Accept or Wait?

[waitingitout]

I have applied to seven PhD programs in RhetComp. Rejected from three, accepted into one with funding, waitlisted for three. I've already been given two extensions to announce my decision by the program that has accepted to me. They have told me that it's "impossible" to grant me an extension until April 15th. It's hard for me to accept because my first choice has waitlisted me and I keep hoping that somehow I will magically be accepted before I commit myself to the other program.

Now it's the deadline to commit myself and I'm wondering: how binding is an acceptance of an offer? I definitely don't want to go back on my word but, if the worst (or best?) case scenario happens and I'm taken off the wait list and accepted into my first choice program, would it be academic suicide to attempt to accept the other offer after I've already accepted the first one?

Or another option: with times and the economy being as crazy as it is now, would it be absolutely unthinkable for me to not accept the program with funding and cross my fingers and hope for the best with the three I've been waitlisted for? I don't want to go through this whole applying/waiting process again. I'm just finding it very hard to push the "send" button and commit myself to a program when I have yet to hear from three others.

[greekdaph]

Is the program that's pressuring you to accept part of the Council of Graduate Schools agreement that holds schools to the April 15th deadline? Check here: http://www.cgsnet.org/portals/0/pdf/CGS ... ch2009.pdf

If so, then you can accept the offer that's pressuring you and withdraw your acceptance by 4/15 if you need to. Granted, it's best to avoid accepting and then declining an offer if you can at all avoid doing so, but if the school is giving you no choice, then you shouldn't feel too bad about doing this.

[sonicsustain]

It seems like the school that accepted you is trying to strong-arm you into taking their offer.

You should check to see if that school signed on to that agreement between grad programs that says they'll give students until April 15th to decide. If not, tell them that you need to make an informed decision about grad school, and they need to allow you the proper time to do so.

[waitingitout]

How legally binding is that agreement? The program is a part of the April 15th agreement but when I mentioned that I only got the reply that it was "impossible" to grant me the extension... I know it sounds like bad news but it's the only offer I have...

[Spritely]

Would funding be guaranteed funding at all of the three schools for which you are wait listed, or would that be an entirely new variable even if you were admitted? And do you know where on the wait lists you stand at those schools? Maybe you should contact the wait listed programs and explain your situation to see if they can give you some sense of your odds this year. If you're #1 on the wait list at all three, you will probably get in to one of them. If you're hovering around the middle of a wait list, this may not be a year to risk giving up a funded offer.

At least you have a choice to make this year, so it sounds like things will work out one way or another. Good luck with your decision!

[teaganc]

If you weren't waitlisted, would you be willing to turn down your funded offer and reapply again next year for a chance of admission to a better program?

This is the situation you are essentially putting yourself in, should you decide to take a chance on the wait lists. You might get in to one of the three, but then again, maybe not. And you might not get in to any of the three, or any other program, next year, should you decide to apply again. If you would rather go through one or more rounds of applications than attend the program where you have funding, turn them down now (and might I suggest not applying, should you have to reapply, to any program you feel that way about).

If you would rather have the funded offer than risk reapplication, then take it. A wait list is nice, sure, and your top choice is great, but you can also make the most out of the funded offer you have if you are willing to do so. Personally, I would take the funded offer rather than risk a year (or more) out of school, without health insurance, with higher car insurance rates, putting off my life plans for yet another year, etc. etc. But if the thought of going to the school where you have an offer is so terrible that you would rather risk all of that then attend there, turn them down.

[booksareneat]

I agree with Teaganc, you can spend a long time thinking "what if?" In the end, you'll have to make a decision: A) you take a chance, decline the offer, and get into your dream school You take a chance and find yourself at Starbucks for the next year, waiting for your life to begin C) you go with what you have. Assuming you knew what you were applying to, this is a program that is good, not great, that will be solid for you and will get you a job. But you knew what you were getting into. If you had been rejected from every other school, would you be happy at this school to which you've been accepted now? Delay your decision as long as you can and then make sure you'll have no regrets when you finally do it. Good luck.

[socialpsych]

Now it's the deadline to commit myself and I'm wondering: how binding is an acceptance of an offer? I definitely don't want to go back on my word but, if the worst (or best?) case scenario happens and I'm taken off the wait list and accepted into my first choice program, would it be academic suicide to attempt to accept the other offer after I've already accepted the first one?

Nope. You would need to request a release from the first one, but people do it and I'd think this school in particular should definitely let you given that they are acting against CGS rules anyway. You may lose some kind of deposit, but if it's worth it for the possibility of getting in to your first choice, it is a perfectly fair thing to do.

