Will Studying Abroad Make or Break my Comp & Rhet Application? Not Sure If I Want to Go...

[klader]

Hi Everyone,

 

First of all, I know that April 15th was a big day for many of you, and I hope it went well!

 

So, I've posted on this forum a few times before about graduate school in the rhetoric and comp field, and I've decided that I most definitely want to apply (I'm finishing up my junior year this week and will start working on applications, my personal statement, and my CV this summer!)

 

Since I'm a Writing and Rhetoric and French duo major, I've been grappling profusely with the concept of studying abroad. I did a month week program last summer in Quebec, and I have the opportunity to study abroad in France this upcoming fall semester. This would be great for my French and my overall being, but I have a few concerns...

 

First and foremost, I would be applying to graduate programs while abroad, which will be extra stressful and quite difficult when everything around me is in French. I also won't have in-person access to my professors to receive help on my personal statement and CV, and while I know I can email them and even Skype them, it just won't be the same.

 

Second, I very well might attend graduate school out of state (depending on where I get in), so I don't know if I want to leave for four months and burn up a bunch of money when I'll only be leaving again six months after my return. Also, I just straight up don't know if I can do it, and though everyone tells me I need to push myself and get myself out there, I think I would just rather be here (although I DO really want to go to France. It's such a complicated thing).

 

So, to all the people who are way more experienced than myself concerning the ins and outs and applying to rhet and comp grad schools, would studying abroad for a full semester make or break my application? I already did a summer program and am already at an advanced level of French, so I know I'll be able to pass any language requirements. I don't want to necessarily go to France solely to make my application stronger, but if not going would definitely bring it down a notch, I really need to think this through.

 

For reference, I go to an okay institution over all, but its undergraduate writing and rhetoric program is (apparently) pretty top rate and I've worked with some well-known professors. I've also been working at our writing center for 2 years, have attended and presented at 3 conferences (one international at IWCA), have been a TA for two semesters, am possibly getting an internship that deals with editing a writing center journal, won a writing award and a few French awards, have a compelling story with which to craft my personal statement, and have a 3.9+ GPA. I haven't taken the GRE yet, but I will over the summer.

 

I know applying to grad school can be pretty cut throat since more and more people want to do it and there are still only so many available spots, so I'd really appreciate some advice and insight on what I should do. I know without a doubt that my heart lies in at least getting an MA in writing and rhetoric, and I know that my life will be geared more toward writing than it will be toward French. I just want to have the opportunity to make that happen.

 

Thanks so much in advance!

Edited April 22, 2015 by klader

[ToldAgain]

Hi klader!

 

I don't think your study-abroad program will make or break your application. Lots of students study abroad, and lots of them get into grad school. That's what undergrad is all about, right? Experiences. It's great to have command of a second language, and nobody should fault you for going to France if you have the opportunity. Why would they?

 

Your undergrad record sounds very strong, so it will be all about your SOP and WS. Those are what will make or break your application.

 

For what it's worth: I didn't have any face-to-face contact with my letter writers, but we emailed about once every two weeks to give updates and exchange drafts. I don't think this was a drawback at all.

 

I was also in a different-speaking country practicing my second language -- not when I was applying, but when I was getting acceptances and rejections and having a lot of very stressful conversations with my letter writers and representatives from schools. I think it was actually better to be in this great place and have a lot to distract me from the waiting. So there's that.

 

In my opinion, you can't go wrong. Good luck!

[klader]

Thank you very much!

So, on the flip side of that coin, not going wouldn't make me look worse? It would just reflect the lack of one particular experience?

I suppose I really am leaning toward not going, and someone had told me that going would strengthen my application and that it would benefit me tremendously. I just don't know if I can handle it emotionally, and I'd rather be in a good emotional state when applying to graduate school.

[empress-marmot]

Hello! In my experience, study abroad was the thing about my application most people mentioned when I went on a campus visit. (1 comment on SOP, 1 comment on writing sample, 4 comments on study abroad) However, it definitely wasn't the strongest thing on my application. Not doing it won't sink your chances.

