O Canada!

[Viva]

I am considering applying to some Canadian universities and was wondering if anyone is/was a student enrolled in or has some interesting insight about the following universities:

Dalhousie University

McGill University

McMaster University

University of British Columbia

University of Western Ontario

Each of these universities has a professor that I would be interested in working with in either biology, neuroscience, psychology or zoology. If you know anything about these programs or just have general information about the university or city it is located in, I would value your input. Thank you for your help!

[profound_g]

No special insight, they're all considered to be very good. You'd have to check how the specific programs fare though.

Edited November 7, 2009 by profound_g

[melusine]

I go to UBC.. but as an undergrad in arts. so i don't know how useful my experience might be to you, but feel free to ask any specs you might be wondering about relative to the overall campus/faculty atmosphere.

[cheesethunder]

im applying to mcgill! yay canada! montreal is a wonderful city full of food and life. im applying to 2 schools in montreal shallowly so i have the opportunity to live in montreal. both mac and western and in pretty ......dull university towns....i got into western for my undergrad its a pretty campus and a party school but London ontario is pretty small.

ive heard great things about UBC and DAL all these schools are really good schools so you don't have to worry about that part.

are you done your mcgill app? im doing it now! ahh dec 1 deadlines! for your online application if you've looked at it are 'proposed research' and 'applicant statement' both just your statement of interest? like if you wrote a separate statement of interest do you leave those sections blank? I think i'll phone them monday.

[kahlan_amnell]

Each of these universities has a professor that I would be interested in working with in either biology, neuroscience, psychology or zoology.

Are you interested in studying a subject that could be studied in any of those fields? Or are you not sure what you want to study, so are planning to apply to programs in different fields?

If it is the second option, I'd suggest putting off applying to grad school until you know what you want to study. Grad school is a huge time commitment, and not something you should start if you aren't sure what you want to study.

[Viva]

Are you interested in studying a subject that could be studied in any of those fields? Or are you not sure what you want to study, so are planning to apply to programs in different fields?

If it is the second option, I'd suggest putting off applying to grad school until you know what you want to study. Grad school is a huge time commitment, and not something you should start if you aren't sure what you want to study.

Thanks for the post. Actually, I am pretty certain that I want to study neuroethology and neuroendocrinology but at these different universities, professors with similar interests to mine are sprinkled throughout different programs.

[Viva]

I go to UBC.. but as an undergrad in arts. so i don't know how useful my experience might be to you, but feel free to ask any specs you might be wondering about relative to the overall campus/faculty atmosphere.

Since our academic interests differ, I would like to ask more general questions. What is student life like in Vancouver? Is it relatively safe area around UBC? Is it very expensive to be a student in Vancouver? I visited Vancouver briefly last year and my initial impression was good but I was not there long enough to visit UBC.

[dzk]

What are your career plans? It'll definitely raise some eyebrows from US academics to see a US citizen go to a foreign school (even Canadian) unless it's to work with someone who is internationally recognized in a big way.

[Viva]

What are your career plans? It'll definitely raise some eyebrows from US academics to see a US citizen go to a foreign school (even Canadian) unless it's to work with someone who is internationally recognized in a big way.

Really? It would raise eyebrows? Well, I am specifically interested in the neural and hormonal mechanisms of migratory behavior. I am particularly interested in working with species that spend a significant portion of time in the high latitudes. This is not a huge field and I have found that many researchers that share my interests reside in Canada (as well as Sweden, where I am not yet willing to travel to). So far I have found US researchers that use certain techniques I will have to learn but apply them to other behaviors that I am not as interested in or other US researchers that work with high latitude species but are focused more on ecology then mechanisms of behavior. So, in Canada (and Sweden), I have found researchers who are uniting my interests.

Also, as a native Floridian and almost lifelong resident here, I am ready to leave and never look back. I love cold climates and have had some wonderful experiences in Canada so I am eager to return there.

