waytooold
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Posts posted by waytooold
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Hey folks, thanks for the kind words, but I'm really old for this game...not the "old" that some thirty year olds say. My youngest is finishing up law school, I am over 50 -- well, you get it. This process has sucked up my hopes and dreams for 7 months, time I won't get back -- and I just can't afford to pile my efforts into something with such a low probability of any positive return. But...I have two published books, speak nationally, command awesome fees to consult and facilitate...I won't be sitting in some hovel turning gray. In fact, I might just see some of you along the way. Best of luck.
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Thought I'd pop in and say goodbye. Not sure what derailed me so badly, except perhaps a bit of naivete about the poor quant score, my age and my time away from academia. I am waitlisted at my first choice, but I'd say my odds are very, very poor, with two spots to fill and three people in front of me. Got rejected by UC today and am awaiting one more from a school that never so much as acknowledged my application, no less interviewed me...so I'm out. Given my age, this was kind of my last shot to get into a PhD program, so I'm looking out to see what my next step is.
Best of luck to all of you. It's been a long, strange journey.
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Me. I'm too old. Oh no one has said that directly. Instead I'm told my potential career is too short, I wouldn't attract enough funding. Or - why would I want to go to grad school anyway when I could just get a (another) job. Or - it's wonderful that you went back to university for undergrad but isn't it best if you let the young ones have their chance and not take a scarce position (that could generate funding !!)
Sucks to be old.
I feel your pain. I really thought 20 years of applied work, two books, national speaking and deep knowledge would get me somewhere, but what I got was "you really don't want to do this, do you?" Ummmm....did you read my SOP? Do you think I sat for the GRE after no math for twenty years for FUN? My favorite was "Well, your verbal score would increase our mean by a significant amount, but your age would REALLY increase our mean."
So I have a waitlist, a reject, an implied reject and waiting on two more schools I have heard not a peep from, so unlikely to be accepts. Oh well, at least I have not yet closed down my consulting practice.
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After testing, writing, gathering LOR's from professors who were kind enough to look at twenty year old transcripts, stamping, mailing, notarizing and confirming, I find the application process sorely wanting. I don't think any of the items below are unreasonable, and I would more than love to hear an institution argue against such things being the simplest of civil society behavior and more than manageable, yet in my experience thus far, these things are sadly rare.
1. Applications should be acknowledged by e-mail or letter.
2. Inquiries as to whether the application is complete should be responded to before the application deadline, unless program has posted a statement that no news= a complete application, and means it. In particular, programs that state that students are responsible for inquiring as to the completeness of their application should have sufficient resources to respond to such inquiries prior to the deadline.
3. If the program assures people they will receive some sort of notification by X date, this should be true.
4. Programs should post or communicate status of the application process 60 days after the deadline, with weekly updates.
What would you add, keeping it reasonable and realistic?
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I've got mixed emotions on Affirmative Action. On the one hand I think it's insulting that my race could matter more than my intellect and hard work. On the other hand, there's a disparity in race in academia and successful examples of AA do exist, eg the policies enacted in South Africa after the end of apartheid.
Affirmative action and "diversity" is being discussed by academics. I offer one data point drawn from a top-tier public institution, the University of Texas at Austin:
A cross-disciplinary consortium was held recently. One discussion point, among others, was "Why affirmative action and traditional “recruitment” efforts by graduate schools can only be part of a solution, and won’t by themselves be effective." -- https://webspace.ute..._diversify.html
Participating schools in this consortium included: Stanford, Ohio State, University of Wisconsin-Madison, Brown, North Carolina State University, the American Psychological Association, University of Indiana, University of Nevada, University of Maryland, the American Chemical Society, University of Iowa, Pittsburgh, University of Illinois, The Scripps Research Institute, University North Carolina, Rochester Institute of Technology, St. Olaf, and the Mayo Clinic.
I appreciate the link and the largely civil discussion. Just a comment that since Bakke, the administration of affirmative action in University admissions is not a matter of all or nothing-- it recognizes a variety of factors and weights. The goal of diversifying the academy, which at this time in society cannot rely ENTIRELY on merit is worthy. The individual consequence that you or I might be displaced by an equally qualified person who is give a bit of advantage due to identity is, as an earlier poster said, probably the same feeling others have heard when we have gotten the edge due to privilege or majority status. Creating an equal society can't always make the majority happy.
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Heh, yeah, this site can do that to ya.
Of course we have a shot!
PM me if you want to know my exact location...I will say I'm in a city that has a pretty good hockey team. 
More than a shot..a proven track record and a need to avenge for the women's result!
...someone who lives in a city where 40 year old men still have their high school hockey sticks hanging in their home.
