YDS or PTS MDiv?

[Jcosta]

Hello everyone,

 

I had asked this in another topic but thought I'd bump it, as we're really having a hard time deciding.

 

So the choice comes down to Princeton Seminary and Yale Divinity. Both have offered me full funding for their M.Div. programs.

 

 

My ultimate goal is teaching historical theology at university or seminary, but I haven't ruled out ministry (mainline protestant).

 

I know both places are strong in postliberal theology, and I love it. I'm very interested in studying Barth, and I know PTS is definitely the place for that, with both McCormack and Hunsinger on staff. On the other hand, Yale has Miroslav Volf, and Kathryn Tanner...

 

For someone who wants to go on to doctoral work, which of the two is preferable? How much does it matter that PTS is not part of Princeton University, while Yale Div is Yale U?

 

Also, anyone have any info on raising a family in Princeton vs. New Haven (I have one toddler and another one on the way)?

 

All opinions are appreciated and good luck to all on making their decisions!

[Jcosta]

Bump.

 

No takers?

 

Has anyone lived in either place? I wanted to visit, but things at the bank aren't exactly... ahem... superb. 

 

Just wanted to know which would be best in terms of getting into a good PhD (historical theology) later on. Contra some on the forum, I'm more interested in post-reformation theology and modern re-appropriations of Protestant orthodoxy.

 

My conundrum is that, though I believe I could get into a PTS PhD from Yale, I'm unsure that the opposite would be true.

 

What thinkest thou?

[Therewillbeluke]

I'd say PTS is more inline with your interests because they are firmly focused on Reformed theology, however YDS may open more doors for doctoral work

[Raskolot]

While I am not married and do not have a family, I can tell you that Princeton is a good place for families.  I am a first year student at PTS, and the families that live in family housing here seem very happy with it.  The apartments for families are almost brand new, and the community life there is fabulous from everything I have heard.

[ûl ʾašerātō]

I'm in Hebrew Bible so I cannot speak with any authority on which place would be better for your academic interests. But, I will say that if you're interested in teaching at a university or seminary I'd recommend Yale. Yale has a number of options for people in your situation. You can choose a considerable amount of your curriculum in the MDiv program, which is a big advantage over a number of other programs. Also, many students continue on after the MDiv an additional year for the STM, which allows them to have an additional academic year before pursuing doctoral work. You have full access to the resources of Yale University, as the div school is a professional school within the greater university. If you desire to pursue ordination, the option would remain open to you. As for living in New Haven, I will say it is manageable, though not the most desirable. If you live in East Rock (the most popular neighborhood for grad students) your toddler (assuming he/she will begin school while you're here) will be in the Hooker school district, which is the best elementary school in the city. Living in New Haven is very similar to living in a larger city (I somewhat compare it to my time in Chicago), despite the fact that New Haven itself is relatively small. I haven't been to Princeton, so I am not aware of what living there is like, though I get the impression that it would be much more suburban. 

 

If you're seriously considering doctoral work and pursuing an academic career, I would recommend Yale over PTS. 

 

Best of luck making your decision. 

[Lux Lex Pax]

I wouldn't worry about the ability of PTS to place you in a program like Yale's. M.Div. students from PTS have had great success gaining admission to top theology/religion programs. The benefit of PTS over Yale is that PTS has more theologians and they're actually around (I hear that Volf isn't always around and may not be that accessible). If you're really interested in Reformed -- and more generally Protestant -- theology, academia with the possibility of ministry, and a family friendly environment, I would choose PTS. If you were more interested in various kinds of liberation theology (Black, Latin American, feminist, womanist, queer, etc.), then I'd say go with Yale; PTS has some of that, but traditional Christian theological sources, approaches, and arguments are favored, or so it seems to me.

[indefiniteintegral]

I'm in Hebrew Bible so I cannot speak with any authority on which place would be better for your academic interests. But, I will say that if you're interested in teaching at a university or seminary I'd recommend Yale. Yale has a number of options for people in your situation. You can choose a considerable amount of your curriculum in the MDiv program, which is a big advantage over a number of other programs. Also, many students continue on after the MDiv an additional year for the STM, which allows them to have an additional academic year before pursuing doctoral work. You have full access to the resources of Yale University, as the div school is a professional school within the greater university. If you desire to pursue ordination, the option would remain open to you. As for living in New Haven, I will say it is manageable, though not the most desirable. If you live in East Rock (the most popular neighborhood for grad students) your toddler (assuming he/she will begin school while you're here) will be in the Hooker school district, which is the best elementary school in the city. Living in New Haven is very similar to living in a larger city (I somewhat compare it to my time in Chicago), despite the fact that New Haven itself is relatively small. I haven't been to Princeton, so I am not aware of what living there is like, though I get the impression that it would be much more suburban. 

 

If you're seriously considering doctoral work and pursuing an academic career, I would recommend Yale over PTS. 

 

Best of luck making your decision. 

I don't want to hijack this thread, but I appreciate your comments! I'm currently deciding between YDS MDiv and Duke MDiv. I've never been to New Haven, much less CT. (going for the first time for Admitted Students Day).

I'd love to hear more of your comments about living in New Haven! Or if anyone else wants to chime in, that would be great!

