Wait-listed

[lorinho]

I started this thread because I have seen that there are a lot of wait-listed students, and I am sure that you all have questions about it. Hopefully, there are a lot people out there with answers, and this thread will not die after I give my one amount of information. Really I have only one thing to say, and I hope it is helpful.

Wait-lists are treated differently at each school so don't assume that the reason for a wait-list is the same at one school to another. Some places will be forthcoming about it, others will not. If you are wait-listed at the University of Chicago, I have been there (wait-listed). This is only the second year that there has been a wait-list at the University of Chicago, so they are still sorting out how they do things. I don't have explicit information, but based upon what I observed the university admits exactly as many people as they are able to take, with a wait-list backup so that they get the actual number of students they want. Last years wait-list was short, but only as many people as declined their original offers were ultimately accepted (at least that is how it seems). This year's UofC "prospective students day" is earlier than last, and I believe that both admitted students and wait-listed students are invited (your letter will tell you), but you should not view this as an opportunity to lobby for your admission. The reason this is important is that rather than running around trying to meet professors you think might be influential, you should spend your time discovering if you want to actually attend the school. The worst possible outcome is that you get off the wait-list, and then have to make a decision with little to no information on how good a fit the school and faculty is for you.

I caveat all of this by saying, I am not faculty or staff, and have no inside information. If you have that information, by all means listen to it, and if it is relevant do share with others.

[Keller65]

Interesting insight, I know a few UChicago wait listers are perceiving that as a weekend of bloodsport. I think you are right that such an approach would make anyone uncomfortable. This is not "A Shot at Love".

More broadly, it would be interesting to know how wise it is to try to advance yourself while on a WL. For example, would sending an updated CV/writing sample, or contacting faculty, be prudent?

Edited February 20, 2010 by Keller65

[mn06556]

Does anyone have a sense of how Princeton's waitlist works?

[Wesson]

Here's my post from a similar thread last week (keep in mind that it is indeed the case that departments differ):

Most departments have a minimum size they hope to achieve for the incoming class. If you want at least 10 students in the class, you may make initial admission/funding offers to 20, recognizing that many of them will go elsewhere. People will move up from the waiting list when one of two things happen: 1) the list of possibles drops below 10 (i.e., 11+ of the original 20 notify the DGS that they are going elsewhere), or 2) the list of possibles for a subfield drops below the desired minimum (e.g., all but one admitted student in American decides to go elsewhere, and the department wants at least two students in American). This can take a while to sort itself out, mostly because risk-averse students often are slow to notify the DGS that they have ruled out a department. There can be a lot of action in the days leading up to decision day. Some DGSs will call or email you if things are looking promising, as in "it looks quite likely that we'll have a slot for you, but we won't know for sure for at least two more days. So, we encourage you to hold off on making a decision among your other schools until we get back to you."

Edited February 21, 2010 by Wesson

[Keller65]

Here's my post from a similar thread last week (keep in mind that it is indeed the case that departments differ):

Most departments have a minimum size they hope to achieve for the incoming class. If you want at least 10 students in the class, you may make initial admission/funding offers to 20, recognizing that many of them will go elsewhere. People will move up from the waiting list when one of two things happen: 1) the list of possibles drops below 10 (i.e., 11+ of the original 20 notify the DGS that they are going elsewhere), or 2) the list of possibles for a subfield drops below the desired minimum (e.g., all but one admitted student in American decides to go elsewhere, and the department wants at least two students in American). This can take a while to sort itself out, mostly because risk-averse students often are slow to notify the DGS that they have ruled out a department. There can be a lot of action in the days leading up to decision day. Some DGSs will call or email you if things are looking promising, as in "it looks quite likely that we'll have a slot for you, but we won't know for sure for at least two more days. So, we encourage you to hold off on making a decision among your other schools until we get back to you."

Key to this is that just because someone "declines" doesn't mean you move up a slot. One needs many fellows to reject offers in order for the phones to start ringing.

[lorinho]

More broadly, it would be interesting to know how wise it is to try to advance yourself while on a WL. For example, would sending an updated CV/writing sample, or contacting faculty, be prudent?

I don't think that updating your information can hurt, but I am not optimistic that it will help all that much. As far as contacting people, at UChicago you will be expected to talk to several professors on Prospective Students Day, so I would definitely do that, but more might be a waste of your and their time (unless they ask you for it of course).

Most people I have talked to say that every year universities will turn down a hundred otherwise qualified applicants for almost inscrutable reasons, so the fact that you are on the waitlist means that you beat out a bunch of people already. I don't know what could have changed in the last few months that would move you up that far. It might make you feel better though, and that isn't bad.

I have requested meeting with 5 faculty members (they actually asked me to list the faculty members with whom I want to meet). I'm planning on reading some of their research and discussing my research interests with them, in the hopes that I can convince them (without being disingenuous about my interests, of course) that I would be an awesome fit.

OP: does this sound like a reasonable idea to you? I also know from contacting the dept that they only admitted 1 person off the waitlist last year. However, it says on their website that they typically admit about 33 people, while they shoot for a cohort of 15-20. This seems to contradict the information you provided, if I understand you correctly.

That sounds like an imminently reasonable idea to me. I would recommend against too much overt lobbying, however, at least at Chicago. I don't know whether it can hurt you or help you, but I do know that presenting yourself rationally and professionally, which definitely includes your research interests, is far better than an 'argument' you can present. (One warning though, make sure that you deal with recent interests of Professors, and not things they did ten or twenty years ago.) More importantly, however, I think you should really figure out if Chicago is for you. Especially in your case, Rossiya, where you have already been admitted to two excellent schools. Chicago is a great school, and I love it here, but it is totally not for everybody. Chicago has their own way of doing things, which is why it has a big reputation, but that also means that not everyone thrives here, and some people hate it. It is hard to determine this in one day, but plenty of people do.

I'll give a little more disclosure, on what I 'know' and how I 'know' (surmise) it. The website has said that since I first applied, in 1999, and from all that I can tell, that has been the way that it actually was up until now. Apparently about three or four years ago, almost all of the 33 people they admitted came, which at a school with a large endowment and in good times was no problem. However, since then the market crashed, and while Chicago had a fairly diversified account, and still gets a lot of donations, a lot of people got worried about 'accidentally' admitting more students than they could support, and the wait-list system was born. I do not know if they still admit the 33, but I doubt it, since that would totally defeat the purpose of the wait-list.

I would believe the 'only 1 person' number,and I am that person. However, what leads me to believe that they are swapping out one for one is this: I tracked admissions on this site, and someone, I forget who, stated that she was rejecting her offer since she had so many schools to choose from, and Chicago didn't make the cut. Days later I received my formal acceptance.

There are several potential extenuating circumstances, though: I came with outside funding, I was already here as an M.A. student, and I only applied here (UChicago) for personal reasons (not a good plan BTW), and the cmte knew that. It is therefore entirely conceivable, and even likely that my situation is not generalizable. Nevertheless, I think it is probably true that other students declining admission is a necessary condition for students to be taken off the waiting list, but it may not be sufficient, even though it was in my case.

That said, it remains true that you will probably not be able to move yourself off the waiting list on your own. However, if you are serious about UChicago you should definitely attend prospective students day if you can. You will not help your chances, and might hurt them by skipping. Nevertheless, for your own sake, don't stress yourself to think that it is "the Academic Combine." It is not.