chron

anonak, I am in much the same situation as you, I have been unemployed or underemployed for practically the entire time after graduation and this is, on the surface, why I'm applying to go to grad school. It's not really that I'm particularly interested in academia. I'm also a "don't know what I want to do" person - actually, deep down I do have an idea of what I want in life, but it's not something that most people can understand, and I'll leave it at that.
 
I don't really agree with the things Usmivka said - I know in practice, you shouldn't show this "attitude" to grad schools, but this is something about schools and employers for that matter that I really don't agree with. If I go to grad school, pass all the courses, fulfill my requirements, and get a degree, why should it matter whether I have a "direction" or not or whether or not I am super motivated and passionate about the field? If I'm capable of completing a degree, I deserve it. One thing most people don't understand (and I'm not saying that's necessarily the case with anonak) is that for some people it's mentally difficult to feel enjoyment or a lot of emotion towards things.
 
Also, why should anonak be blamed for potentially lying - do you really think all those other applicants and grad students knew exactly what they wanted to do since they were a little kid and are as devoted to their field as they claim in their personal statements? If I was an employer, I would want to hire anonak for her humility and honesty, I like her attitude more the bragging, self-promoting type of personality this society rewards.
 
For me, I am applying to grad school even though I realize I'm taking a risk. You may say you're supposed to "find yourself" then go to grad school, but isn't that the case too when you go for a career in the workforce? I figure the alternative would be to go back to my undergrad and start another Bachelor's all over again, but I feel that would be an even bigger risk in terms of admission as well as completing up to 4 years again vs. a 2 year Master's and the mental impact of knowing you're going backwards not forwards. If I had to do it all over again, I probably wouldn't have gone into my field, but the kind of things that I like relatively more in my field are more research based. So I'm taking a bet that I can find something fulfilling enough in grad school.
 
I'm not worried about going to grad school, I'm pretty confident I can do it. I'm just worried about whether or not I can get in - I suspect I appear as a weak candidate and I don't know if I can convince a graduate school to admit me. Another advantage of going back to school is that there are counsellors to talk to. I don't expect it to be of much help, but that's a major goal of mines if I got into grad school. As for doing things like going into the Peace Corps, for one thing not everyone is from the US, but even if I did something like that, there will be the question of "then what?" after I complete my service with them.
 
In summary, I'm aware there is a risk but I don't think going to grad school is a bad idea even if you're not someone that really knows what you want to do. As long as you think there are some areas in your field that you can tolerate. I just think the risk of not going may be worse and I would be questioning myself "why didn't I give grad school a chance?" in the future if I didn't apply now. So I'm going to give it a chance, and hope it works out for me.

anonak, I am in much the same situation as you, I have been unemployed or underemployed for practically the entire time after graduation and this is, on the surface, why I'm applying to go to grad school. It's not really that I'm particularly interested in academia. I'm also a "don't know what I want to do" person - actually, deep down I do have an idea of what I want in life, but it's not something that most people can understand, and I'll leave it at that.
 
I don't really agree with the things Usmivka said - I know in practice, you shouldn't show this "attitude" to grad schools, but this is something about schools and employers for that matter that I really don't agree with. If I go to grad school, pass all the courses, fulfill my requirements, and get a degree, why should it matter whether I have a "direction" or not or whether or not I am super motivated and passionate about the field? If I'm capable of completing a degree, I deserve it. One thing most people don't understand (and I'm not saying that's necessarily the case with anonak) is that for some people it's mentally difficult to feel enjoyment or a lot of emotion towards things.
 
Also, why should anonak be blamed for potentially lying - do you really think all those other applicants and grad students knew exactly what they wanted to do since they were a little kid and are as devoted to their field as they claim in their personal statements? If I was an employer, I would want to hire anonak for her humility and honesty, I like her attitude more the bragging, self-promoting type of personality this society rewards.
 
For me, I am applying to grad school even though I realize I'm taking a risk. You may say you're supposed to "find yourself" then go to grad school, but isn't that the case too when you go for a career in the workforce? I figure the alternative would be to go back to my undergrad and start another Bachelor's all over again, but I feel that would be an even bigger risk in terms of admission as well as completing up to 4 years again vs. a 2 year Master's and the mental impact of knowing you're going backwards not forwards. If I had to do it all over again, I probably wouldn't have gone into my field, but the kind of things that I like relatively more in my field are more research based. So I'm taking a bet that I can find something fulfilling enough in grad school.
 