[sonicsustain]

How legally binding is that agreement? The program is a part of the April 15th agreement but when I mentioned that I only got the reply that it was "impossible" to grant me the extension... I know it sounds like bad news but it's the only offer I have...

The wording of the agreement is explicit and seems binding enough. Don't forget that it can affect their reputation with potential admits this and coming seasons if they are threatening withdrawals of offers if you don't meet an earlier dealine. To quote the agreement:

"Students are under no obligation to respond to offers of financial support prior to April 15; earlier deadlines for acceptance of such offers violate the intent of this Resolution."

You really shouldn't have to do this, but it looks like you will anyways; tell them that you are still very interested in their program, but you want to make the best choice. Tell them that if you choose their school, they should want it to happen for the best possible reasons. They signed the CGS, so you have until April 15th to accept or decline.

A quick question, though. Is it the Graduate Division offices telling you this or the department? Whichever it is, talk to the other and let them know what's up. If the dept.'s trying to force an early decision on your part, the Grad Division may not be aware of it and wouldn't like that they're enforcing a deadline that isn't April 15th, as agreed upon by CGS signers.

And visa versa, if the grad division's putting the pressure on, let the department know. They may not like that students are being badgered for decisions because it can affect the admit's view of the program.

That's my two cents. If both are pressuring you, read the CGS aloud to them over the phone and tell them that even though they aren't following the guidelines, you have the right to. If they try to renege on the admissions offer due to this, you probably wouldn't have gotten along well there anyways. I doubt it would go this far, though.

I hope you can straighten this out. They signed it, they have to honor it.

[Jack Cade]

My quick advice (not detracting from the great advice already posted):

I would play my cards closer to my vest with the pressuring department. You've asked for an extension because you have been waitlisted, they know that. They have refused and the are 'unethically' attempting to force you to make a decision by playing upon the basically insecure nature of your position.

Therefore, should you, prior to 4/15, but after the date they have required, get a better offer. Take it. Do not tell the pressuring department that you plan to do this. Let them learn from their mistake. If they try to say that your acceptance is a legal obligation, then you should note in your acceptance some language that states that you are accepting this offer with the full intention of honoring it. However you recognize the Grad Council's deadline as a superior authority and only after 15th will you completely cease to entertain other offers--which is the rule, although some still do.

I know people who have broken post 15th deadlines, like well into May, have heard tell of folks doing it in June, and they weren't vaporized by Academia--although most of these stories come from outside English and a few are a bit dated. So, you can do that, its just professionally risky, personally rude, and just bad academic karma.

At the early deadline I would make sure to cc your note to the gradschool and the department. You could also, have a conversation with whoever is pressuring you and say that you are troubled by the deadline, or possibly talk to a member of the faculty with whom you have some connection. They do know what it is they are trying to do.

So I guess you have sort of two paths: Forthright and above board or cagey and politically discrete. I think both are good policies and represent a personal choice that has more to do with character than relative efficacy.

You know, they don't want to lose you either. They chose you, like you, and want you to come.

You do have power here, probably more than you realize.

{Edit was to fix slop; I glanced through the post and cringed.}

[disjecta]

Gosh, not to go in a different direction, but: Have you contacted the schools where you are waitlisted to let them know you have a funded offer elsewhere, but that they are your first choice? I did that when I got into my MA program and got off the waitlist within two days of talking with them. Might be worth a shot :wink:

[waitingitout]

Thanks for all the great advice--this forum is helping me keep my sanity in all this craziness. Who knew waiting could be so exhausting? I accepted the offer on Friday (deciding that if I do hear good news from the wait list for other schools I have every right to back out of my acceptance) but strangely there has been no response by the prof who demanded the deadline of me--who, btw, is not the DGS. I'm going to have to (I'm beginning to hate this word) wait until Monday and if I don't hear anything by then, e-mail the prof again...

The schools I'm waitlisted for generally don't want to talk about what number I am on the waitlist... just that I'm "in a pile" that is waiting for funding...

[teaganc]

Thanks for all the great advice--this forum is helping me keep my sanity in all this craziness. Who knew waiting could be so exhausting? I accepted the offer on Friday (deciding that if I do hear good news from the wait list for other schools I have every right to back out of my acceptance) but strangely there has been no response by the prof who demanded the deadline of me--who, btw, is not the DGS. I'm going to have to (I'm beginning to hate this word) wait until Monday and if I don't hear anything by then, e-mail the prof again...

The schools I'm waitlisted for generally don't want to talk about what number I am on the waitlist... just that I'm "in a pile" that is waiting for funding...