 

First and foremost, I would be applying to graduate programs while abroad, which will be extra stressful and quite difficult when everything around me is in French. I also won't have in-person access to my professors to receive help on my personal statement and CV, and while I know I can email them and even Skype them, it just won't be the same.

 

Yup. It was impossible for me, but I was really homesick abroad. All I wanted to do overseas was get lost in the city and feel sorry for myself, and it ended up delaying graduate study for a year.  I'd recommend having your application materials ready by the time you fly out. 

 

Second, I very well might attend graduate school out of state (depending on where I get in), so I don't know if I want to leave for four months and burn up a bunch of money when I'll only be leaving again six months after my return. Also, I just straight up don't know if I can do it, and though everyone tells me I need to push myself and get myself out there, I think I would just rather be here (although I DO really want to go to France. It's such a complicated thing).

 

Well, I would never advise anyone to do something fiscally irresponsible. If you have the money, though, go. Personally, I didn't like Europe, but I didn't know that till I went. Even though I was lonely and miserable, I learned a lot about a new country, new culture, new language, different styles of education--even how to eat on $15 a week. 
 

I suppose I really am leaning toward not going, and someone had told me that going would strengthen my application and that it would benefit me tremendously. I just don't know if I can handle it emotionally, and I'd rather be in a good emotional state when applying to graduate school.

 

This feels like a red flag. I've sometimes wondered if I went to Europe because I was running away from some stuff in my personal life, so perhaps I should be blaming those miserable months on myself.

 

In summary: If you're truly worried about finances or your emotional state, consider holding off. However, if you have the finances and all your application documents ready to go, studying abroad is an awesome opportunity. 

[ToldAgain]

So, on the flip side of that coin, not going wouldn't make me look worse? It would just reflect the lack of one particular experience?

 

I don't think it would make you look worse, not going. It does reduces your pool of interesting things to distinguish yourself from the other really well-qualified applicants, but you can do this in other ways. Some people stand out by being "that girl who studied in Istanbul," others are "that girl who presented at major conference X," or whatever.

 

I didn't study abroad, and I got in to one of my top-choice programs this year. My friend studied abroad and used it in her SOP and didn't have great options. We had similar stats and, in fact, hers were better than mine.

 

Whatever factors contributed to the outcome of our seasons, my guess is that study abroad experience had nothing whatsoever to do with it in either case. If you've got it, use it. If you don't, I wouldn't worry.

[gsc]

I don't think it would make you look worse, not going. It does reduces your pool of interesting things to distinguish yourself from the other really well-qualified applicants, but you can do this in other ways. Some people stand out by being "that girl who studied in Istanbul," others are "that girl who presented at major conference X," or whatever.

 

 

OP, hi! I'm in history but I studied abroad twice as an undergrad. The first time was your bog-standard "do a semester in a foreign country," and I went to Ireland to do British history. I do feel that I got a good foundation in British history and I mentioned it in my SOP to make it clear (if it wasn't clear on my transcript) that I had some training in British history. The second time I went to England to do research on my honors thesis. I was much more focused this time; I was going to these archives and doing this research, etc. This I did not mention in my SOP, although I think one of my recommenders mentioned it, because I decided (and I'm not sure why...?) that it would be clear enough from my footnotes where I'd gone to get source materials.

 

I do think that study abroad helped my application but not specifically because I could check off the "study abroad" checkbox. When I went the first time, I made some friends with some history grad students who (1) encouraged me to present at their grad student conference, and (2) talked with me about doing graduate school abroad, which I had been considering. So that was helpful for my own sort of professional development. The second time was helpful because I got better sources than what I could have gotten in the US (specifically, I could use government documents as well as a wider variety of medical reports) and that did lead me to writing a better thesis. I really do think that my thesis is what got me into grad school, so in a sense study abroad did help my application tremendously, but not specifically because I went abroad, if that makes sense. (Nobody mentioned that I studied abroad, except for my future advisor who asked me to clarify if I'd gotten an undergraduate fellowship to go abroad, which I had. But everybody mentioned my thesis.) 