I'm not worried about going to grad school, I'm pretty confident I can do it. I'm just worried about whether or not I can get in - I suspect I appear as a weak candidate and I don't know if I can convince a graduate school to admit me. Another advantage of going back to school is that there are counsellors to talk to. I don't expect it to be of much help, but that's a major goal of mines if I got into grad school. As for doing things like going into the Peace Corps, for one thing not everyone is from the US, but even if I did something like that, there will be the question of "then what?" after I complete my service with them.
 
In summary, I'm aware there is a risk but I don't think going to grad school is a bad idea even if you're not someone that really knows what you want to do. As long as you think there are some areas in your field that you can tolerate. I just think the risk of not going may be worse and I would be questioning myself "why didn't I give grad school a chance?" in the future if I didn't apply now. So I'm going to give it a chance, and hope it works out for me.

anonak, I am in much the same situation as you, I have been unemployed or underemployed for practically the entire time after graduation and this is, on the surface, why I'm applying to go to grad school. It's not really that I'm particularly interested in academia. I'm also a "don't know what I want to do" person - actually, deep down I do have an idea of what I want in life, but it's not something that most people can understand, and I'll leave it at that.
 
I don't really agree with the things Usmivka said - I know in practice, you shouldn't show this "attitude" to grad schools, but this is something about schools and employers for that matter that I really don't agree with. If I go to grad school, pass all the courses, fulfill my requirements, and get a degree, why should it matter whether I have a "direction" or not or whether or not I am super motivated and passionate about the field? If I'm capable of completing a degree, I deserve it. One thing most people don't understand (and I'm not saying that's necessarily the case with anonak) is that for some people it's mentally difficult to feel enjoyment or a lot of emotion towards things.
 
Also, why should anonak be blamed for potentially lying - do you really think all those other applicants and grad students knew exactly what they wanted to do since they were a little kid and are as devoted to their field as they claim in their personal statements? If I was an employer, I would want to hire anonak for her humility and honesty, I like her attitude more the bragging, self-promoting type of personality this society rewards.
 
For me, I am applying to grad school even though I realize I'm taking a risk. You may say you're supposed to "find yourself" then go to grad school, but isn't that the case too when you go for a career in the workforce? I figure the alternative would be to go back to my undergrad and start another Bachelor's all over again, but I feel that would be an even bigger risk in terms of admission as well as completing up to 4 years again vs. a 2 year Master's and the mental impact of knowing you're going backwards not forwards. If I had to do it all over again, I probably wouldn't have gone into my field, but the kind of things that I like relatively more in my field are more research based. So I'm taking a bet that I can find something fulfilling enough in grad school.
 
I'm not worried about going to grad school, I'm pretty confident I can do it. I'm just worried about whether or not I can get in - I suspect I appear as a weak candidate and I don't know if I can convince a graduate school to admit me. Another advantage of going back to school is that there are counsellors to talk to. I don't expect it to be of much help, but that's a major goal of mines if I got into grad school. As for doing things like going into the Peace Corps, for one thing not everyone is from the US, but even if I did something like that, there will be the question of "then what?" after I complete my service with them.
 
In summary, I'm aware there is a risk but I don't think going to grad school is a bad idea even if you're not someone that really knows what you want to do. As long as you think there are some areas in your field that you can tolerate. I just think the risk of not going may be worse and I would be questioning myself "why didn't I give grad school a chance?" in the future if I didn't apply now. So I'm going to give it a chance, and hope it works out for me.

anonak, I am in much the same situation as you, I have been unemployed or underemployed for practically the entire time after graduation and this is, on the surface, why I'm applying to go to grad school. It's not really that I'm particularly interested in academia. I'm also a "don't know what I want to do" person - actually, deep down I do have an idea of what I want in life, but it's not something that most people can understand, and I'll leave it at that.
 
I don't really agree with the things Usmivka said - I know in practice, you shouldn't show this "attitude" to grad schools, but this is something about schools and employers for that matter that I really don't agree with. If I go to grad school, pass all the courses, fulfill my requirements, and get a degree, why should it matter whether I have a "direction" or not or whether or not I am super motivated and passionate about the field? If I'm capable of completing a degree, I deserve it. One thing most people don't understand (and I'm not saying that's necessarily the case with anonak) is that for some people it's mentally difficult to feel enjoyment or a lot of emotion towards things.
 