Wait, you are staying on three waitlists even though you've already accepted a funded offer? I understand staying on the wait list at your top choice, if you were willing to back out of this acceptance to take that school instead, but what about the other two schools? I know there has been some drama regarding only making a decision based on what you want and not what affects other people, and I respect that position, but still. If you can in any way narrow down the list of offers you are keeping after you've already accepted one, I would really suggest you try, for the sake of academic karma if nothing else.

Note: To my knowledge, neither myself nor anyone I know is waiting for any of the spots this person may be freeing up; I don't even know the schools in question, so on and so forth.

[Jack Cade]

I have absolutely never thought about that.

The ethics of staying on a waitlist even though you know you will not accept the offer.

Hmm, should we tell programs that we know we are waitlisted to, thanks for the almost offer but no thanks?

Or are we starting to push polite conscientiousness to the extreme?

No critique intended just a thought.

As for keeping sanity, good luck!

[teaganc]

I have absolutely never thought about that.

The ethics of staying on a waitlist even though you know you will not accept the offer.

Hmm, should we tell programs that we know we are waitlisted to, thanks for the almost offer but no thanks?

Or are we starting to push polite consciousness to the extreme?

No critique intended just a thought.

As for keeping sanity, good luck!

I'm going to answer this assuming you weren't being facetious (since tone + internet = impossible to interpret):

My wait listed offer asked me to please let them know ASAP if I want to be taken off the list, so they know how many people might actually accept an offer, who the next person in line is, and so on. Should an accepted student decline, they will want to extend an offer as quickly as possible, and waiting on one or more people to be given the offer who wouldn't accept it anyway, and waiting for them to then decline, delays the whole process. I think that most other schools ask you to do the same. I don't think it's pushing polite consciousness at all to notify a school that you no longer wish to be on their wait list, but simple courtesy to both the school and the people on the wait list.

[Jack Cade]

No I was being sincere, a touch silly, its 2:15am where I am.

I think I agree with you. However, it seems the rare school that actually expects such responsible waitlist behavior.

Hmm, good. I think that is settled.

I think it is more than average conscientiousness (farg did I misspell that above? darn spell check), but not ridiculous.

[waitingitout]

I don't know... I don't think it's not conscientious or detrimental to my "academic karma" to want what I paid my $50/$75 application fee for... a yes or a no. I haven't ruled anything out at this point.

[teaganc]

I don't know... I don't think it's not conscientious or detrimental to my "academic karma" to want what I paid my $50/$75 application fee for... a yes or a no. I haven't ruled anything out at this point.

Well, I respectfully disagree. You've gotten an answer for your application fees: three schools would be happy to have you in their program, but not as happy as the people they straight-out accepted, and one school wants you more than their waitlisted people. That's an answer. Maybe it's not an accepted or rejected, but that decision is coming from the people who were offered spots, not from the committee, and you didn't pay those people any application fees. They don't owe you any more than you owe other people on your waitlists. Maybe you decide that what you owe them (and what they owe you) is nothing, and that's your decision. Personally, I think we all owe each other, as academics, courtesy. My definition of courtesy is not taking a place in a program or on a wait list when I am certain that I do not want that space, or agreeing to matriculate and then subsequently withdrawing for anything but an emergency. I think that's bad karma. Then again, I wouldn't take a space in a program that I liked so little that I was only willing to accept their offer if I also stayed on three other waitlists, since that would seem to be a sign that I shouldn't be in that program at all.

[engguy]

My definition of courtesy is not taking a place in a program or on a wait list when I am certain that I do not want that space, or agreeing to matriculate and then subsequently withdrawing for anything but an emergency. I think that's bad karma. Then again, I wouldn't take a space in a program that I liked so little that I was only willing to accept their offer if I also stayed on three other waitlists, since that would seem to be a sign that I shouldn't be in that program at all.

Uh, lighten up, Francis. I think you're going a bit overboard here. The original post described a totally unethical instance of pressure from a program to make a decision -- the bad karma's all on them if this blows up in their face. Lots of people wait till April 15 to make their decisions, especially if they're sweating out waitlists and haven't yet heard about funding. I certainly don't think it's at all out of bounds for this person to wait to hear what he or she needs to hear before making a decision. Especially if you're on a waitlist, for pete's sake; odds are there are few or no people beneath you anyway. Odds are you may not get in at all. It's a waitlist; you wait. You're not hurting anyone.

To the OP: well, you've already accepted, but you should definitely follow up with the DGS and inform him or her of the pressure this prof's put on you. They absolutely cannot do this if they're members of the agreement. I wouldn't even think you'd need a written release for pulling out -- a strongly worded e-mail stating all the facts should suffice. If they are part of the agreement, you can refer them to that if / when you decide to pull out. Nothing is binding till then. Good luck with this...