CGS-M 2015-1016

[TKYU]

Even though the deadline is less than a month away, I thought this thread might be useful for those applying for CGS-M!

Anyone else applying for CGS-M? How are the applications coming along?  

[Jimtastic]

I posted this in another thread but I figure I might as well try here too. I'm an undergrad who is thinking about applying for CGS-M funding and I'm a bit confused by how it's structured.

Given that I've only really begun to contact profs and am in discussion with a few, how the heck does the research proposal work? If I'm not sure yet of where I want to go to grad school (and the field will vary a bit), how can I used one proposed project to apply to five different graduate programs? Until now I was under the assumption that you should first identify a professor you want to work with then craft an application based on their proposed research projects.

If someone could shed some light on this it would be greatly appreciated!

[TakeruK]

57 minutes ago, Jimtastic said:

I posted this in another thread but I figure I might as well try here too. I'm an undergrad who is thinking about applying for CGS-M funding and I'm a bit confused by how it's structured.

Given that I've only really begun to contact profs and am in discussion with a few, how the heck does the research proposal work? If I'm not sure yet of where I want to go to grad school (and the field will vary a bit), how can I used one proposed project to apply to five different graduate programs? Until now I was under the assumption that you should first identify a professor you want to work with then craft an application based on their proposed research projects.

If someone could shed some light on this it would be greatly appreciated!

Your CGS-M research proposal is not binding. Especially if you are applying as an undergraduate, there is no expectation that you will carry out the research in your CGS-M proposal during the tenure of your CGS-M award. So, it would be a good idea to structure your CGS-M proposal around one of the five institutions you're applying to with the CGS-M, but you don't even have to do that. My CGS-M proposal was very different from what I actually did in my Masters degree. My CGS-D proposal is also very different than what I am doing in my PhD (but for the Doctorate awards, you must file a new description of project if you change supervisors/projects).

[Jimtastic]

On 2015-11-11, 6:10:06, TakeruK said:

Your CGS-M research proposal is not binding. Especially if you are applying as an undergraduate, there is no expectation that you will carry out the research in your CGS-M proposal during the tenure of your CGS-M award. So, it would be a good idea to structure your CGS-M proposal around one of the five institutions you're applying to with the CGS-M, but you don't even have to do that. My CGS-M proposal was very different from what I actually did in my Masters degree. My CGS-D proposal is also very different than what I am doing in my PhD (but for the Doctorate awards, you must file a new description of project if you change supervisors/projects).

That's the feeling I got, thank you! I talked to my undergrad supervisor and he mentioned that the fact that I can send it to 5 different schools is new this year. I'm guessing that they mainly focus on your ability to write a research proposal as opposed to the science behind it?

[TakeruK]

6 hours ago, Jimtastic said:

That's the feeling I got, thank you! I talked to my undergrad supervisor and he mentioned that the fact that I can send it to 5 different schools is new this year. I'm guessing that they mainly focus on your ability to write a research proposal as opposed to the science behind it?

Exactly. Well, the science is important too, but they are not focussed on whether or not you complete said project, but instead on your ability to identify a good research problem, demonstrate your preparedness and that you will be able to potentially complete it.

Also, yeah, the CGS-M had almost one major change every year starting in 2012, so I guess they are still trying to figure out what the new standard will be.

[Oshawott]

Actually, the 5-school limit thing has been standard for a few years now. Its kind of dumb considering that it goes to the university's committee, so why are students being limited to 5 schools?

The only real change I noticed is that you are no longer required (as in, unable to) to identify your referee's first name or state their relationship towards you.

[Jimtastic]

Weird huh, I heard that previously you applied directly to NSERC and with an award, you could potentially bring it anywhere (making you very appealing for PIs to take on). I guess that's not the case when now it's being judged by committees at individual universities. Apparently it will be more competitive as well at universities with a smaller share of the NSERC funding pie since they're allocated based on that?

[TakeruK]

1 hour ago, Jimtastic said:

Weird huh, I heard that previously you applied directly to NSERC and with an award, you could potentially bring it anywhere (making you very appealing for PIs to take on). I guess that's not the case when now it's being judged by committees at individual universities. Apparently it will be more competitive as well at universities with a smaller share of the NSERC funding pie since they're allocated based on that?

It used to be this way. I had it administered this way and I felt it was much more advantageous for the student. I could use my CGS-M as leverage when making decisions.

However, I can see how it could hurt schools. In particular, the best students (the ones who get the CGS-M) are going to want to go to the best schools. So, the allocation of federal dollars would end up being disproportionately heavy on the schools that probably already have lots of other funding. Also, there used to be a rule that supervisors with NSERC grants can't use their NSERC grants to pay grad students with NSERC CGS-M, PGS-D, or CGS-D awards. This meant even more inefficiencies in federal allocation of money.

Now, each university has an allocation that they can provide to their top students. I don't think it will necessarily be more competitive at smaller schools, because the top students will still be vying for positions at the top schools. I think this change will help schools outside of the top 3 (in my field: UBC, McGill, Toronto, in no particular order) gain quality students and catch up. This is good for Canada and students overall as we will have more places producing great research. 

[Jimtastic]

Oh boy well I just looked at the NSERC CGS-M allocations per university, interesting stuff. Here if anyone's interested.

Anyone have advice on writing/structuring the proposal?