Also, why should anonak be blamed for potentially lying - do you really think all those other applicants and grad students knew exactly what they wanted to do since they were a little kid and are as devoted to their field as they claim in their personal statements? If I was an employer, I would want to hire anonak for her humility and honesty, I like her attitude more the bragging, self-promoting type of personality this society rewards.
 
For me, I am applying to grad school even though I realize I'm taking a risk. You may say you're supposed to "find yourself" then go to grad school, but isn't that the case too when you go for a career in the workforce? I figure the alternative would be to go back to my undergrad and start another Bachelor's all over again, but I feel that would be an even bigger risk in terms of admission as well as completing up to 4 years again vs. a 2 year Master's and the mental impact of knowing you're going backwards not forwards. If I had to do it all over again, I probably wouldn't have gone into my field, but the kind of things that I like relatively more in my field are more research based. So I'm taking a bet that I can find something fulfilling enough in grad school.
 
I'm not worried about going to grad school, I'm pretty confident I can do it. I'm just worried about whether or not I can get in - I suspect I appear as a weak candidate and I don't know if I can convince a graduate school to admit me. Another advantage of going back to school is that there are counsellors to talk to. I don't expect it to be of much help, but that's a major goal of mines if I got into grad school. As for doing things like going into the Peace Corps, for one thing not everyone is from the US, but even if I did something like that, there will be the question of "then what?" after I complete my service with them.
 
In summary, I'm aware there is a risk but I don't think going to grad school is a bad idea even if you're not someone that really knows what you want to do. As long as you think there are some areas in your field that you can tolerate. I just think the risk of not going may be worse and I would be questioning myself "why didn't I give grad school a chance?" in the future if I didn't apply now. So I'm going to give it a chance, and hope it works out for me.

anonak, I am in much the same situation as you, I have been unemployed or underemployed for practically the entire time after graduation and this is, on the surface, why I'm applying to go to grad school. It's not really that I'm particularly interested in academia. I'm also a "don't know what I want to do" person - actually, deep down I do have an idea of what I want in life, but it's not something that most people can understand, and I'll leave it at that.
 
I don't really agree with the things Usmivka said - I know in practice, you shouldn't show this "attitude" to grad schools, but this is something about schools and employers for that matter that I really don't agree with. If I go to grad school, pass all the courses, fulfill my requirements, and get a degree, why should it matter whether I have a "direction" or not or whether or not I am super motivated and passionate about the field? If I'm capable of completing a degree, I deserve it. One thing most people don't understand (and I'm not saying that's necessarily the case with anonak) is that for some people it's mentally difficult to feel enjoyment or a lot of emotion towards things.
 
Also, why should anonak be blamed for potentially lying - do you really think all those other applicants and grad students knew exactly what they wanted to do since they were a little kid and are as devoted to their field as they claim in their personal statements? If I was an employer, I would want to hire anonak for her humility and honesty, I like her attitude more the bragging, self-promoting type of personality this society rewards.
 
For me, I am applying to grad school even though I realize I'm taking a risk. You may say you're supposed to "find yourself" then go to grad school, but isn't that the case too when you go for a career in the workforce? I figure the alternative would be to go back to my undergrad and start another Bachelor's all over again, but I feel that would be an even bigger risk in terms of admission as well as completing up to 4 years again vs. a 2 year Master's and the mental impact of knowing you're going backwards not forwards. If I had to do it all over again, I probably wouldn't have gone into my field, but the kind of things that I like relatively more in my field are more research based. So I'm taking a bet that I can find something fulfilling enough in grad school.
 
I'm not worried about going to grad school, I'm pretty confident I can do it. I'm just worried about whether or not I can get in - I suspect I appear as a weak candidate and I don't know if I can convince a graduate school to admit me. Another advantage of going back to school is that there are counsellors to talk to. I don't expect it to be of much help, but that's a major goal of mines if I got into grad school. As for doing things like going into the Peace Corps, for one thing not everyone is from the US, but even if I did something like that, there will be the question of "then what?" after I complete my service with them.
 