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Hahaha same here! But I am guessing with this year's competition no news is good news
But if I knew this before, I would have definitely applied to few of those with early notifications... if you do not mind I would join your party...
I cannot visit (international) but I will definitely have good long talks with professors before I commit (of course if given the choice..
) I think that fit and probably feel are the most important things....so I would always suggest visiting all the schools that gave you offers before committing if there is any chance to do so. well..till we have some choices to stress about..
I cannot wait!!Midwest -- when lurking on TM I assumed you were a flyover land compatriot! Where are you located?
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http://www.insidehighered.com/news/2009/03/30/phd
We're in a year with record numbers of apps and shrinking opportunities.
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Sigh. Choices are nice.
I'm having a silly little why-did-I-apply-to-schools-notifying-in-March pity party here....now that it's out of my system......I can hardly imagine committing to 4 or more years in intense relationships and focused work someplace without visiting. "Feel,""Fit" and "Culture" are ephemeral in some ways, and require the experience of being there, IMHO. I'd find a way to spend even a half day anyplace I was considering.
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double post, sorry
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Deep cleansing breaths, everyone.
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At the end of a recent interview, I was told that I would receive a decision from the program within two weeks. And then I was handed a student handbook. What do you think this means? Do they give out student handbooks to applicants they may still reject?
May I ask the schools you are looking at? PM me if you are comfortable. Our names and interests seem to overlap:)
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Schools make these offers to preserve a high yield rate and maintain numbers that will preserve their selectivity.
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I submitted all of my apps in November. NOVEMBER!!!! No news yet, but no one has heard from any of my programs, and most have now said notification in March. Too much food, wine and wasted internet time. Even knowing there won't be news for two more weeks does not stop me from checking, and checking, and checking. Sigh.
ETA -- I find it comforting to read and re-read my SOP's and confirm I put my best effort out there.
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Well, the good news is that I have three auditions/interviews coming up for MFA Directing programs. For two, I will be directing short scenes in front of the faculty and for the other I am presenting my directorial approach to the first scene in Macbeth. Obviously, as these are coming up in a week or so, I'm feverishly preparing my director's book, etc. But I'm also concerned about attire. Every article I read online about grad school interview attire seems to be geared towards business or the sciences. I'll actually be 'getting my hands dirty' and leading a rehearsal - I'm guessing a suit isn't the most appropriate thing to wear. For my initial, sit-down interview with one of these schools, I dressed up and felt a little out of place as they were also having undergrad auditions for their program in the same location and everyone was running around in jeans and dance clothes. Even the professor who interviewed me wasn't dressed up, so I'm wondering if a casual look would work out better for this stage. The last thing I want to do is give off the impression that I don't care enough to dress up, but at the same time, I want to look appropriate. I also feel like this should be the last thing on my mind at this stage - please HELP!
I would be business casual. Without making assumptions about your gender, here is what I'd recommend: Male, wear Khakis or Cords with a button down shirt, but not a dress shirt. Wear comfortable but not beaten up shoes.
For a woman, black pants, long sleeved t-shirt with a sweater over or casual blazer over, and scarf to dress it up. Shed the top layer if you're working really hard. That's my advice, FWIW.
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I've applied to Texas A&M, Virginia Tech and GA Tech for their MS programs. I already got a nice soft reject from Princeton. Waiting it out very impatiently. Anyone else in the same boat? Any news? Everything is dead on my side, very frustrating.
I must admit, there is some awful joke that wants to be made by this non-scientist. Something on the order of "admissions ain't rocket science..." but I will refrain
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I'm applying to business PhD programs and have had two direct admits and five post-interview admits. Even though interviews seem to be relatively common in this field not hearing anything definitely doesn't mean you're doomed!
Very, very impressive. Congratulations on your results. I am applying to two HR/OD programs and three Business/Management PhD programs, none overlapping with yours, except Illinois, and there I applied to HR/LR, not biz.
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I am interested in how often there are "direct acceptances," from ad comm to notification. Let's hear about your experiences.
I need something to do for the next 30 days while I'm waiting, like, for instance, assuming silence does not mean condemnation to the "no" pile.
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My new theory, having had so many calls and e-mails go unanswered is that they are just getting us ready for the incivility and non professionalism of life in the academy.
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My God. I have said this over and over and over again, how influential the GRE is depends on the school and progam you are applying to. I have no delusions about what the GRE is and isn't. My school of thought is that if you are serious about applying, WHY in the world would you not try to do your absolute best to get a great score? The GRE is so incredibly teachable. If you put in the time to figure out the test, there should be NO surprises come test day.