[Jcosta]

This is great, thanks everyone! Just what I needed!

 

I second indefiniteintegral's call for more info on life in New Haven!

 

Thanks again.

[Jcosta]

I don't want to hijack this thread, but I appreciate your comments! I'm currently deciding between YDS MDiv and Duke MDiv. I've never been to New Haven, much less CT. (going for the first time for Admitted Students Day).

I'd love to hear more of your comments about living in New Haven! Or if anyone else wants to chime in, that would be great!

 

I'm sure you've looked into it, but cost of living in Durham (vs CT) is absolutely amazing. I hear Hauerwas is retiring this semester, and while that's definitely a bummer, there are so many world-class scholars to work with there. If Duke had offered me the funding YDS and PTS did, there'd be no question; though I'm partial to the postliberal project. Duke's an exciting place to be.

[indefiniteintegral]

I'm sure you've looked into it, but cost of living in Durham (vs CT) is absolutely amazing. I hear Hauerwas is retiring this semester, and while that's definitely a bummer, there are so many world-class scholars to work with there. If Duke had offered me the funding YDS and PTS did, there'd be no question; though I'm partial to the postliberal project. Duke's an exciting place to be.

Don't doubt you there. In my case, YDS has offered me a lot more funding than Duke.

[ûl ʾašerātō]

I don't want to hijack this thread, but I appreciate your comments! I'm currently deciding between YDS MDiv and Duke MDiv. I've never been to New Haven, much less CT. (going for the first time for Admitted Students Day).

I'd love to hear more of your comments about living in New Haven! Or if anyone else wants to chime in, that would be great!

I'd say live in New Haven has its ups and downs. I'll assume you're familiar with weather in the NE (and Princeton would have basically the same weather), so I'll skip all if that. On the upside, New Haven has a lot of the perks of living in a larger city: numerous restaurants, bars, theaters, shopping, etc. I love New Haven pizza, which is had at a few well known places around town. Also, New Haven is very walkable for the most part (esp. with the assistance of the Yale shuttle services). There is plentiful housing in East Rock, which is the most popular place for graduate students to live. On the downside, New Haven is a lot like living in a large city: traffic, parking, crime, and high rent prices are all an issue here. Now, I should say that the crime is largely theft. So, it's not like living in Chicago, which had something like 500 homicides last year. You should expect to pay $1,100/mo for a livable one bedroom apartment in east rock at minimum. Most single graduate students who live off campus share 2-3 bedroom places to save money.

In the end, I enjoy living in New Haven. I love the local restaurants (the Italian place 2 blocks down know our "usual" order, and always chat with us when e pick up our pie). There are a ton of university sponsored events going on all the time. Most of them include free wine/beer and food. But, I definitely wish living here was more affordable.

I'd say that whether or not you'd like living here is largely contingent upon whether or not you'd enjoy living in a more urban environment. If you're OK with dealing with traffic, parking problems, a large homeless population, and minor crime (no one I know has had a problem since I've been here), you'll probably enjoy living here. If you tend to shy away from the drawbacks of city life, you might not like New Haven as well as you might like Princeton.

I hope you will remember as you read this that it is merely my experience, and not necessarily indicative of everyone's experience. But, I hope you find it helpful all the same.

[indefiniteintegral]

I'd say live in New Haven has its ups and downs. I'll assume you're familiar with weather in the NE (and Princeton would have basically the same weather), so I'll skip all if that. On the upside, New Haven has a lot of the perks of living in a larger city: numerous restaurants, bars, theaters, shopping, etc. I love New Haven pizza, which is had at a few well known places around town. Also, New Haven is very walkable for the most part (esp. with the assistance of the Yale shuttle services). There is plentiful housing in East Rock, which is the most popular place for graduate students to live. On the downside, New Haven is a lot like living in a large city: traffic, parking, crime, and high rent prices are all an issue here. Now, I should say that the crime is largely theft. So, it's not like living in Chicago, which had something like 500 homicides last year. You should expect to pay $1,100/mo for a livable one bedroom apartment in east rock at minimum. Most single graduate students who live off campus share 2-3 bedroom places to save money.

In the end, I enjoy living in New Haven. I love the local restaurants (the Italian place 2 blocks down know our "usual" order, and always chat with us when e pick up our pie). There are a ton of university sponsored events going on all the time. Most of them include free wine/beer and food. But, I definitely wish living here was more affordable.

I'd say that whether or not you'd like living here is largely contingent upon whether or not you'd enjoy living in a more urban environment. If you're OK with dealing with traffic, parking problems, a large homeless population, and minor crime (no one I know has had a problem since I've been here), you'll probably enjoy living here. If you tend to shy away from the drawbacks of city life, you might not like New Haven as well as you might like Princeton.

I hope you will remember as you read this that it is merely my experience, and not necessarily indicative of everyone's experience. But, I hope you find it helpful all the same.

Thanks so much for your insight! While I'm deciding between New Haven and Durham, this is still very helpful!

[Jcosta]

Great info, thanks!!

 

From what you say, New Haven seems pretty desirable.

 

I wonder if someone who's lived in Princeton would care to give us their 2 cents...

 

Thanks again!