Dr. Old Bill

Wonderful news! Congrats!

I've debated on whether or not to respond to this, as I mostly agree with it. Or rather, I don't disagree, which is admittedly a very small distinction. Nonetheless, I've been thinking about it a lot since it was posted, so I'll just go ahead and say my piece. There is no denying that the market is bad, and quite likely getting worse for all the reasons you mentioned (and more). I've been an avid reader of The Chronicle for the past half year or so, and it is difficult to find anything remotely positive when it comes to Ph.D. outcomes in the humanities in general, and English in particular. These are all valid, factual truths that need to be acknowledged by anyone in our position as English Ph.D. hopefuls. However, even in light of the bleak prospects, I think there are solid reasons to pursue a Ph.D. in English. First of all, assuming that most people enter a program out of a love of most things English and academic, a funded Ph.D. program allows 5-7 years or so of paid immersion in the academic world. The pay is low, of course, and the demands are high...but considering that it is both an education and a de facto academic "job" for several years -- one that is, within reason, relatively secure -- it's not a bad way to spend a few years, particularly when you come out of it with a Ph.D. (even bearing in mind the sizable number of ABD folks). Lest this sound like polyanna optimism, I recognize that from a financial standpoint, and a broader educational standpoint, there are surely "better" ways to spend several years. Yet the initial impulse is a love of the discipline, and that has to count for something, in my opinion. Secondly -- and this is key -- mental and educational preparation for non-academic careers is important. The ideal, of course, is to come out of a Ph.D. program with non-adjunct teaching opportunities. There are countless articles that point to the correlation between better (read: higher ranked by USNews...) Ph.D. programs and better placements, and anyone not getting a Ph.D. at a top ten institution has to be even more realistic about the possibilities. It's a bit better than 50/50 for the top ten (better still for the top six), and worse than 50/50 for the rest...and the quality of placement has an unmistakable correlation with the apparent ranking of the Ph.D. program. Tiers are very much in effect here. So the idea of a "plan B" for post-Ph.D. is even more vital than a plan B for a shutout at this stage. But having said that, you will still be equipped with a Ph.D. While this is not a guarantee that you will inevitably get a higher position than you would with an M.A., there are many benefits, such as higher average pay, additional opportunities to consult or be on boards of directors, and a surprisingly broad range of intangibles that are available to those who are willing to look outside the immediate range of academia. In other words, getting a Ph.D. and having no immediate job placement is not necessarily a reason to avoid going down that path, if you are willing and able to adapt. Third, market forecasts are one thing, the present reality is another, and the future reality in six or seven years is another still. Those of us entering Ph.D. programs in 2015 will be on the job market for 2020 at the absolute earliest (and those will be outliers, really). 2021 - 23 are more likely ranges for the first stab for this cohort. There is no denying the gradual decline of demand for English professors, and the ever-dwindling market at this point. Yet politics and economics are notoriously fickle, and long-range outcomes are difficult to predict, thanks to an ever-shifting landscape. In the unlikely event that Obama's plan to make Community Colleges free for millions goes through, that would have a marked effect on the landscape...and it's hard to say exactly how. Presumably more students would be compelled to enroll in college, and while there have been some valid arguments lately that this would lead more to a "shift" within academia, rather than cause an influx of new hires, it is -- once again -- difficult to predict. The next president could come along and take a Scott Walker-esque approach to higher education, imperiling the academic system even more. Or the next president could come in and make education a number one priority. These are things that will happen (or won't) while we're in the midst of our Ph.D. programs. Frankly, it's unpredictable. That brings me to my final point: no industry is immune to these shifts. Retail seemed safe, until the economic collapse in 2008. Manufacturing? Same story. There are some industries that seem to weather these shifts better than others (there's always a need for health care workers, for instance), but in a broader sense, the job market in general is hit and miss. What's more, it varies by city, state, and country. The bottom line, in my view, is that getting a Ph.D. in English is invariably a risky proposition. The market is slowly shrinking, and we can't see what it's going to be like in six years. Yet if you have the foreknowledge when going into the discipline, and keep yourself informed (i.e., keep your eyes open) while you're going through, you should be better prepared than someone who is going into this field expecting to get a TT job at an R1 institution. What it comes down to is why you are doing this, and what you are willing to get out of it at the end. As someone who is married and in his thirties, I am more than happy to be paid 20 - 30k or so for five or six years to get a Ph.D. in the field I love. The worst that will happen (provided I don't wash out, of course) is that I will have a Ph.D. when I am 41 and be left to say "now what?" But...I'll have that Ph.D., and will have had several years of doing what I enjoy. All of this is to say that ComeBackZinc (and Lifealive) is decidedly not wrong. It just comes down to what we, as individuals, are able to do to best equip ourselves for alternate possibilities when we ultimately graduate.

This is actually a really good idea. I could see myself working part-time and going to a CC part-time to learn another language or two. Hmm...

Awesome news, Morristr! An exciting Saturday sure makes up for yesterday's lackluster Friday!

Yaaaaaay!!! Lovely news!

Hooray, Radcafe!! How awesome! I, too, have run out of upvotes...but I'm thrilled for you!

That would be in my top 10 favorite books of all time, for what it's worth. Rushdie's a little hit and miss, but his hits are amazing. Haroun and the Sea of Stories is a great little novel as well. Almost a Y.A. novella, but delightful for all ages.

That sounds the exact opposite of selfish! Plan Bs are pragmatic, and since I'm normally a pragmatic kind of person, I'm actually a little surprised with myself that I literally gave zero thought to it until I got my UW-Madison rejection. There's nothing like the dose of reality a single rejection provides... I do think it's natural to be able to feel joyous for others while sad for yourself. At least, I know that *I* do sometimes. But yes -- thinking about a plan B is a good way of keeping the joy separate from your own prospects.