 

So I don't think it's so much about the actual act of studying abroad but the opportunities that you might get as a result of it. But even those you can't really gauge ahead of time. I really do believe in study abroad, but I think it only works if you want to do it for you, for your own personal and scholarly development. I mean, I went to Ireland for a semester because I really wanted to go and learn about Britain and Ireland, not because I thought I'd meet history grad students and present at a conference. That was a fun side benefit. 

 

Also, applying to graduate school is stressful. Study abroad, even if you like it, is stressful. I think it's good to know what you can and can't handle emotionally; I didn't, and I do regret that.

Edited April 22, 2015 by girlscoutcookies

[klader]

Thank you all so much for the replies and the anecdotes! It truly does help me a lot.

I think studying abroad can definitely make for a an interesting experience, but just from the examples on here, I noticed a few things. girlscoutcookies, your study abroad trips were related to your field, you went before you applied, and you used it for your thesis. As for me, I'm not writing a thesis type piece until next winter AFTER I apply to programs, and my study abroad won't directly contribute to my area. Since I'd be applying to grad programs right in the midst of my semester abroad, I also don't know if I'd be able to put it into my personal statement/SOP since I wouldn't have finished the experience.

I guess I'm worried that I'd be doing the study abroad too late and that it's just messing up everything. Has anyone else studied abroad during the fall semester of their senior year? It's just a really inconvenient time and I wished I had studied abroad earlier.

[gsc]

I guess I'm worried that I'd be doing the study abroad too late and that it's just messing up everything. Has anyone else studied abroad during the fall semester of their senior year? It's just a really inconvenient time and I wished I had studied abroad earlier.

 

Honestly, I don't see why. Perhaps I wasn't being quite clear enough in my original post, but I do agree with ToldAgain that study abroad is something that if you have, cool, if not, then whatever. 

 

I'm in history and I do the history of a foreign country (Britain), so for me, study abroad was important - first because I wanted to and also because I was signing up to do research in that country. You're in rhet/comp, which doesn't have that foreign research component (as far as I know...?), and you've already done one study abroad trip to help with your French language skills. And as you mention, it's fall semester of senior year, and any benefits you would get won't be visible on your application. So would going abroad really net you any opportunities other than being able to check off the "I studied abroad" box? 

 

I guess I don't feel that any admissions committee is going to take your application and chuck it because you didn't study abroad. I also don't think that, given two identical applicants, they would pick the person who studied abroad because they studied abroad. If I could have gotten the same sources for my thesis and written the same paper without going abroad, I think I would have (1) saved a lot of money, and (2) still gotten into the same programs. Also, it looks like you have a lot of other things in your favor, like experience and rec letters and language requirements, which would probably hold more sway -- people mentioned my thesis not because I studied abroad but because it was well-written and showed I could do history, you know? That was more important than the fact that I went abroad to do it. Study abroad is a cool thing to do, but if you're leaning towards not going, then don't go. 

[empress-marmot]

I guess I'm worried that I'd be doing the study abroad too late and that it's just messing up everything. Has anyone else studied abroad during the fall semester of their senior year? It's just a really inconvenient time and I wished I had studied abroad earlier.

 

It is an inconvenient time, but I did it because I wanted to be absolutely sure I would have no issues with graduation. Whether or not you've decided to go yet, you should look at all the paperwork you'll need to complete before/during your study abroad. I had to apply to the foreign university, apply for a residence permit, apply for housing, apply (and reapply) for classes overseas. At home, I had to petition Financial Aid to let me keep my scholarships, apply for graduation, and reapply for housing. That sort of thing can take a really long time, and you don't need (more) stress from trying to rush it all through. 

 

Also: studying abroad creates a hole in your CV, because all those activities, work experience, etc. stop for an entire semester. I compensated for that by doing some volunteer student teaching in the country's high schools. To make up for the lost research/conference activities, I made sure everyone reading the CV knew I'd spent that semester abroad. I guess it worked? 

[silenus_thescribe]

Also: studying abroad creates a hole in your CV, because all those activities, work experience, etc. stop for an entire semester. I compensated for that by doing some volunteer student teaching in the country's high schools. To make up for the lost research/conference activities, I made sure everyone reading the CV knew I'd spent that semester abroad. I guess it worked? 