I hear so many humanities applicants who complain that math isn't in their field. You don't know how to add? Multiply? Subtract? I mean, there is nothing on the Q section that a 7th grader hasn't seen before. It doesn't matter if you aren't studying a technical subject. Even if you are studying Renaissance Art, it doesn't mean that you can't put in the effort to refresh on basic mathematical concepts and get at least an average score. Again, the GRE is not always about how "smart" you are, but about how much effort you put into it.
Consider that several Stanford Engineering programs have an average Verbal score of over 90th percentile. Also consider the number of international applicants from Asia, who probably don't have a high grasp of English, that are admitted. The fact that so many engineers, both domestic and international, achieved an average verbal score of over 90th percentile tells me that they put in the effort to study and that Stanford seemed to care enough to accept a pool of applicants who did well on a subject irrelevant to the program itself. Whether this is causal vs correlation is to be debated.
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PS You misused the word "verbose." It does not have a positive connotation.
I'm not sure what compels me to enter these toxic waters, but the statement above is maddeningly skewed. First of all, the 90th percentile in verbal requires a far, far, far lower raw score overall than the analytical...why? Because the greater proportion of those taking the GRE are people working in the sciences and math....thus to perform very well in that population on the analytical requires a VERY high raw score (let's for arguments sake say you need a 9/10), while a comparatively low score (lets say 6/10) puts you in the 90th verbally. As far as those of us you imply don't put in the effort...like me, who scored in the 99th percentile verbally but poorly in the quantitative? I put in plenty of effort, and my algebra skills are decent, but I do not know geometry and have not used anything but simple arithmetic in over 20 years. The first time I took it I got 300, and doubled my score in the 6 weeks I prepped. Had I gotten the raw score on my verbal that I did on my math, it would put me in the 80th percentile, but because SO MANY PEOPLE SKILLED AT MATH take the GRE, it put me in more like the 60th. Think about this. And by the way, my 800 on the verbal? Effortless. I could say something snotty about people simply needing to read a little literature or a newspaper, or that if they had done their vocab in grade school they'd do fine, but I realize that we have different strengths. So stop with the "it is so easy" stuff, and reocgnize the population that being measured.
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Congrats on an acceptance. Still waiting for just a crumb of contact here. Most of my programs are March 15 notifications, it appears. Hopefully, that means POI's will start reaching out in the next week or so. Or not.
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I maintain that MN is not fit for habitation 6 months out of the year.
And I agree. Also after reading "Stumbling on Happiness" I'm inclined to think that one should pay attention to the students in the program as we are woefully poor at judging what will make us happy. Are they having the experience you hope to have, however you define that? For me, I wanted to see engaged, scholar-activists that seem to be enjoying the ride.
Too bad you're allergic to cold climates and in a different field. I think you'd be great to have in my cohort...if I get one. And I'll even concede on the ridiculous of MN winters.
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I have to smile just a little at the irony of the discussion of weather. When you live in Minneapolis, it is pretty hard to find anyplace colder or snowier. When I visited Ithaca, everyone wanted to engage me about the winters until I reminded them where I live. I have checked a few times. When we were -20 here, they were +19 there. Tropical anyone?
I think fit is partially intuitive -- you will just, in many cases, know....but I think culture is something you have to look for; are advisors active and involved, or are people left to sink or swim? How responsible will you be for shaping your program, and how much help or mentoring will you get? What kind of access and unstructured contact will you have? How big is your cohort? How do you fit with your cohort? Finally, on the days you are tired of being a student, sick with a cold and wondering why you did this -- can you find a place to live that will help you feel grounded and renew, or are you so stretched that you are living with 5 people you barely know?
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Why not? Nothing wrong with using it, or airing my concerns, just as others have done in this thread.
The term is provocative and suggestive of some sort of shared "agenda" amongst a population that is as diverse as the people on this board. It is a term intended to suggest that homosexuality is a political or "lifestyle" choice instead of a core identity against which bigotry and bias is still permitted to flourish. It is a term invented by those who reduce one's sexual identity to a political choice. That is why.
- repatriate, waytooold, NorthernStar and 5 others
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A bizarre grad strategy -- working backwards from my GRE
in GRE/GMAT/etc
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I am still reeling from my straight rejections last year for PhD programs. The things working against me are my age (50 ish) my lack of quantitative research experience (but published in the non academic world and tons of qualitative experience) and a complete lack of mathematical dexterity. I am now thinking differently -- I had been applying to PhD programs in Org Behavior, now I think I need to get a second Masters, maybe in org behavior or in a field like sociology or anthropology. The catch is, I need money. Lots of money. So, here is my deal: I have an 800 V, 6AW and...hold on....a 590 quant. What kinds of programs don't really look at quant, or view the verbal score as an indicator of ability? This probably sounds foolish, but I really don't want to put as much effort into apps as I did last year and find myself out the time, money and emotion. Anyone's thoughts would be most welcome.