In summary, I'm aware there is a risk but I don't think going to grad school is a bad idea even if you're not someone that really knows what you want to do. As long as you think there are some areas in your field that you can tolerate. I just think the risk of not going may be worse and I would be questioning myself "why didn't I give grad school a chance?" in the future if I didn't apply now. So I'm going to give it a chance, and hope it works out for me.

I'll address these point by point from where I'm coming from:
 
A) Getting a PhD requires focused research--pretty hard to do successfully without motivation or direction. Courses are a component, but not the most important. I think the attitude you are describing is a lot more prevalent in undergrad degrees now, and perhaps some professional programs and skill based masters degrees, and to be fair, I just assumed we were talking about a PhD. For better or worse, it is not the attitude that admissions committees (including faculty, admins, and your potential peers--who often get some say in who they want to see admitted) are generally looking for. Why would any of the above want to work with someone who evidences what could easily be construed as apathy and entitlement?
 
B ) Arguably the singular requirement of academia is honesty. If you can't even be honest about why you are there, why should anyone expect you to be ethical in your research practices? So yes, someone who lies should be "blamed" for their actions and grad school is a poor choice for them. If you are ambivalent, don't lie about it. You can still show commitment to a project/program/job even if you have reservations about whether it is the ideal course forward--but if you can't even see how it might help you, why waste the time that you could be doing something enjoyable?
 
This is totally separate from a question of whether it is worth time and effort to get a slip of paper just for the sake of the credential, and whether someone can or should know exactly what they want to do, which is what you seem to connect it to. I don't think anyone hear would suggest that they know 100% what they will do and how it will turn out 5 years in the future, but having solid interests and enthusiasm sure makes it more likely that you'll put out good work and graduate in a timely manner, both of which are important considerations for grad programs. Even the ones you pay your way for are generally "losing" money on you relative to the cost of your education. This really gets back to the point you brought up in A--admissions are limited, and I'd argue that ability is not sufficient to "deserve" (a loaded phrase that I dislike) anything relative to an applicant that is more enthusiastic/committed and also has the ability to contribute positively to their program.
 
C) There are NGOs and NPOs looking for enthusiastic and smart people to help them worldwide. And the OPer is clearly from the US, so this is a red herring regardless.The OPer clearly is excited about such jobs, which include the travel and learning/thinking that they specified as appealing. The "then what" is that these positions provide the experience and CV blurbs to do things in related fields that continue to value and reward the same activities, say, working for the Gates Foundation. Or that they provide some direction to future grad school so that instead of retreading old ground in a field you dislike, you are using your time productively towards a goal in something that you can get some more fulfillment out of than checking off the to do list.
 
Finally, I'd point out that I didn't suggest anything the necessity of "finding yourself" prior to grad school or work, just that grad school wasn't the ideal place to make this happen. The same was true of the OPers teller job, and lots of other situations. The reason I used quotation marks is that it is clearly a cliched, oversimplifying phrase.

I think I'm going to miss a couple of deadlines too, the main problem for me being that some schools require things to be mailed to them and I am experiencing unexpected delays - I mailed a transcript order and my university unexpectedly hasn't even received the form. I underestimated how long it takes for transcripts to be processed/mailed. I wonder if I can get electronic official transcripts to be sent more quickly - IDK if they would accept that at least temporarily. Also I submitted an electronic application for a school, only to realize afterwards the rest of the documents were supposed to be mailed not done electronically. I just hope I don't waste my money applying to schools that won't look at my application because they don't receive mailed transcripts by the deadline. I hope they will be flexible with the deadline if I submit the rest of my application by time, but IDK.
 
Anyway, good luck to you ktwho.

Chances are unlikely at the top schools like U. Waterloo or U. Toronto since you've been out of undergrad and unfortunately because of the unemployment. One of the big factors, like you mentioned, are the reference letters. It might prove difficult for profs. to write strong letters for someone they haven't seen for a few years - of course, this depends entirely on how much interaction you've had with them in undergrad and post-graduation.

Why did you pick computational science specifically? Most of these jobs require a PhD to even be considered for employment or at least want an MS + several years of experience. It seems like your interests are geared more towards research fields than industry so I'd tread carefully because industry jobs might be hard to come by especially since you're not interested in a PhD.

For a Master's only program I'd try to maximize employment outlook by picking relatively broad and established specializations such a software engineering or systems. AI/machine learning aren't bad choices especially given the whole big data and cloud movement. If computational science is absolutely what you want to do then you might want to look at PhD programs instead.