Is UofCincinnati worth going

[Squirtle001]

All the results have been released and I was only accepted to CJ phd program in Cincinnati (fully funded) and several master programs in sociology (not funded). I have been inquiring almost EVERYBODY I know. But still, I cannot make my decision. There are pros and cons for both options.

 

My background:

Bachelor in social science from a top-five university in my home country with interest in family sociology;

Master in sociology in the top sociology program in Europe and I chose criminology as my thesis topic BY CHANCE;

Not-bad test scores (v62%+quant97%+aw82%);

Not 100% sure that I want to study criminology for the rest of my life ...

Willing to do a PhD in the US but not reluctant to work there

 

Aim:

Teach/research in a top 50 university in sociology or top 10 in criminology

Or work as a data analyst or researcher etc.

 

Option 1: Cincinnati

Pros:

1. fully funded, cheap living expenses;

2. nice professors;

3. easier (?): no need to apply for another round;

4. great rank in criminology and criminal justice;

5. criminology is underdeveloped in my home country (more opportunities)

Cons:

1. The University is not so reputable in general (ranks worse than my bachelor and master universities) and I haven't heard anyone getting rejected by Cincinnati...

2. After checking almost all the profiles of phd graduates of criminal justice, I found them moving downwards in their career: no one to sociology department and almost no one to top criminology departments (UMD, SUNY Albany, UPenn). Most graduates are in universities that I have never heard of (ranking 300+?). However, graduates from those departments have much better placement... And i was astonished by this fact... Anyone has a clue why this is the case?

3. not 100% certain about a phd in criminology... and UofCincinnati does not have many other highly ranked programs...

 

Option 2: MAPSS in UChicago (one year, the best MA program so far in this cycle)

Pros:

1. Great reputation (for CV?);

2. Nice location (close to my girlfriend);

3. Rigorous training and more competition;

4. It will assist me well in applying for a phd position (sociology) in a top university;

5. Better placement after phd;

6. Can think more thoroughly if I wanna do a phd 

7. Reputation again... 

Cons:

1. Costly, with only one third of tuition waived (parental sponsorship);

2. Harsh both in terms of training and going through another round of phd application;

3. Need to gap for one year before I can apply again for a phd ... and I don't know if i can stay in the US during that time (NOT a STEM program, so three months to search for a job)

4. Better Phd position anticipated BUT not guaranteed ... Uncertainty

 

The thing is, I think I have nice background and most of my alumni from bachelor and master programs are accepted to better phd programs than me. My application along with tests were prepared within 3 months and I don't really have a certain idea about my future research topic (also reflected in my SOP). My writing sample was rudimentary (theory and hypotheses part of my master thesis). That said, I think I can get into a better phd program than this with more preparation. 

But is it too risky to turn down Cincinnati and go for Chicago? Or is Cincinnati a sufficient place to achieve my career goals? I'm just too frustrated ...

 

[Ilspflouz]

15 hours ago, Ashitakarl said:

All the results have been released and I was only accepted to CJ phd program in Cincinnati (fully funded) and several master programs in sociology (not funded). I have been inquiring almost EVERYBODY I know. But still, I cannot make my decision. There are pros and cons for both options.

 

My background:

Bachelor in social science from a top-five university in my home country with interest in family sociology;

Master in sociology in the top sociology program in Europe and I chose criminology as my thesis topic BY CHANCE;

Not-bad test scores (v62%+quant97%+aw82%);

Not 100% sure that I want to study criminology for the rest of my life ...

Willing to do a PhD in the US but not reluctant to work there

 

Aim:

Teach/research in a top 50 university in sociology or top 10 in criminology

Or work as a data analyst or researcher etc.

 

Option 1: Cincinnati

Pros:

1. fully funded, cheap living expenses;

2. nice professors;

3. easier (?): no need to apply for another round;

4. great rank in criminology and criminal justice;

5. criminology is underdeveloped in my home country (more opportunities)

Cons:

1. The University is not so reputable in general (ranks worse than my bachelor and master universities) and I haven't heard anyone getting rejected by Cincinnati...

2. After checking almost all the profiles of phd graduates of criminal justice, I found them moving downwards in their career: no one to sociology department and almost no one to top criminology departments (UMD, SUNY Albany, UPenn). Most graduates are in universities that I have never heard of (ranking 300+?). However, graduates from those departments have much better placement... And i was astonished by this fact... Anyone has a clue why this is the case?

3. not 100% certain about a phd in criminology... and UofCincinnati does not have many other highly ranked programs...

 

Option 2: MAPSS in UChicago (one year, the best MA program so far in this cycle)

Pros:

1. Great reputation (for CV?);

2. Nice location (close to my girlfriend);

3. Rigorous training and more competition;

4. It will assist me well in applying for a phd position (sociology) in a top university;

5. Better placement after phd;

6. Can think more thoroughly if I wanna do a phd 

7. Reputation again... 

Cons:

1. Costly, with only one third of tuition waived (parental sponsorship);

2. Harsh both in terms of training and going through another round of phd application;

3. Need to gap for one year before I can apply again for a phd ... and I don't know if i can stay in the US during that time (NOT a STEM program, so three months to search for a job)

4. Better Phd position anticipated BUT not guaranteed ... Uncertainty

 

The thing is, I think I have nice background and most of my alumni from bachelor and master programs are accepted to better phd programs than me. My application along with tests were prepared within 3 months and I don't really have a certain idea about my future research topic (also reflected in my SOP). My writing sample was rudimentary (theory and hypotheses part of my master thesis). That said, I think I can get into a better phd program than this with more preparation. 