[JerryLandis]

What's with the assumption Americans have that the only reason an American would attend a foreign institution is that they weren't admitted to any domestic universities? Some of the best universities in the world are located outside of the United States, and it is becoming more common for American students to consider non-American institutions for higher education. In my field, the best masters programs actually seem to be offered in Canada and the UK, not in the US. There are plenty of crappy American universities to take on weaker students - I think going to another country is generally recognized as a sign that someone is adventurous and willing to move to new places in pursuit of academic opportunities. Although, maybe I just think that because I'm an American studying outside of the US!

Do Canadians find it annoying when people from the US identify themselves as "Americans" and don't identify Canadians as such? Obviously just a silly ingrained term, but I always wondered about that.

[psycholinguist]

Hello! I grew up not far from Vancouver, and I now live not far from London, so let's see if I have anything helpful to say.

UBC: Vancouver is a great city: stunningly pretty, exciting, cosmopolitan, and fairly environmentally-friendly. I've only been to UBC a few times, but it's set apart from the nearby residential neighbourhoods, and it's a bit of a bus-trip from there to downtown, so it strikes me as pretty self-contained. One thing to consider is that from Florida, Vancouver would probably take at least eight hours to get to, and would be the most expensive to travel to and from. Growing up in B.C., I only went to Florida once, and it took seven hours and a half to get from Seattle to Fort Lauderdale, via Nashville, TN. Just something to keep in mind.

McGill: Right in the middle of downtown Montréal. Which is another great city. Far more history than in Vancouver just by virtue of the cities' relative ages. Bilingual, with a very European flavour. It's said to be much cheaper to live in than American cities of comparable size, and might even be more affordable than Vancouver (although I'm not certain about that).

UWO: I haven't been to the campus, and I've only been to London twice, but it's a nice enough medium-sized city. Much more of a university-town than the larger cities. Southern Ontario is a pleasant place to live; the locals are friendly, the scenery is nice, and Toronto isn't too far away if you need some big-city excitement. The one catch here is that travelling in and out of it would be tricky for you. You'd have to travel either to, yeah, Toronto (two and a half hours by car, more on the bus) or to Detroit (probably ditto, plus border wait-times) to fly back home.

The other thing is that the climate's going to be pretty different depending on where you go. (Of course, you're a Floridian, so anything in Canada would probably strike you as cold. Heh.) Vancouver's climate is far milder than that of any of the other places; the average July temperature is around 65º F, and in January it's around 40º F. But if rain bugs you, think twice about moving there; sometime in November, it clouds over, and it stays that way for virtually the entire winter, usually with rain. I can tell you that I got really sick of that. Meanwhile, London and Hamilton have a pretty standard continental climate (four well-defined seasons; cold winters and hot, humid summers). Montréal is colder in the winter, and notorious for it. Halifax's climate is probably less extreme than those of the other Eastern places on your list since it has the Atlantic Ocean to moderate temperatures a bit, but it'll still be cooler than Vancouver.

[psycholinguist]

Do Canadians find it annoying when people from the US identify themselves as "Americans" and don't identify Canadians as such? Obviously just a silly ingrained term, but I always wondered about that.

This is an interesting question (then again, I'm a linguist!). In my experiences, the answer has been a defiant no. The U.S. doesn't have an endonym based on the term 'United States', so 'American' on its own fills that gap. And to no one does it more strongly indicate the U.S. than to Canadians. Canadians don't mind being labelled 'North Americans', but if you call one of them simply an 'American', he or she would be puzzled and quite possibly insulted as well. Calling the whole lot of us 'Americans' would likely be even worse.

[Viva]

What's with the assumption Americans have that the only reason an American would attend a foreign institution is that they weren't admitted to any domestic universities? Some of the best universities in the world are located outside of the United States, and it is becoming more common for American students to consider non-American institutions for higher education. In my field, the best masters programs actually seem to be offered in Canada and the UK, not in the US. There are plenty of crappy American universities to take on weaker students - I think going to another country is generally recognized as a sign that someone is adventurous and willing to move to new places in pursuit of academic opportunities. Although, maybe I just think that because I'm an American studying outside of the US!

