Oh, and congrats on the acceptances. Good luck!

[uflkel]

However - generally I'd say having as much statistics/analytics/econometrics as possible (while earning a strong GPA) is absolutely a plus for many programs esp as these aspects become more important for programs. While earning your degree or working afterwards, publish what you can. The other benefit from this route (if you're already taking it) is the opportunity to build strong references.

 

I second this advice. Take a data analysis class if possible. Chances are, even if you aren't interested in quantitative methods, you will be required to take at least one course in basic stats. You don't want to get bogged down in a Ph.D. program if you can avoid it by taking something to get you prepared in the MPP.

[raptureonfire]

This may be a stupid question, but is there a reason you would switch from public policy to political science?  Why not pursue a PhD in Public Policy?