But is it too risky to turn down Cincinnati and go for Chicago? Or is Cincinnati a sufficient place to achieve my career goals? I'm just too frustrated ...

 

I think the way you have phrased everything here gives you your answer. Here is my thoughts:

-It seems like you are not sure if you want to study Crim/CJ for the rest of your life. In my opinion you definitely should NOT go to a Crim PhD program if that is the case. In a CJ/Crim program you will learn about CJ topics and you will be trained to work for a CJ program, not a sociology one. Your chances of being hired into an academic sociology department with a Crim PhD are very small. Many people in Crim do not think of Crim as an off shoot of sociology, but its own discipline, and are not interested in working in a sociology department. This is likely why you are not seeing Crim graduates from Cincinnati in sociology departments.

-Sociology sounds like your passion and main interest. Perhaps you have an interest in crime or deviance, but only in a sociological context? If so, you would want to go to a sociology program with a crime focus/track available, but probably not a CJ program. This is especially true  if you are passionate about family sociology and not crime! Also, I think Cincinnati is usually most known for its work in corrections and practice-oriented/applied work. This doesn't sound like what you are interested in.

-While Cincy itself is not highly ranked in general as a university, it has a very VERY good CJ/Crim PhD program. I think in terms of what you are talking about with rankings it is just an example of a case where ranking in the discipline is differently decided than the university overall. I can see how this could be confusing. But rest assured within the discipline of CJ/Crim Cincinnati is very well thought of. Outside the discipline (e.g. in sociology) I'm not sure how it would be thought of. There were unfortunately plenty of people rejected or wait-listed by their PhD program this year and in recent years. Look at the other threads on this forum for some examples. Cincinnati is not just some kind of diploma mill program where everyone is accepted and the training is mediocre. That's not why I'm cautioning you about going there, It just sounds like it may not be the best fit for your interests/aspirations.

-All things considered if I was you I would go to UChicago, or re-apply for PhD programs. UChicago sounds like a much better fit for your interests and career goals. With a master's in sociology from UChicago under your belt I would bet your chances at getting into a PhD program in sociology would greatly increase. If you are positive you want to do a PhD, I would also consider trying to find research work in an academic department at a university if you don't want to do another Master's, and then re-applying for a PhD.  That would give you experience and access to academic departments but you wouldn't necessarily have to pay for the experience that way. It would also give you a chance to publish or get other experiences to make you an even better applicant for jobs or PhD apps in the future.

--Your GREs are clearly great. Maybe re- post on the sociology forum and see what they say?

Good luck!

Edited April 2, 2017 by HedgieLove

[Squirtle001]

Hi HedgieLove,

Thank you for your insightful comments. You explained the distinction between a criminal justice program and a sociology program really well. 

5 hours ago, HedgieLove said:

-Sociology sounds like your passion and main interest. Perhaps you have an interest in crime or deviance, but only in a sociological context? If so, you would want to go to a sociology program with a crime focus/track available, but probably not a CJ program. This is especially true  if you are passionate about family sociology and not crime! Also, I think Cincinnati is usually most known for its work in corrections and practice-oriented/applied work. This doesn't sound like what you are interested in.

The situation is: I'm not sure about my interest in sociology as well and apparently NOT family sociology as I have experience doing research on it. Studying crime with sociological perspective is more appealing to me. 

If I go to another sociology program, I might still be lost in the vast topics in sociology. Will it help if I do research with professors in sociology background and try to avoid the parts that I dislike about a CJ program? Eww...

5 hours ago, HedgieLove said:

-All things considered if I was you I would go to UChicago, or re-apply for PhD programs. UChicago sounds like a much better fit for your interests and career goals. With a master's in sociology from UChicago under your belt I would bet your chances at getting into a PhD program in sociology would greatly increase. If you are positive you want to do a PhD, I would also consider trying to find research work in an academic department at a university if you don't want to do another Master's, and then re-applying for a PhD.  That would give you experience and access to academic departments but you wouldn't necessarily have to pay for the experience that way. It would also give you a chance to publish or get other experiences to make you an even better applicant for jobs or PhD apps in the future.

I agree with what you said about. But I wonder if there is any possibility that I get research work somewhere in the US without a US degree? Do you have any information with that regard?

Thanks again! You are REALLY helpful!

[rising_star]

It sounds to me like you need to do a lot more reading and independent research to figure out what it is you want to be studying and within what intellectual tradition. And then, once you've done that, you should apply for PhD programs again. There's no reason to pay for MAPSS because your credentials sound fine and the biggest issue is probably that you don't really know what field you should be in.