LOR Writer Question

[Dr. Old Bill]

I was just reading a book about grad school applications, and came across a few sentences that suggested that the most well-received LORs are by "titled" professors (i.e., John Smith, the Joseph Blough Professor of Humanities), while associate and assistant professors are given far less weight. Even more concerning, it mentioned that one should not use professors who are emeritus, or no longer work at the same college or university where you received your degree. I'm honestly not sure how much stock I should put in this. Two of my primary LORs just retired after this past semester, including my undergraduate advisor. Additionally, another LOR was a visiting professor who has just moved off to a different college. So...should I be concerned? They'll all have good things to say about me, of course, and the two professors who just retired did so after working at my college for 41 years apiece...but should I be on the lookout to find yet another LOR writer or two as a buffer?

 

[Guest Gnome Chomsky]

I wouldn't sacrifice quality of a LOR because of something you read. Get letters from people who you feel will write the best ones. I got one letter from a professor who just retired that year and my other LOR writers were saying how that will look good since he's been around the block. Their words were something like, "Dr. X has been around for 45+ years, so if he says you're one of the best he's ever had, that says more than if some new professor said it." I think all that really matters is if they have "PhD" at the end of their name. 

[fuzzylogician]

The best LOR you can get is from people who know you well. That's the first and most important thing. Now, it's better to get a LOR from someone who is better known than someone obscure because adcoms tend to put more weight on someone's word if they know them and believe they can trust them. People become known to others in their field in different ways. There is of course a correlation with being experienced and active in the field, but that doesn't mean that the best letters necessarily have to come from famous full professors. For example, a school might trust a LOR from a new assistant professor if that person was a student/post doc at the school so people know them there. Some new assistant profs are up and coming and actually get around quite a lot. Assistant profs who are in their 3-5th year on the job strive to be visible in order to help their tenure case, so they may be traveling and presenting quite a bit, and also publishing at a high rate. Newly minted Associate profs who just went through tenure probably just had a round of publications out and have been traveling in the recent past, so people will tend to remember them. On the other hand, some full professors stop being as productive once they take on administrative roles at their universities and may not carry as much weight as previously. Someone who is just retired might still be very active, or might have been really out of it for a long time; you can't know just by the person's official status. 

 

Unless you are in a situation where you have several people to choose you who know you equally well and you have the luxury of examining their records, I think the more important question in deciding who to ask for letters is what they'll write and how strong it'll be. A strong detailed letter is better than a short vague one, even if the signature on the vague one comes from someone famous.

[Dr. Old Bill]

That's some great advice from both of you -- thanks a lot!

 

I have five potential LOR writers to choose from at this point. One is a full professor who got her Ph.D. from Harvard, knows my writing extremely well, and has already offered to essentially go the extra mile and personalize her LORs for any of the programs she is familiar with (and she has spoken at Yale, is extremely familiar with Harvard etc.). So I'll be leaning on her for LORs for all the places I apply -- probably about a dozen at this point.

 

Two other professors, as mentioned, just retired this year, one of which was my advisor, whom I had two writing-heavy courses with over the past year (Shakespeare's Tragedies, and Milton). My only minor concern is that he's quite cynical and has a strong disdain for academia. He has assured me that his LOR will be excellent, however, and I'm going to take him at his word. The other retired professor has similar interests to my own, and is a delightful man all around...and also very familiar with my writing.

 

The other two professors are a bit more questionable. One is quite young -- most likely younger than me, in fact -- and taught me in a course that was technically not in my major. Having said that, the course was "The Birth of the Novel in Antiquity," which clearly has a strong tie to my major. He also happens to have some personal connections with at least one place I will be applying. The final professor and I have become good friends, and she taught me in a couple of courses at a Community College. The problem is that she does not currently have her doctorate (though is working on an online Ph.D. program). She will have nothing but excellent things to say about my writing (I was top of the class in both courses I took with her), but I may reserve her LORs for programs that allow 4-5 letters, or for the one or two "safety" schools I plan on applying to.