 

 

[TKYU]

6 hours ago, Jimtastic said:

Oh boy well I just looked at the NSERC CGS-M allocations per university, interesting stuff. Here if anyone's interested.

Anyone have advice on writing/structuring the proposal?

 

 

That's a great question! I'm wondering the same. Doesn't seem like the website offers much guidance regarding the structure of the proposal. Hmm...

[TakeruK]

6 hours ago, Jimtastic said:

Oh boy well I just looked at the NSERC CGS-M allocations per university, interesting stuff. Here if anyone's interested.

 

Just remember---universities have no incentive to not award their whole allocation. And top students will get offers from multiple places. So if the numbers look discouraging, e.g. your favourite school only has 10 awards, remember that it's not that you have to be the top 10 students who apply, but instead, the top 10 students who will take the offer :)

[time_consume_me]

On the Canadian Commons CV, where would my membership to my department's student union academic committee be best situated?  Can't seem to find a good spot for it ...

Hope everyone is getting their apps together!

[TakeruK]

11 hours ago, hojoojoh said:

On the Canadian Commons CV, where would my membership to my department's student union academic committee be best situated?  Can't seem to find a good spot for it ...

Hope everyone is getting their apps together!

I think "Memberships" is the best place for this, based on these descriptions of the CCV sections: http://www.nserc-crsng.gc.ca/ResearchPortal-PortailDeRecherche/Instructions-Instructions/ccv-cvc_eng.asp

By the way, it looks like this Canadian Commons CV thing is some very generalized thing that is meant for people at all stages (from students to professors!) to fill out, so don't be intimidated by the sections you are not going to have content for. 

[time_consume_me]

6 hours ago, TakeruK said:

I think "Memberships" is the best place for this, based on these descriptions of the CCV sections: http://www.nserc-crsng.gc.ca/ResearchPortal-PortailDeRecherche/Instructions-Instructions/ccv-cvc_eng.asp

By the way, it looks like this Canadian Commons CV thing is some very generalized thing that is meant for people at all stages (from students to professors!) to fill out, so don't be intimidated by the sections you are not going to have content for. 

I think you're right about the memberships section.  Thanks.

We are likely to have huge sections left unfilled - but don't worry, they don't appear blank on your finalised CV.  (The sections just don't appear at all!)

 

Good luck

[TakeruK]

7 minutes ago, hojoojoh said:

I think you're right about the memberships section.  Thanks.

We are likely to have huge sections left unfilled - but don't worry, they don't appear blank on your finalised CV.  (The sections just don't appear at all!)

 

Good luck

Cool. The CCV sounds like a good concept. When I applied, there was no CCV but instead, a very confusing documents with very similar sections to the CCV and then instructions to number these sections ourselves, but we still had to skip sections if we had no content. So, I think this document, for me, went Section 1, 5, 9 etc. and was super confusing and made me paranoid I was missing sections. Also, they had really complicated formatting requests, which seems to be taken care of by the CCV form. 

Maybe NSERC/SSHRC/CIHR got tired of students screwing up the standardized formatting and went with an automated procedure  lol

[Jimtastic]

Given how much I love complaining about the CCV right now, I can't imagine what it would have been like for you without it haha

[Jimtastic]

Well, it's submitted now. Nothing left to do but forget about it until April!

[doefficient]

For the CCV, where did you guys put your volunteer research experience (i.e. your RA experiences in labs where you weren't paid)?

[Oshawott]

On 2015-11-27, 4:39:10, doefficient said:

For the CCV, where did you guys put your volunteer research experience (i.e. your RA experiences in labs where you weren't paid)?

A bit late, but I put it under "Academic Employment". I showed it to my supervisor and she had no issue. From an overview of what the CCV document will look like it would seem that "Community and Volunteer" activities would be best, but then it says this for the "more info" button:

Services contributed, unpaid, on behalf of one’s locality, social, religious, occupational, or other group sharing common characteristics or interests, but not directly related to the person's research activities

Given that last part, we can't put our research experience there. The most relevant area is still "Academic Work Experience" even though it is under "Employment"

[TakeruK]

On 11/27/2015, 11:39:10, doefficient said:

For the CCV, where did you guys put your volunteer research experience (i.e. your RA experiences in labs where you weren't paid)?

I agree that you should put it under academic work experience. You can describe your position as "Undergraduate Volunteer Researcher" if you feel the need to distinguish the fact that you were not paid.

[time_consume_me]

Last 24 hours - how are they coming?

[smallaxe]

Deadline has been extended 24 hours - check portal!

[TKYU]

On 11/30/2015, 4:08:55, hojoojoh said:

Last 24 hours - how are they coming?

Just submitted my application a couple days ago. This is my first time applying for the CGS-M so I don't really know what I'm doing to be honest LOL

[Jimtastic]

15 hours ago, TKYU said:

Just submitted my application a couple days ago. This is my first time applying for the CGS-M so I don't really know what I'm doing to be honest LOL

Feeling the same way, applying as an undergrad and hearing other grad students talk about how you need a 4.0 and a publication to get it is pretty discouraging though.

Plus how late we hear about results (April? Whyyyy??) makes it awkward for grad program applications.

[TKYU]

11 hours ago, Jimtastic said:

Feeling the same way, applying as an undergrad and hearing other grad students talk about how you need a 4.0 and a publication to get it is pretty discouraging though.

Plus how late we hear about results (April? Whyyyy??) makes it awkward for grad program applications.

I see we are on the same boat! Good luck!!