Do Canadians find it annoying when people from the US identify themselves as "Americans" and don't identify Canadians as such? Obviously just a silly ingrained term, but I always wondered about that.

Well said. I was accepted to a UK as well as a Canadian university for undergrad. Unfortunately, when it came to making a decision, I was too anxious about moving to a foreign country by myself and decided to stay closer to home. I really regret that and wish I had overcome my fears then but at least now after traveling more, I know that I enjoy traveling to foreign countries and would be very enthusiastic about pursuing graduate studies abroad.

Hello! I grew up not far from Vancouver, and I now live not far from London, so let's see if I have anything helpful to say.

UBC: Vancouver is a great city: stunningly pretty, exciting, cosmopolitan, and fairly environmentally-friendly. I've only been to UBC a few times, but it's set apart from the nearby residential neighbourhoods, and it's a bit of a bus-trip from there to downtown, so it strikes me as pretty self-contained. One thing to consider is that from Florida, Vancouver would probably take at least eight hours to get to, and would be the most expensive to travel to and from. Growing up in B.C., I only went to Florida once, and it took seven hours and a half to get from Seattle to Fort Lauderdale, via Nashville, TN. Just something to keep in mind.

McGill: Right in the middle of downtown Montréal. Which is another great city. Far more history than in Vancouver just by virtue of the cities' relative ages. Bilingual, with a very European flavour. It's said to be much cheaper to live in than American cities of comparable size, and might even be more affordable than Vancouver (although I'm not certain about that).

UWO: I haven't been to the campus, and I've only been to London twice, but it's a nice enough medium-sized city. Much more of a university-town than the larger cities. Southern Ontario is a pleasant place to live; the locals are friendly, the scenery is nice, and Toronto isn't too far away if you need some big-city excitement. The one catch here is that travelling in and out of it would be tricky for you. You'd have to travel either to, yeah, Toronto (two and a half hours by car, more on the bus) or to Detroit (probably ditto, plus border wait-times) to fly back home.

The other thing is that the climate's going to be pretty different depending on where you go. (Of course, you're a Floridian, so anything in Canada would probably strike you as cold. Heh.) Vancouver's climate is far milder than that of any of the other places; the average July temperature is around 65º F, and in January it's around 40º F. But if rain bugs you, think twice about moving there; sometime in November, it clouds over, and it stays that way for virtually the entire winter, usually with rain. I can tell you that I got really sick of that. Meanwhile, London and Hamilton have a pretty standard continental climate (four well-defined seasons; cold winters and hot, humid summers). Montréal is colder in the winter, and notorious for it. Halifax's climate is probably less extreme than those of the other Eastern places on your list since it has the Atlantic Ocean to moderate temperatures a bit, but it'll still be cooler than Vancouver.

Wow. Thank you so much for your detailed description of those cities. I am not sure yet if I want to live in a big city or not. My time in Vancouver was a bit of a whirlwind so hopefully, if UBC likes my application they might invite me for an interview and then I can explore the city a bit more. I have friends from Montreal who always say wonderful things about it but I am concerned I may run into trouble because I do not know any French (I took all Spanish language courses) although I am willing to learn. I have heard the tulip season there is remarkable. Thanks again for your help!

[tarski]

You'd be fine without french in Montreal, really. Also cheap sushi *everywhere* in Vancouver!

[cheesethunder]

What's with the assumption Americans have that the only reason an American would attend a foreign institution is that they weren't admitted to any domestic universities? Some of the best universities in the world are located outside of the United States, and it is becoming more common for American students to consider non-American institutions for higher education. In my field, the best masters programs actually seem to be offered in Canada and the UK, not in the US. There are plenty of crappy American universities to take on weaker students - I think going to another country is generally recognized as a sign that someone is adventurous and willing to move to new places in pursuit of academic opportunities. Although, maybe I just think that because I'm an American studying outside of the US!