 

I guess it's more of an art than a science, tryig to decide which LORs to use for where. There's one other professor I could probably ask if need be, but I'm hoping that I'm effectively covered with the above.

[TakeruK]

I agree with everything Fuzzy and Gnome had to say about quality of letter over reputation of writer (although both are important factors!). 

 

In my opinion, out of the 5 letter writers you mention, the first 3 are clearly the better choices. The last one is definitely not a good choice because she does not have a PhD yet -- this is still sometimes a good letter but since you have so many other better choices, I would not choose her as a LOR writer. 

 

I am not sure if the 4th person is as good as the first 3 either. In my field, research supervision is the best type of letter and "did well in class" type letter are only better than no letters at all. If you didn't have as many opportunities to do research, I'd go with the 3 professors that know your writing and your work the best, which sounds like the first 3 on this list, by a large margin! 

[fuzzylogician]

I agree with TakeruK -- the Harvard alum sounds like a great choice; I think it's a no-brainer that you should have your advisor write you a letter, that's the usual expectation and people might wonder if you don't have such a letter. The other retired prof sounds like a better choice than the remaining two. In particular, I would not want to choose someone who doesn't have her PhD yet over someone who does because a letter from someone from someone without a PhD will naturally carry less weight--such a person couldn't really talk about your ability to complete a PhD program since they have no experience doing it themselves nor have they probably had any advisees of their own, and they will not really have the experience to be able to compare you to other candidates. The prof from outside your major sounds like a good option for a 4th LOR in case some schools allow you to submit an extra letter, and I would consider having them use their personal connections at the school you mention, in case they agree to do so. A good word or personal endorsement of your application can go a long way and is independent of actually obtaining a letter from the person.

[bhr]

While I agree that, in this case, a PhD may look better than an MA/MFA, that isn't always the case. I know, in my case, that I used a prof with an MFA in creative writing for my rhet/comp applications. I had him as a professor multiple times, he like me (quite a bit) and had recently earned tenure.

 

Asking for LoRs in the middle of senior year, when I still hadn't taken a bulk of my departmental classes, was a challenge. I wound up only using one professor who was an r/c specialist (though the MFA taught both of the journalism classes that I needed for my concentration).

 

I think the most important thing, more than their reputation, or title, or anything, is how they can speak to your work and dedication as a student. I was fortunate that my writers all sent me copies of their letters after my first submission, and I was frankly shocked by how kind and complimentary they were.

 

Unless the professor has a connection to the school, is a "big name", or (in my case with one school) has someone at the school who hates them, I don't think that the name and title on the LoR means all that much. Yes, it was great that one of my profs was able to put 10 titles/jobs after his name, and that may have impressed someone, but the content was far more important.

 

 

***One bit of feedback that I received from schools was that getting my WPA to write a separate letter was a huge boon to my chances. I didn't ask her for a rec for grad school, she had never seen me as a student, but I asked her to write something for the TA/GA positions I was applying for, as she had seen me work with FYC classes as part of a practicum. WPAs and Writing Center directors carry some weight, since that's how you are going to be funding your program.

[mikers86]

Don't be afraid to ask professors to contact faculty they know at institutions on your list and possibly look out for your application. Just because they don't write for you doesn't mean they can't be of service. Most of my professors did this for me without asking. They have connections in the field and any advantage is useful in this process.

[rising_star]

While I agree that, in this case, a PhD may look better than an MA/MFA, that isn't always the case. I know, in my case, that I used a prof with an MFA in creative writing for my rhet/comp applications. I had him as a professor multiple times, he like me (quite a bit) and had recently earned tenure.

 

MFAs and PhDs are both terminal degrees. A MA is not a terminal degree. You definitely don't want someone without a terminal degree writing your recommendations for graduate school. Someone with a PhD is typically considered better because their experience in a research-oriented degree program gives them the experience needed to evaluate your ability to successfully complete that program. But, especially in English, there's no huge problem with having someone with a MFA write a letter of recommendation but you wouldn't want all of your rec letters from MFAs unless you're applying to a MFA program.