While it's probably too soon for any of us to start despairing about our chances of getting in to a program, the reality is that that time is coming up fairly soon. Until very recently, I have given no thought to a plan B. And while I am still mostly confident that I will get in to one of my schools (or as confident as one can be in a process that is mostly subjective and completely out of one's hands at this point...), I think it's time for me to start thinking about contingency plans for if I don't wind up getting in...and I'm guessing the same is true of many of you as well. One option is to find some local unfunded M.A. English programs with relatively late deadlines (I know of a couple reasonably nearby with March deadlines). Another option is to simply look for a full-time job that will take someone with diverse work experience plus a B.A. in English. Either way, I think I'm resolved to applying for Ph.D. programs again next year. Coming into this, I suspected that this would be my "one shot" and that I would give it my all. And while I did give it my all, I think I would try again. It's pricey, and my pride would take a major hit, and I would be undeniably embarrassed by it (warranted or not), but I can't help but think that this is what I really want to do for the rest of my life. I'm old enough to have lived a lot of life, and learned a lot. An academic career is definitely the ideal, and barring that, at least several years of enjoying the academic life. So...how about the rest of you who are in the same boat? Any solid plan B options?

What's great, however, is that he went on to become a Member of Parliament while he was still quite young! It was indeed considered a scandalous novel at the time, but clearly not so scandalous that it affected Lewis' political career. (Imagine the author of 50 Shades of Grey getting elected to the Federal government?) I've moved on to The Two Gentlemen of Verona. I'm about halfway through, and am only moderately enjoying it. I've never been a big fan of Shakespeare's comedies, however. Fortunately I (like most) think many of his tragedies (Coriolanus and Hamlet in particular) are among the best works ever written in English, so it all balances out.

Awesome news, Lycidas! Congratulations!

Wahooo! Congrats, fancypants!!

If only it worked like that! It's been five and a half months since I applied to UMD, and still no word here either! Having said that, it's getting to the time where WashU, UMD, UVA, and a few others traditionally notify. Given the relative quiet of the past couple of days, today could be a big one. Then again, I've said that every Friday, I think. Or maybe I say it every day... (this is probably a sign that I post too often...)

Perfect opportunity to whip out one of my favorite songs by one of my favorite artists... Not to everyone's taste, I'm sure...but it pops into my head whenever someone mentions either wanting or NOT wanting to live in Los Angeles.

Basically a repeat of my last "I wouldn't" post in this thread. It's just too far along in the process, and frankly a paper "under consideration" and a theory group for undergrads aren't really things that will have much of an impact either way. Don't get me wrong -- they're great things for you personally, and for long term C.V. data points...but probably not all that compelling for an adcomm at this point. For what it's worth, I had a paper accepted to an academic journal a few weeks back (albeit an undergraduate journal), and I decided not to email my schools about it. I don't think one publication (or a publication under review, for that matter) will push an app over the edge.

Every person who reads this has to give LyonessRampant an upvote. It's GC law.

I'm just here for the upvotes.

I wouldn't, personally. As frustrating as it is for us as applicants to have to wait...and wait...and wait some more, I think we have to respect the process. You also want to avoid the possibility of becoming "that annoying person who emailed us..." in the eyes of the adcomm. I doubt that would happen. I really do. But by that same token, it's just not worth taking the chance. The wait seems inexorable, but when you talk to graduate hopefuls who aren't on GC, they have very little conception of when they'll be contacted, indicating that GC probably compounds the issue just as it makes it more tolerable. It's almost like GC is the Tree of Knowledge and all of us are cotton-headed Adams and Eves.

So I got a SECOND email from Northwestern this morning, telling me that my status has been updated on their website. Fortunately I was fully expecting the status to be exactly what it was -- confirmation of a rejection -- but it still had an air of an ex-girlfriend calling you after a break-up, just to remind you that you're still broken up...

Woot woot! That's HUGE, Gustav! Congrats!

Gah! I picked a bad day to go to bed early! Congrats ModifiedMolloy, Lycidas, and Margeryhemp on your awesome acceptances! And good luck to you again, Lycidas, on your interview at Columbia!

Fingers crossed for you! For my own part, I've seen little dribs and drabs from UMD and Penn State. Trying not to read into them too much. UMD would be a real coup for me for many reasons, but especially because I already live in the general area, and my wife works relatively close to their campus. Would be the ideal relocation scenario...

Well, I applied to Stanford's English program, and I know they only required UNofficial transcripts. I'm not sure if it's any different for the MTL...or why it would be, for that matter. I understand your concern, though -- nothing's worse than contemplating being DQed on a technicality... I agree with what you are saying, though for the line of study I'm intending, the schools I applied to are demonstrably among the best fits. I did look at lower prestige programs, but very few have solid prosodists on their faculty. Getting an M.A. in the interim would at least give me graduate experience and make me arguably more employable for other fields. Again, it's truly a Plan B. The other option would be getting a low level job for a year and just trying again for 2016...but that might be even more soul-crushing than going the other route. We'll have to see. I really haven't thought about it much, and won't unless / until I get shut out.

I agree. While I don't have a firm "plan B" in mind as yet, if I don't get some good news in the next two or three weeks, I may very well apply to a few local unfunded M.A .programs with March or April deadlines. It's not what I want to do -- not by a long shot -- but it would be a sidestep with the aim of applying for Ph.D. programs again next year. Otherwise, it will probably be a case of finding a job / career that is possible with nothing but a B.A.