Do Canadians find it annoying when people from the US identify themselves as "Americans" and don't identify Canadians as such? Obviously just a silly ingrained term, but I always wondered about that.

i agree!!! sheesh there are good schools in a lot of places that aren't the US! from the profs i talk to american schools seem to have this status appeal, undergraduate school status and ivey appeal bleh bleh which canadians/ canadian schools don't really appeal to. im not depending on my school's status to get me in anywhere that is.

i would be insulted if someone called me an american haha....i remember when i visited the states the people i was with kept introducing me as the canadian, which i thought was weird because i don't consider people form the states foreign or anything haha

[dzk]

What's with the assumption Americans have that the only reason an American would attend a foreign institution is that they weren't admitted to any domestic universities? Some of the best universities in the world are located outside of the United States, and it is becoming more common for American students to consider non-American institutions for higher education. In my field, the best masters programs actually seem to be offered in Canada and the UK, not in the US. There are plenty of crappy American universities to take on weaker students - I think going to another country is generally recognized as a sign that someone is adventurous and willing to move to new places in pursuit of academic opportunities. Although, maybe I just think that because I'm an American studying outside of the US!

Oh, I agree. This wasn't really my point, though.

If your career plans involve American academia, then it serves you well to learn in American academia where all else is equal. There are excellent reasons to study internationally, but "the US is boring" is a terrible one. You want the best education you can get. If you can do as well or better for your interests in a foreign university, then absolutely, go for it. But do not expect it to be viewed fondly if you just bolt off to go to an average program to study under average faculty if you could have done better at home. Your motives will rightly be called into question.

[edit: WOW, that sounded OBNOXIOUS. Um. I guess I'll leave what I wrote there, but I need to make it a bit less snotty with some further explanation. Academic careers in biology are very competitive, and what is going to matter in the end is what you have published and who you know. You lose that second factor if you're working with someone who isn't known by US academics. Now, if you're going to an internationally respected program with internationally respected faculty (i.e. not a recent hire) then you'll have no problem there.]

Edited November 8, 2009 by iggy

[lifetimestudent]

I'm also interested in studying in Canada, but I don't have questions about specific schools. However I was wondering if any American students who studied in Canada could chime in on what was the biggest change. I'm OK with the cold - but how is it most different from American schools?

[psycholinguist]

Wow. Thank you so much for your detailed description of those cities. I am not sure yet if I want to live in a big city or not. My time in Vancouver was a bit of a whirlwind so hopefully, if UBC likes my application they might invite me for an interview and then I can explore the city a bit more. I have friends from Montreal who always say wonderful things about it but I am concerned I may run into trouble because I do not know any French (I took all Spanish language courses) although I am willing to learn. I have heard the tulip season there is remarkable. Thanks again for your help!

No problem! I agree with tarski that you'd be just fine in Montreal without French; most people speak English as well. You might pick up a few words of French, but it probably wouldn't hurt you. * grins *

[melusine]

alright then... my 2 cents about Vancouver!

overall it's a nice, big, vibrant multi-ethnic city with breathtaking scenery. you literally have the beach, mountains, forest and city all in one. whistler's pretty close too if you are at all into winter sports (we ARE hosting the olympics in a couple months! exciting.. )

on the flip side, the city itself has had a reputation of being the "slums of Canada", with one specific area widely known as the poorest postal code in the country.

they're not exaggerating either- i'm from the ex-soviet union and i've seen pretty extreme poverty in my home country but NOTHING like the nasty, nastiness you will see in that neighborhood. it's basically a by-product of Van being a port city and BC being one of the biggest, most developed pot-producers and exporters in the world. all drug puns aside, it's a known fact that illegal activities like that is where some of the wealthiest ppl in the province get their money.

anyways, not to worry, UBC's a safe 50 min bus ride away from those places so you'll be pretty removed from that aspect.