 

I don't know I'd say it creates a "hole" in your CV; in fact, I think it can sometimes be a good supplement to a CV, one that gives benefits you might not otherwise have gotten. I came from a little-to-barely-known undergrad background, and for that reason I think my semester in Oxford likely showed ad coms that I was able to hold my own in an internationally recognized research university. Moreover, since language requirements are often overlooked by undergrads applying for grad school, studying abroad in a place where you'll be immersed in a language that will be useful to your graduate studies would be a major plus, even more so than had you taken a language course during that time. Yes, you might lose out on some conference/research time, but especially in the case of learning a language, that's a trade-off that is pretty sensible.

 

Simply put: if you can demonstrably show that the study abroad period directly ties into your graduate studies, I think it's a big bonus on a CV, rather than a hole.

[goliad]

I actually took two years off after graduating from my undergrad to go and teach English in Japan, so that's where I was when I was applying to all my programs. There were definitely a few disadvantages (especially when one of my LOR writers stopped answering my emails days before the deadline and I had to get my mom to call the department...), but all in all it was very doable. I was successful with most of my applications, and some of the advisors at universities I was admitted to specifically mentioned my time abroad when I spoke with them later.

That said, living abroad is an incredible commitment--an amazing experience, but definitely not something to be taken lightly. I would definitely recommend it as a chance to broaden your worldview and grow as a person, but not as something to boost your application. From the sound of things, it seems like you'll have a strong application anyway.

[circlewave]

Would it give you unique research experience related to grad interests? Or is it related to your area of study in a special way (eg. looking through a special archive that's at some foreign university library)? If so, then it could be a big bonus for you.

 

If not, that's fine. I imagine successful applicants both choose to go/not go abroad. I don't think it could possibly hurt you unless your grades tank during that semester.

Edited April 23, 2015 by circlewave

[rhetoricus aesalon]

It will not make or break your application. In fact, I'd wager (from an admissions standpoint) no one will care. It might be a nice way to network after you are admitted by talking about your experience once you are on campus visits or through email, but since your travel will have nothing to do with your interests, it will count for little to nothing in your application. Especially if you decide to apply straight to PhD programs.

Edited April 26, 2015 by Chadillac

[xolo]

I might be totally missing the point, but what does going overseas have to do with "making or breaking" an application? Seems to me it can only strengthen it, especially as you have a French major also, albeit I do not know anything about Comp Rhet programs. Are you abandoning your French going forward in grad school? 

[heja0805]

It will not make or break your application. In fact, I'd wager (from an admissions standpoint) no one will care. It might be a nice way to network after you are admitted by talking about your experience once you are on campus visits or through email, but since your travel will have nothing to do with your interests, it will count for little to nothing in your application. Especially if you decide to apply straight to PhD programs.

 

 

I might be totally missing the point, but what does going overseas have to do with "making or breaking" an application? Seems to me it can only strengthen it, especially as you have a French major also, albeit I do not know anything about Comp Rhet programs. Are you abandoning your French going forward in grad school? 

 

I agree that going abroad again might be beneficial for you personally, but like Chadillac has stated, the way that experience connects with (or doesn't) your interests and SOP will determine the value of that experience to admission committees. So like, if you framed your SOP around multilingual or second language writing, transnational rhetorics, language policies/politics, language identities, etc., then I would say that your study abroad experience would illustrate that very nicely. But you already have language experience, and you already have study abroad experience, too. 

 

This might not be super useful because I know that they're not all universal terms, but if you'd like to see how areas of interest in the field are being framed, taking a look at the CFP for the annual CCCCs is useful. Taking a look at this past year's program (also available online) is another way to familiarize yourself with current research in the field and how yours might fit (and ideally, expand on it for the better). 

 

To me, it seems like someone has provided you with...for lack of better words, crappy advice about this "making" or "breaking" your academic profile. You already have excellent experience, far more than I ever did as an undergraduate, and you should own that. In your application package, find ways of making each and every little thing have value.