otherwise, lots of rain and not that much to do on rainy days except study, which is good cos that's what you'll be doing anyway, right?

libraries and study spaces are plenty, almost all the residences have nice big gyms with flat screen tvs so you can come relax, or read your coursework on the stepper..

oh, another thing people like to whine about: while pot is a-ok anytime anywhere, you can't buy alcohol unless it's from a licensed liquor store. these generally exist in all kinds of far-off inconvenient places and close at ridiculous hours (7pm all week and closed on monday?! are u kidding me??!). you also can't drink outside (as in carrying your beer like you would on the street in any city in Europe) it's a minor inconvenience but it's there.

that's all i can think of right now. hope it helps!

[JerryLandis]

Today, when attempting to call a department, I learned that Canadian phone numbers are apparently the same as American ones, with the same country code and all. How strange!

Anyways though, just a quick warning: beware the University of Toronto online application system if you're used to the application program used by most American universities! I did not realize until it was too late that you cannot go back to edit your application after you have selected a payment method, so now I think I am going to have to fill out a new application and ask my recommenders to send in their letters again, because my application is incomplete! I skipped ahead past the payment part because I had to do so in order to see the instructions for the personal statement. Nowhere (except in the separate FAQ section, which I read only once it was too late) does it tell you that you won't be able to make any changes after filling in the application fee section. So be careful, and don't be an idiot like me.

[peppermint.beatnik]

McGill loves Americans--you're a shoe-in. Did undergrad there.

Did MA at McMaster-loved the school; great sense of community; good location. close to TO and US border, Niagara escarpment, etc.

[melusine]

Today, when attempting to call a department, I learned that Canadian phone numbers are apparently the same as American ones, with the same country code and all. How strange!

funny, when i called NYU, i had the same reaction except :"us numbers are the same as Canadian!" lol

slight difference of perspective here!

[dithering]

I'm trying to make the same decisions as well. All of the schools are rated well. I know McMaster isn't for my program but that it does quite well in life sciences.

I am quite attracted to UBC-- (I recommend checking out the campus on google maps street view, it's even very pretty there). My problem with UBC is that I'm having a hard time finding decently priced housing off-campus. I'm not quite sure which area of Vancouver to look in, but it seems really hard to find a bachelor under 800 per month. 700 is my upper limit.

However, if UBC is quite a far bus ride from downtown Vancouver (30-40 minutes? I ride a bike everywhere so that would be maybe a 40-50 minute bike ride?) I might consider residence, despite having a bad experience in undergrad.

I am not attracted to London at all! I'm from Southern Ontario and all of my friends that chose to go to Western were in it for the partying. My boyfriend lived in London for two years. The good thing is he had a beautiful basement bachelor apartment-- HUGE-- for around 650. The bad thing was having to live in London. I find both London and Hamilton (where McMaster is located) to be extremely boring industrial towns with very little culture. Regardless, I am seriously considering Western myself because I am curious to see how well I work without the distractions of the urban jungle outside my window, and the fact that the cost of living is much cheaper is wonderful as well.

Be forewarned though: you say you love winter but London apparently has almost three feet of snow right now! It can make transportation extremely difficult. Same goes for Montreal, it is much, much colder than Vancouver. We're talking some serious -30, -40 windchills.

Anyway, I've found that Vancounver is the most expensive place to live, followed by Montreal and Hamilton and London are likely the same. It is MUCH easier to get to Toronto from Hamilton (GO train-- about an hour) than Toronto from London (3 hour bus ride).

[johndiligent]

Same goes for Montreal, it is much, much colder than Vancouver. We're talking some serious -30, -40 windchills.

True, but in Montreal, you can spend almost the entire winter underground, so it matters less.

[melusine]

oooh fellow vancouverite(s)!!

as far as expenses go, btw, as the saying goes "u ain't seen nothing yet"..!

i am currently looking for a bunker to hide in for when the olympics strike.

what's even worse: i live on campus, within two blocks of our ice rink!!